My pH rise has been quicker than usual, so today I did a full chemistry check.:
FC 9. CC 0. pH 7.8 (I added acid to reduce to 7.6 2 days ago), TA 90, CH 425, CYA 60, SALT 2900, BOR 25, Water Temp 89, Calculated CSI 0.21

CYA is 60, lower than my normal 70-80. With water temp regularly going above 90, a reduction in CYA is not unusual. Adding 4.25 lbs CYA...I use a version of the sock method using a very fine mesh net and place it in front of my old pressure side pool cleaner wall socket with the pressure side pump turned on. CYA is already gone! It took about 1 hour! See pictures below.

TA is 90. It was 70 early in the season but is creeping up. I know this is driving the pH rise. We have not had significant rain for several months; my water additions are driving my TA up. My CA (carbonate Alkalinity is around 65, which puts my pH ceiling around 8.25. I added a gallon of MA (which lowers TA by 20) and I'm running my submersible pump as a fountain to raise pH. I think I'm going to have to do it again to get my TA way down before I up my Borates from ~25 to 50. With the CYA fixed and TA fixed, my CA should be around 38, with a pH ceiling of 8.0.

CH is 425. The real worrisome thing is my rising CH. Again, the constant water evaporation and water adds are also driving this. I'm up to 425 and it is only mid-July. I really do not want to do a drain...But with the SWG, I am always concerned about scaling. CSI is up to 0.21 with a pH of 7.8! This is why I'm attacking the TA. It looks like I may need to run a slightly lower pH to keep CSI slightly negative. If I get my TA to 70 and my keep my CYA at 80, I now need to adjust pH at 7.8. Looks like my new target pH is 7.6 when the pH gets to 7.9.

I have a feeling that a 25% drain and refill is in my future...And then I have to FIX the chemistry again....

Modified Sock method:




Cheesey Submersible Pump Fountain

Little introduction/backstory- Last year, wife drug home a small Intex from Wal-Mart. It was fine. We decided we liked being summer-time pool people. We bought a floater and a bucket of chlorine tabs and let 1 tab a week float around, and that was fine and dandy. Had a net for skimming out leaves, dead bugs, etc. No problem. Added a 21" sand filter w/ 1.5HP pump to replace that stock cartridge filter that comes with the cheap AGPs. A year later, our child has grown and we wanted a bigger/deeper pool for all the neighborhood kids, relatives, friends that come around to be able to play/swim/float whatever. This year, got an Intex 32x16. Same sand filter/pump. Filled our new pool with the garden hose from city water for 2 days (approx 14,000 gallons). We are looking to swim until September, after that, probably time to start winding down.

July 5th, took 1st water sample to pool store to see what I needed to do to have our pool be nice and clean for the summer. They sold me everything I needed. Gave me a print-out from BioGuard, with a weekly plan and all kinds of good stuff. Sunday, I added my shock, clarifier and algaecide. Monday, took a sample in and they told me I had too much CL, not enough TA.... So, bought more stuff (12lb bag of baking soda, BioGuard Chem-Out) to fix all that. Now, after studying on TFP, I realize my CL level was fine for my CYA level of 63.

So, today, I did a water test, using my Exact EZ photometer. CYA was 79, CL was 2.75. Added TFP given amount of bleach to get FC up to reccomended range.

Part of what is frustrating me, is all the different "reccomended" water parameters. BioGuard, from my pool store says my water should be 1 way, I see Leslie's print-outs online for other owners with different parameters. The TFP app on my phone is telling me something totally different.

Questions I have now: do I need to shock the pool weekly? Should I have my 3" chlorine tab floating in the pool to keep FC levels above my CYA minimum? Our Intex return has an aerator built into it. We let our pump run 24/7 so the water is constantly being aerated. Is that bad?

For now, I am done with the pool store and just going to use the TFP app on my phone to get my water where it says to be.

If you read through all of that and got to this part- Thank you! Sometimes you just need to vent!

The pool store had me dumping crazy amounts of shock into pool last year.it was calcium hypo and created all sorts of promblems until winter showed up and I gave up. I’m seeing too high of chlorine can damage. Question is what do I look for? I have something on the walls I thought was scale now I’m wondering if it’s something else?

First-time pool builder, building a 20x50 vinyl liner pool from a royal pools kit. I had the hole dug before the snow came. Built the steps on Thanksgiving. Tried building a section of wall that was then blown over with the first snowstorm.

Spring is finally here, I'm taking a break from work and getting started! I got the walls up Saturday and now am slowly squaring, leveling and plumbing the walls. Hopefully I get that done this week, main drains set so I can pour the concrete collar to lock it in. The goal is a pool party for Memorial Day. Wish me luck.

Also, quick poll: I am planning on documenting each step as I go. Better to have a whole bunch of small posts or 1 master post on it?

I've decided on the following equipment/automation.

This is our third year needing to SLAM the pool. Each time we have opened, pool has zero chlorine and likely 0 CYA (black dot doesnt disappear when testing for CYA). I put the CYA granulars in a sock in the skimmer and it typically takes days to dissolve. I know that CYA needs to be 30-40 to keep from wasting the chlorine. Is it proper to wait for the CYA to get where it needs to be, or given that this pool needs lots of chlorine anyway in the SLAM process, is it okay and not wasteful to go ahead and start getting my chlorine in there?

Many thanks.

This thread explores some of the ways that Cyanuric Acid (CYA) can degrade since many users report seeing CYA drop under various conditions.

CYA Degradation by Bacteria

Some pool users find that their CYA levels drop over the winter when their pool is let go (i.e. no chlorine added). Many of these pools have algae, but some do not. The degradation pathway for CYA by some bacteria and fungi (normally under anaerobic conditions) is well understood and described here (an early article describing the degradation but incorrectly attributing urea as an intermediate is in this paper while the correct pathway is described in this paper). In summary, it is the following:

CYA + 2H₂O --> Biuret + H⁺ + HCO₃^-
Biuret + H₂O --> Allophanate^- + NH₃ + H⁺
Allophanate^- + H⁺ + H₂O --> 2NH₃ + 2CO₂

so the net result is:

CYA + 4H₂O --> H⁺ + HCO₃^- + 3NH₃ + 2CO₂
Cyanuric Acid + Water --> Hydrogen Ion + Bicarbonate Ion + Ammonia + Carbon Dioxide

For every mole of CYA, 3 moles of ammonia are produced. This is equivalent to 10 ppm CYA producing 3.26 ppm ammonia (measured as ppm Nitrogen). Sometimes the ammonia will dissipate (probably outgas or get consumed by algae) over time, but any leftover ammonia would appear as unusual chlorine demand upon opening and take a LOT of chlorine to get rid of. For every 10 ppm CYA that is degraded and produces around 3 ppm ammonia, it would take nearly 30 ppm cumulative FC to get rid of (see this thread and this thread). One can buy an inexpensive ammonia test kit from a pet/fish/aquarium store.

Because ammonia has an equilibrium with ammonium cation (NH₄⁺) with a pKa of around 9.2 in pool water (accounting for ionic strength), the net result is that the pH rises from the above reaction of CYA degradation as shown below (and the pH actually goes up even more than shown since the primary starting species is cyanurate ion):

CYA + 6H₂O --> 2OH^- + HCO₃^- + 3NH₄⁺ + 2CO₂
Cyanuric Acid + Water --> Hydroxyl Ion + Bicarbonate Ion + Ammonium Ion + Carbon Dioxide

Some of the carbon dioxide may dissolve in the water to form carbonic acid so if that occurred completely then the following would be the result:

CYA + 6H₂O --> 3HCO₃^- + 3NH₄⁺
Cyanuric Acid + Water --> Bicarbonate Ion + Ammonium Ion

In the above situation, the pH does not change very much, perhaps rising some since the starting species is actually cyanurate ion, not CYA as shown. The TA rises as well.

H₂CY^- + 7H₂O --> 3HCO₃^- + 3NH₄⁺ + OH^-
Cyanurate Ion + Water --> Bicarbonate Ion + Ammonium Ion + Hydroxyl Ion

[EDIT]
This paper and this paper describe some of the anaerobic conditions and rates for oxidation of CYA into carbon dioxide and ammonia. Under certain conditions, there are two mechanisms by which bacteria can further oxidize ammonia or ammonium ion. The first is nitrification which is an aerobic process (i.e. requiring oxygen) with two types of bacteria with the following examples shown to produce nitrate (the Nitrosomonas bacteria in the first reaction can also use ammonium ion):

Nitrosomonas Bacteria: 2NH₃ + 3O₂ --> 2NO₂^- + 2H⁺ + 2H₂O
Nitrobacter Bacteria: 2NO₂^- + O₂ --> 2NO₃^-

The second is an oxygen-limited autotrophic nitrification-denitrification (OLAND) which combines the nitrification of nitrosomonas bacteria (above) or other sources of nitrite or nitrate with subsequent denitrification under anaerobic conditions. Nitrate and nitrite are used in place of oxygen for metabolic processes. Three conditions are required for significant denitrification: low oxygen, high nitrate concentration, and a supply of organic carbon. Pseudomonas aeruginosa is an example of denitrifying bacteria. The following are half-reactions where the other half is the oxidation of organic material.

NO₃^- + 2H⁺ + 2e^- --> NO₂^- + H₂O
NO₂^- + 2H⁺ + e^- --> NO + H₂O
2NO + 2H⁺ + 2e^- --> N₂O + H₂O
N₂O + 2H⁺ + 2e^- --> N₂ + H₂O

There is also anaerobic ammonium oxidation (annamox) to produce nitrogen gas.

Annamox Bacteria: NH₄⁺ + NO₂^- --> N₂(g) + 2H₂O

So each stage of bacterial degradation after the initial one to create ammonia lowers the chlorine demand as follows.
10 ppm CYA --> 3.07 ppm Ammonia nitrogen --> 24-30 ppm FC chlorine demand left to oxidize ammonia
3.07 ppm Ammonia nitrogen --> 3.07 ppm Nitrite nitrogen --> 16 ppm FC chlorine demand left to oxidize nitrite
3.07 ppm Nitrite nitrogen --> 3.07 ppm Nitrate nitrogen --> 0 ppm FC chlorine demand left
3.07 ppm Nitrite or Nitrate nitrogen --> Nitrogen gas --> 0 ppm FC chlorine demand left

So while the Nitrosomonas bacteria somewhat reduce the chlorine demand, it is the combination of that bacteria with Nitrobacter or with denitrifying bacteria or annamox bacteria that reduce the chlorine demand to zero. Of course, there will still be some chlorine demand from needing to oxidize the bacteria itself.
[END-EDIT]

CYA Degradation by Oxidation from Chlorine

Though the above can explain a loss of CYA when bacteria are allowed to grow, such as when chlorine is not added over the winter, it does not explain why some pools also experience a loss of CYA over the summer or during other times when chlorine is present and bacteria should not be growing. There is oxidation reaction of Cyanuric Acid by Hypochlorite Ion described by John A. Wojtowicz in the Journal of the Swimming Pool and Spa Industry (JSPSI) Volume 4, Number 2, pp. 23-28 (2001) reprinted in "The Chemistry and Treatment of Swimming Pool and Spa Water" in Chapter 5.3 "Oxidation of Cyanuric Acid with Hypochlorite". [EDIT] This is now available online here. [END-EDIT]

2(HNCO)₃ + 9ClO^- ---> 3N₂ + 6CO₂ + 9Cl^- + 3H₂O
Cyanuric Acid + Hypochlorite Ion --> Nitrogen Gas + Carbon Dioxide + Chloride Ion + Water

[EDIT] On a molar basis, 4.5 chlorine oxidize 1 CYA. On a ppm basis this is 2.47 ppm FC for every 1 ppm CYA. [END-EDIT]

The primary step is the cleavage of the triazine ring and it is proposed by Wojtowicz that this primarily involves a fully chlorinated isocyanurate species Cl₂CY^-. The decomposition was first order with respect to average chlorine and increased with pH. The decomposition rate was a decrease in Free Chlorine at a rate of 0.0147 per hour or 1-EXP(-0.0147*24) = 30% per day while the calculated rate of loss of CYA at 4 ppm FC was 0.87 ppm per day [EDIT] (I get 4*0.30/2.47 = 0.49 ppm CYA per day) [END-EDIT], but that was at FC/CYA ratios (in ppm units) of 0.34 (close to shock levels) whereas the more typical ratio in our pools is around 0.1. His experiments at lower FC/CYA ratios of 0.029 with 4 ppm FC and 138 ppm CYA showed a lower CYA decomposition rate of 0.24 ppm/day which is a factor of 3.6 lower. At 4 ppm FC and 11.76 ppm CYA (a ppm ratio of 0.34), the concentration of Cl₂CY^- (at temp 85F) is a factor of 9.9 higher while HClCY^- is a factor of 6.9 higher than the concentrations at 4 ppm FC and 138 ppm CYA which might mean that HClCY^- is the rate-critical species that degrades (this is speculation on my part). In another paper "Effect of Cyanuric Acid on Swimming Pool Maintenance" (in the same JSPSI collection), Wojtowicz describes a chlorine loss rate due to oxidation of CYA at 12.5% per day at 85F which is roughly consistent with a 30%/3.6 = 8.3% rate especially since his 12.5% number came from FC levels starting higher (5.4 ppm for indoor pools, 7.6 to 9.2 ppm for outdoor pools). So, assuming a CYA loss rate of around 0.4 ppm/day in our pools this comes to 12 ppm per month which is clearly enough to be noticeable as the months pass during a swim season. If one shocks the pool, then the rate of loss could be about 2-3 times faster.

Wojtowicz also shows a strong temperature dependence on the chlorine oxidation of cynauric acid where every 10F increase in temperature results in roughly doubling the rate of degradation. So his data was with pools at 85F so pools at 90F could have degradation rates about 1.4 times higher.

The thing is that some of what Wojtowicz has seen does not seem to be consistent with some of what we have seen in our own pools, especially with regard to chlorine loss rates. Wojtowicz implies that there is little breakdown from sunlight of the chlorinated isocyanrates -- that only hypochlorous acid and especially hypochlorite ion are affected. Yet the experiments mas985 (Mark) made showed that higher levels of CYA did protect chlorine better in a non-linear way in sunlight and he did not see losses overnight (that is, without sunlight) which Wojtowicz saw in indoor pools. My own pool is at 86-90F and is exposed to sunlight 1-2 hours most days (it has an opaque electric safety cover on most of the time) and about a 1 ppm FC per day loss which includes use of the pool (1 person bather load most days). The rate of chlorine loss from oxidation of CYA is, in ppm units, about 2.5 times higher so even if I assume 1 ppm FC loss per day all oxidizing CYA, that would be 0.4 ppm CYA loss per day or 12 ppm per month. I should be able to measure that as I started with 30 ppm CYA when I opened and added more CYA around April/May. [EDIT] I just measured my pool's CYA level and it's a little above 25 ppm so even attributing a 5 ppm CYA drop over 3 months, that's pretty low and could be explained by the error tolerance of the test or some by splash-out (I have an oversized cartridge filter that is only cleaned once a year so the only dilution is from splash-out). It's certainly not near 12 ppm per month of loss. [END-EDIT]

So I can see that it is possible for CYA to degrade slowly over time in pools that are at higher temperature or at higher FC/CYA ratios such as extensive periods of shocking. The inconsistency is in how much degradation is occurring from sunlight vs. oxidation from chlorine.

CYA Degradation by Hydroxyl Radicals From Chlorine Breakdown in Sunlight

As described in this post, when chlorine (hypochlorous acid or hypochlorite ion) breaks down in sunlight, hydroxyl radicals are produced. This paper describes why CYA is not broken down quickly by hydroxyl radicals, but this paper demonstrates that CYA is broken down by hydroxyl radicals (though not via titanium dioxide because adsorption is required to be close to such radical generation). So it is possible that CYA is broken down slowly in pools exposed to sunlight. Some report rates of around 10 ppm CYA per month which is higher than the roughly 2-3 ppm CYA per month seen in pools not exposed to sunlight (or the 5 ppm CYA per month seen in hot spas) which would be the degradation rate from chlorine oxidation of CYA.

Richard

Between the help I have received from this page and the Facebook group that sent me this way, I am happy to announce, we can FINALLY enjoy our pool for the remainder of the pool season. After many hours of work, frustration and tons of money and learning a bunch of pool info that I never knew, I am certain it will be a lot easier and cheaper to maintain clear water now.
And I'm LOVING my TF100 test kit!

Borates - Why and How

Why

Adding borates can improve your experience with your pool, but is completely optional. If you do plan to use borates, wait until everything else is settled down before adding borates, especially TA and PH. The only situations where we specifically recommend using borates are for pools with a negative edge or other very large water feature creating huge amounts of aeration and for spas using the dichlor and then bleach method. All that said, borates have proven popular with a fair number of people.

Pros

• More stable PH
• Helps prevent algae
• Helps prevent scaling in a SWG cell
• Silky water feel
• More sparkle

Like baking soda, borates help stabilize the PH. Unlike baking soda, borates do not also put upward pressure on the PH. Larger quantities of an acid or base are required to make a given PH change with borates as compared to without borates. When your PH tends to drift up, borates don't change the amount of acid you need to use, but they do allow you to add acid less often. They also allow you to lower your TA level more than you could otherwise, reducing the upward pressure on PH.

Borates help prevent algae. Borates won't completely prevent algae from growing, but they do slow down algae growth and make it easier to kill off when you do get algae.

The silky feel and added sparkle are subjective. Not everyone notices these benefits. However, most people do appreciate the change.

Cons

• Additional expense
• Concerns about risks to pets
• Not a magical potion to solve all pool woes

In all cases, you should train your pets to not drink from the pool. There are various chemicals in the pool that pose some risk to pets. Dogs that get all of their drinking water from the swimming pool should still not show any symptoms from borates. However, they would be close to the threshold for showing symptoms, rather than 1/100th the level for showing symptoms, as would be required for human safety.


How

We recommend maintaining borates between 30 and 50 ppm. That normally means raising the borate level to around 50 each spring, so that it will still be above 30 come fall.

Before you start on borates, adjust your TA level toward the low end of the appropriate range for your pool type. See the Recommended Levels chart for appropriate levels. It is easier, and better, to adjust TA before adding borates than it will be after.

There are two approaches to adding borates to the pool: boric acid, or a combination of Borax and muriatic acid. Using boric acid is just slightly more expensive, in most cases, and much easier. Borax and muriatic acid takes more effort and handling that much acid is just slightly risky, but saves just a little money (if you shop carefully).

In either case you can use PoolMath to calculate the quantities required.

Boric Acid

Boric acid can be purchased from DudaDiesel and The Chemistry Store. Granular is much easier to work with than powdered. Technical grade is fine.

Boric acid can be distributed across the surface of the pool. Keep the pump running for at least one hour after adding boric acid, and then test the PH and adjust if needed. Boric acid will just slightly lower the PH. Usually the PH change is small enough that no further adjustment is required.

Borax and Muriatic Acid

Borax and muriatic acid can be found at grocery stores and hardware stores respectively. Make sure you double check the strength of the muriatic acid, using half strength acid when you thought it was full strength can lead to problems with PH.

When adding to the pool, you add one gallon of 31.45% muriatic acid, followed by 3 1/2 boxes of Borax, use PoolMath to verify the amount and double check the weight on the box. (For pools smaller than 10,000 gallons it is better to add a half gallon of acid followed by about 1 3/4 boxes of borax each time.) Acid should be poured slowly in front of a return jet with the pump running. Borax can be pre-dissolved in a bucket and then poured slowly in front of a return.

That process is then repeated until you have added the correct total amounts to the pool. The final dose will, of course, be smaller. If you see any undissolved borax, brush the entire pool to help mix it in and get it to dissolve.

24 hours later, test the PH and adjust as needed.

Testing

None of the available borate tests are especially precise. Fortunately, the exact level is not critical and just needs to be in the 30 to 50 ppm range. We recommend using LaMotte Insta-Test Borate Test Strips. They aren't great, but they seem to be the best available choice that isn't wildly expensive.

I went to WMT yesterday to buy some Pool Essentials 10% liquid chlorine. Most of the jugs were dated 22 018! They had 7 that were 22 157, so I bought all of those.

Remember, always check the date on the liquid chlorine that you buy!

Ok so everybody in my circle of friends and family thinks I am crazy. The pool is sparkling blue. You can see a potato bug at the bottom of the 10ft deep end and it sparkles in the light... but I am convinced it feels sticky! When I get on my float instead of sliding across it, you stick. Chemicals are perfectly balanced. I was thinking this could be low PH but PH is 7.6. Calcium Hardness perhaps?? Borates?? How can I make my water feel silky?? Am I just nuts??

Hey everyone. I am new to proper pool ownership (second season pool owner...last year just threw shock and chlorine tabs at it)...I am using cheap HTH test strips and have found that my alkalinity and of course PH levels are off the charts. I dumped 1 gallon of muriatic acid in it and tested after a few hours with the pump running. It did not decrease. I dumped a second gallon in and still no change. I have ordered the TF-100 test kit and it is on its way, but says it won't be here for 1 week. I am calling on the experts. What do I do until l can get this tested properly? Kids are begging to get in the pool. My nearest pool center to test water is 30+ minutes away.

I am attaching a picture of the test strip, but I don't currently have access to the color chart on the test strip package, but they are HTH brand if that helps anyone. ** I know my chlorine levels are low, but wanted to get the alkalinity an PH in order before i dumped all the chlorine down the drain...

Hello I have just completed the SLAM process and have a clear pool. Now I am trying to get it all balanced. My levels are FC-0, CH-425, TA-200, Cya-0. Thank you.

Gotta step up the pool game! With all the rain, valve jenga (see "I dropped a rock in my skimmer" thread), and swim lessons (two in swim diapers)+ kiddie practice, pool was clear this morning, but not sparkling. Numbers were ok, so I just bumped chlorine a bit, planning a "mini slam" for after the swim lessons and swim time were done. Then we got almost 4 inches of rain in about 2 hours. Draining now, anticipating doing a full suite of tests and rebalancing (and bringing FC to just above target range) once the pool level is back to normal.
I'm glad TFP has given me the tools I need to be confident in maintaining the pool. 3 years of pool ownership helps, too! I really do know my pool.

Ok so I’m going to commit TFP heresy and ask a question that I’m sure I’ll get torn to shreds over, but I’m going to ask it anyway… if you have an over-sized SWCG, why do you need CYA? I know all the science behind it, but if you’re continuously producing chlorine and you’re running it during the day, and you can maintain sufficient levels, what’s the problem with going without it?

The main reason I ask is that I’m constantly adding it in the summer months due to high water exchange from daily afternoon Florida rains. If I’m okay with using the extra power and wear and tear on the cell, is there any other reason to use CYA?

[Looks up from the podium at the angry mob.] Are those stones I see?

Luc

Hello all...it's been a minute since I have visited...& am again surprised about how much the site has improved from content to appearance...congrats to whoever is responsible for a job well done. I suspect that would be a collaboration type congrats. Thanks for continuing to make our pool lives simpler.

Due to circumstances beyond our control, we recently had to discontinue our pool maintenance so we could continue to eat & remain alive. Over at least 2, possibly up to 3 months, we did not do anything to maintain the pool, resulting in a deep green sludge of a mess! Fortunately, this was a temporary situation that has now been resolved...meaning for the last 5 days I have been in the heck known here as SLAM.

I like to believe that I was simply carrying on the deep southern Catholic tradition, and my Mother's legacy..."If you just don't say it out loud, it isn't really happening!" Hate it or Love it, SLAM works!

Now...I am currently on the downside of the SLAM & I find myself pondering something very important! Is it just me, or has anyone else noticed that a dead algae bloom, upon being captured in my Polaris 280's net of pool refuse, is amazingly heavy! I don't recall discovering that before in the past. This very afternoon, I was brushing my pool, again, when I noticed The Polaris 280 was attempting a new trick...it was laying on the side with two wheels, struggling to upright itself...and it had been attempting this for about 20 minutes...to no avail.

Upon closer inspection, I quickly discovered that it's debris bag, although only half full, was dragging it over onto it's side, because of the extraordinary weight of the dead algae bloom. I looked it over carefully and could find no other logical explanation. The bag, though only half full, was causing my 280 to lay down on the job. That's when I realized that the reverse cycle had not been able to upright itself, nor save the day.

All kidding aside, I was actually quite surprised by the weight of the dead bloom once I removed the debris bag so I could empty it. Just wondering if anyone else had noticed that, or if I needed to be concerned about getting too old to attend the local 4th of July fireworks celebration. Can't deal with the traffic or the crowds. COVID made me realize that I loved to quarantine & just how easy our life has been since we had a legitimate excuse to, in the words of Nancy Reagan , "Just say no!"

Happy 4TH all.

I have a 19,000 gallon in-ground. Salt water. I threw the hose in on Friday and left for vacation. Came home today, Tuesday, to an over flowing greenish brownish pool. I don't even know where to start. My water is very hard. Salt registered at around 1500. What do I do first? I tossed in 8 gallons on chlorine because that is all I had on hand. Please help me figure this out so I don't gotta get a divorce

Added as many pics as I could with the best pictures I could get right now.

Did not have this problem last year and thought it would go away after our insane few weeks of pollen in early spring.

I vacuum and brush almost daily. It really looks like dirt and is in the same spots all the time on the bottom of the pool, however I am starting to think it could be yellow algae. It has a brownish/tint of yellow look.

When it is brushed as well as knocked around by the polaris it kicks up and forms a dust cloud and is gone.

FC-4
pH - 7.8
TA - 70
Cya - 55

My son had a pool built a few months ago and he is using the “take a sample to Leslies” maintenance program lol.

He asked me to take a look at the results and I was very surprised his TA reading is zero. Of course they sold him “alkalinity up”, aka baking soda at an inflated price. He also bought something to reduce phosphates lol.

He’s returning all of it and I’m going to test his water later today. If my tf100 yields similar TA and PH readings, I’ll come back with questions.

Hubby just got back from Lowe's. Muriatic acid is pulled, the brand is bought out by a new supplier, and won't be back on the shelves until August. Thought to give a heads up on this forum. I assume this is store wide.

Hi, we’re new owners of a 17K gal fiberglass pool and completely clueless on water chemistry. We’ve added 2 gals of 31.45% Muriatic acid, 25 lb of calcium chloride, and 8 lbs of dry stabilizer (per big box pool store)…water is still cloudy. Below are latest tests from TF pro kit. Help??

FC 1.0
CC 0.5
pH 7.0
TA 100
CH 250
CYA 30

Probably a silly question, but is it ok to add muriatic acid in front of the return while the SWG is running? Would the acid have any effect on the chlorination or vice versa?

TFP members, the TFP “Pool of the Month” contest for July 2022 begins now! it’s time to show-off your pool loving pets! Rules are as follows:

1. On the first of each month, a contest "theme" will be announced (i.e. water clarity, family fun, decking, custom features, lighting, scenery, etc)
2. Members have 10 days to upload ONE image for consideration; Photo must be related to the thread titled theme for that month.
3. Per general TFP rules, nothing profane, political, or insulting.
4. The first 10 days is the submission period. Posts are limited to ONE image ONLY. No discussion posts yet. This will make viewing much easier for all.
5. Days 11 - 15 the thread will be locked and is for voting only. No more uploads. Viewers now have a final opportunity to vote (or modify their selection) for their favorite upload.
6. Members are encouraged to use an emotion icon ("Like" or "Love") to vote for their favorite upload; it will be tough, but select only one favorite.
7. On day 16, emotion Likes/Loves will be tallied for a winner. In the event of a tie, we will create a poll on the thread to make a final selection.
8. Once a winner is announced, the thread will be unlocked and comments/discussions are welcomed. Winner and nominees can tell us all about their pool/photo/event.
9. A member can only be selected as winner once per calendar year.
10. Winner will receive a $50 gift certificate from tstestkits.net! Oh, and maybe some bragging rights.

This should be fun. Showcase your pool and pets. Let’s see those pics! Have fun and good luck to those who apply!

Hi, I just joined TFP this season and pool is looking great. TFP is an awesome resource. Thanks

I thought the information below might be helpful for some of the forum participants.
I recently bought 1 jug of 10% Liquid Chlorine that was actually 4.5%. It had a 2013 date code. I now am very careful to check the date code before I purchase.

I thought this might be a handy reference for checking bleach/liquid chlorine date codes. This decoder is for the brands that are available in my area. If you have other brands please add to this thread if you want.

Note: Further down I show an easy way to measure the strength of your bleach/liquid chlorine.

Bleach/Liquid Chlorine starts decomposing after it is manufactured. Check this link (scroll down) to see the half-life table (half-life means half of the original strength). Note that decomposition occurs faster for higher strength chlorine and faster at higher storage temperatures.


Bleach/Liquid Chlorine Date Code Decoder (Year/Day of Year)
Here is a Julian Date chart.

Clorox
A5 3 183 TX-1 08:41 (Day 183 of 2013)

Walmart Great Value
14 183 11:03 B1

Walmart White Cloud
14 144 12L59 B2 TX-01

Smart (Home Depot)
34713FL07:30

HTH Liquid Chlorinator
14JA0366B 11:15

Kem-Tek
1416210:25C

Dollar General
14 169 02:59 B2 TX-01

Online Packaging Inc
BB 07/01/15 (Date of Manufacture is 1 year prior to the "Best By:" date.) In this case Manufactured date is 07/01/2014.



Easy way to measure strength of bleach/liquid chlorine.

A 10,000 to 1 dilution of chlorine will result in chlorine ppm equal to its strength (percent). All you need to do is to make the 10,000 to 1 dilution, then measure the ppm using a FAS-DPD test kit. Example: If the dilution measures 8.5ppm, then your bleach strength is 8.5%.

Step 1: Measure 1 liter of Deionized or Distilled water. Here I’m measuring 1000 grams (1 liter) of water using a kitchen scale.



Step 2: Measure 0.1 ml of the bleach/liquid chlorine. This is easy to do by using a 0.3 ml u-100 insulin syringe and filling it to the 10 units mark (10 units of u-100 insulin is 0.1 ml)




Step 3: Add the 0.1 ml of bleach to the 1 liter of water and mix.

Step 4: Using a FAS-DPD test kit, measure the FC ppm (CC should be zero) of the dilution. The measured ppm is the percent strength of your bleach/liquid chlorine.

Hope this is helpful to some.

I wrote last week that the pool store said the reason my chlorine is not holding is due to the high level of phosphates. I have been waiting for my test kit to arrive (it was supposed to arrive today and now they are saying July 2nd!) I can’t wait that long. My fixtures are yellowing/browning and I need to get this fixed.
The last water test the store did was on Monday.
FC-.13
TC- 1.06
CC- .93
PH- 6.9
TA- 76 (but that is up now as I added the alkalinity up from the store)
Hardness-165
CYA -133
Copper- .2
Iron- .1

I have just added a gallon of liquid chlorine. I have also added store product to get rid of the iron and copper which has done nothing to move those numbers.
What should I do??

Morning All,

I posted strip results 2 weeks ago and was told I needed a TF-100, needless to say I'm the proud owner!

Here are my results, pool looks great but really eats through chlorine (nearly a 3" puck every 2 days.) I have never really had consistent FC readings on my strips either.

PH 7.2
CL 0.0
Chlorine Drop FC 0.0 and CC 0.5
Cya 30

Anything glaring here? Thanks!

This is my first post in a long time. My family and I left Maryland for Texas 7 years ago. The only regret we had is not finding a new house with a pool (housing market is crazy here).

We loved the times we had in our pool at our last house. Thankfully due to some circumstances at my work, we were able to finally build a pool! The picture is the rendition of what we're getting. The dimensions are 34'x21'(sundeck side) & 17' in the deep end.

We're all so excited! We break ground 6/11.

This is the first year I've every owned a pool. We bought a 10' x 16' Best Steel Oval pool with an Intex 1000 GPH Pump. My MIL also gave us an ECO7110 SWG. I bought a pH upper and downer and Muriatic acid and baking soda. I was trying to boost my chlorine up to 3 from 0 using the SWG on boost. My alkalinity was swinging from 40 - 180 and I saw pH anywhere from 6.2 - 8.4. I was adding chemicals based off of the App that came with my test strips, but they didn't have exactly what I bought so I was also going off what the back of the bottle said. After a week of that I went to Google and found TFP.

After a week of reading through all of the articles here, and using Pool Math, here's what I've been doing for the last week. I added 9 ounces of 10% Bleach I got at walmart to increase chlorine my pool. Alkalinity was back at 180, so I've been using muriatic acid based off the Pool Math app to lower pH to 7.0 and then using the SWG to bring the pH back up. And that's really it.

My Pool tested beautifully this Morning!! So far it's been the best $1,000 I've ever spent for family enjoyment, and with your help I don't think it'll be as stressful to maintain as I originally thought.

Hardness - 100
TC - 5
FC - 5
pH - 7.2
TA - 120
CYA - 30 - 50

I need to bring the TA down a little more and I might have to add CYA. I added it last Friday and I am waiting a full week before adding anymore since too much would be a headache..

If I'm missing anything please let me know. I'll take all the advice I can get from this place

Question: I didn't really plan on getting this pool. Just decided one day, bought it, borrowed a tiller and eyeballed the ground as it was mostly level. After setting it all up I did find it's 2" higher on 1 side than the other. Is this anything to be concerned about?

After seeing the great work that @duckcmmndr and @jastudee did and are doing with their DIY pool installs, I figured it might be helpful for me to make a post of my own to track my progress and ask any questions as we go through this process. On April 15th, 2022 we ordered a 16'x30' Flat Kidney pool kit from Royal Swimming Pools.



- 42" tall steel walls
- 6' deep end
- Cantilever coping (pool deck will be EP Henry pavers)
- 8' radius sit in step
- Pentair Superflo VST pump
- Pentair 320sqf Clean and Clear Cartridge Filter
- Pentair IC20 IC40 Salt Chlorinator
- 2 drains, 2 skimmers, 3 returns



Here is roughly where the pool will be going. I can't move it much more to the right because that is where our well is.


We're hoping this pool location gets enough sunlight. This photo was taken at 3 pm in late September, and our neighbors trees are just starting to shade over the area. We had what branches we could pruned, so hopefully this year there will be a little be less shade, and what shade there is will be less severe and more filtered. With this photo you can also see the shed where the pump, filter, and SWG are going.

I have secured contractors to do the following work:
- Electrician is installing a 50A sub panel in shed that is located close to the pool location.
- Fence Contractor is swapping around the opening orientation of a gate we have, as well as repairing a few sections.
- Arborist pruned some overhanging limbs (as well as other non-pool related work)
- Excavator is awaiting arrival of pool kit to schedule ground breaking

My rough budget for this project currently looks like this:
- Pool Kit - $14.5k
- 55 bags pool base - $1.5k
- Concrete for bond beam - $2k
- Excavation Sub - $3.5k
- Electric Sub - $2.5k
- Fence Sub - $.75k
- Arborist Sub - $1.5k
- Permits - $1k
- Pavers - $5k
Total: $32.5k

I know there will be additional costs that I'm not factoring in such as plumbing and electrical supplies, but for a ballpark I think this was fine. We were originally quoted $45k for a smaller, simpler, and more basic pool installed by a local pool company and they wouldn't be able to install it until June 2023.

My current plan:
- Take off a week of work to get the initial stages completed.
- Excavator Breaks ground for rough excavation
- Finish excavation manually with a shovel and a helping hand or two.
- Set up the walls, getting them as straight and plumb as necessary
- Rough install the two drains at the bottom of the hopper, and run plumbing under panel walls
- Verify walls are straight, plumb, and all dimensions are within specification.
- Get concrete truck with pump truck to pour bond beam
- Finish the rest of the rough plumbing (skimmers, returns, and plumbing to/from pump house)
- Pool Krete the bottom (I'm actually kind of dreading this part, and wondering if I should just try to hire it out)
- Hang liner
- Start filling with water and partially backfill
- Finish plumbing with any liner cutouts needed.
- Wire up electrical to the pumps and run bonding wire around pool, tying in steps and ladder
- Finish backfill
- Take a break, swim in semi-finished pool, stare at pallets full of pavers, contemplate life choices
- Install pavers for pool decking (may hire this part out if budget holds up and/or my back does not)

Some things I still need to do:
- Permits (currently working through this now)
- Purchase a sump pump of sorts (any recommendations?) I'm sure It'll rain at some point and even if it doesn't, I'd rather have this and not need it.

As of today, we have received our liner, and the bulk of the rest of the kit is en-route on a freight truck somewhere. I'll need to rent a forklift for a day (probably next week) to unload it all.

I'm new to this forum and a newbie at pool maintenance - been doing it awhile but always used the pool shop to test and never have gained the pool knowledge I ultimately want. Not too thrilled overall with my pool water (it looks ok and clear but not as good as I think it could be)

I have a 15K gallon chlorine pool, with a DE filter in North Texas (sorry I'll work on my signature later when I have time)

Maybe this is a dumb question, but where do you all buy your chemicals?

And I've always used granular shock, and had no idea about liquid chlorine until now. Should I be using that instead of granular shock? And do I still use tabs in the floaters? I don't have an automatic chlorinator or anything

I ordered my T-100 Pro test kit just now!