thecabana said:

is it possible that the chlorine manufactured just a month ago is 6% rather than the labeled 12.5%? Have you seen that before?

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It definitely happens.

Awesome strategies specifically around the SWG and temps. Thanks to all-a-y'all.

PoolStored said:

You don't have a heater in your signature

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Well shoot, now I do! The heater's been on the pad all the time, now it's in the sig as well... oopsie.

PoolStored said:

wait until water temps are above 70 to avoid condensation corrosion...

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Fascinating. So... while we're here on a new topic... Yep a gas heater. Read the article (thank you) -- My brain went to two places:

1. What about using the spa in the winter? But then I saw the bit in the article about the spa being small enough to heat without being a problem, and since the heater is almost always used for the spa, and not immensely often when it's really cold, I think I'm good there.
2. The start of the article refers to "cold air" as well as water temps under 70, and I also see the Jandy specific instructions saying water temps not under 40 and not prolonged under 50. If my water is in the high 50s/~60 and I want to heat the pool for just the two days as a one-off, I'm reading I'm probably suboptimal but not in really problematic land? Air temps should be in the high 70s and even up to 80 with lows of 60 so I'm inferring from the "cold air" intro to the concept that I'm okay here? Also even if the air was cold(er) it's a one off so not "prolonged" for extended times?

1poolman1 said:

Even with the cost of a new cell, the cost for the amount of chlorine produced by a good system is much less than the cost of any other chlorine product over the life of a cell.

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+1. The 1000 jug equivalent of 10% chlorine my SWG produces would cost $6166* for me out the door at Walmart.

*the value of not lugging 1000 jugs is much harder to calculate, but it's alot.

Thanks - I bought the TF test kit for salt water pools and the C-600 pH + Salt Meter. I haven’t figured out how to use the meter, but I’ll start looking for instructions.

connfann said:

In preparation for the warmer weather I decided to give a thorough cleaning to my DE filter grids. Pentair FNS 60 sq ft.

I got some bad news that 3-4 of the grids had significant holes in them.

I put everything back together to have the filter running while looking for new parts and forgot to open the pressure release when starting back up..

I sent my lid into the neighbors yard (could have been a lot worse) and cracked it.

So now I need to replace the grids and the lid.. Its a 2014 so over 10 years at this point..
More cost effective to replace the whole unit at this point? If so, with what?

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It wasn't the "pressure release" that caused the problem, they don't allow air out of the system fast enough to prevent what happened, there's an internal one as well.
It was an improperly installed, improperly tightened, or failed tank clamp. It can happen with any filter.
The only filter that was truly designed to prevent that happening is the StaRite System 3, now owned by Pentair, with all of its individual clamps. You would have to work very hard to get that tank to blow apart if the clamps are even slightly attached.

Jsf721 said:

If the power goes down when it comes back up will the functions resume ?

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With it wired to my pump, the power gets cut every day once the rpm’s drop below 1730ish. It comes back up at the same percentage each time.

Go to Pinch a Penny for the cheapest LC prices (don't have to even check dates...they fill your carboy right there (https://pinchapenny.com/shop/suncoast-bleach-bundle.html)).
Even Walmart Pool Essentials Liquid Chlorine is a good price (still have to check dates)

Thanks - parts ordered. Will report on results.

CPM10V said:

Thanks for the advice. What’s your opinion on salt pools in the SW/Phoenix?

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If you decide to use liquid, your pool will start to and become a "salt" pool and eventually have as much salinity as needed to run an SWG. The only way to prevent that is to never use chlorine in the water, but your water supplier likely adds some before sending water to you.

The salinity required to have a system "make" chlorine is in the 3000-3500PPM range. That is about 1/4 the salinity of your sweat or tears, neither of which would do damage to your deck. I got to believe that in the Summer in Phoenix there is a lot of sweating going on on pool decks. Anyone that is telling you to avoid an SWG is trying to sell you something and not looking out for your best interests. Even with the cost of a new cell, the cost for the amount of chlorine produced by a good system is much less than the cost of any other chlorine product over the life of a cell. When they first came out, the cost of a gallon of liquid could be as low as $.75 and the economics didn't work. It was more about the convenience, and the water actually "feels" better, had several customers tell me that. At about $8.00+ locally today, it makes much more sense.

Liquid chlorine is sodium hypochlorite, a mixture of chlorine gas and sodium hydroxide (the very basics, I'm not a chemist). When it hits the water it basically separates into hypochlorous acid (the "killing" form of chlorine), hydrochloric acid, and sodium chloride or good old salt. Again the very basics and all that is really needed to know about the reaction.

I'll find whatever the 230V probably does....I've heard of a Nidec Neptune NPTT225 motor will a want one? I've just Leslie I'm just looking motors and pumps just now today.

First thing I would do is get a proper test kit for your pool. If you get the TFteskit, make sure to get the salt version. If you get the Taylor, you need to order the K-1766 salt test. Link-->Test Kits Compared

I'd rather have accurate salt test before replacing water. Only downside of replacing now without knowing the salt level...is that if it is lower than the 42/4400 you might have to add salt back.

To get it down to 3500, you will need to replace about 15% of the pool water. See "no drain water exchange" here:

I'd get the test kit, verify, then replace. Then troubleshoot the cell...

onBalance said:

One other point, do not use liquid chlorine for the first month unless you add acid at the same time. Liquid chlorine has a very high pH and could cause scaling when added if not neutralized by adding acid at the same time and brushing afterwards to remove scale (if present) and to circulate the water.

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Just to clarify for the OP, never mix chemicals together.

Always add separately giving time for one chemical to mix into the pool water before adding a different chemical.

Ideally, pour into the return stream and also brush the pool to help mix added chemicals.

Capnswab said:

Over the summer they’ll release an upgrade to add an ORP

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For anyone interested in this unit coming out, you need to understand ORP and its limitations regarding CYA...

PoolStored said:

A bit to unpack.

• The pump you have can be wired with 115v or 230v. You need to determine how it is wired. Can you look at the breaker/post a picture of the breaker for the pump? I'd also post pictures of your equipment pad.
• In order to choose the right pump, we need to know the wiring. Pump come in 115v, 230 or some can be wired with either.
• Whisperflo pumps only go up to 1.65THP in the dual voltage (115/230) version. The larger versions are 230v.
• The intelliflo3 1.5THP is dual voltage. The intelliflo3 3THP is 230v

If I were updating my pump, and given your requirements, I'd rewire to 230v if you don't have 230v service already and get the larger of either pump.

Post up the pictures, that will help us.

I'd also get rid of the inline chlorinator. Best way to kill a heater. Have you considered installing a salt water chlorine generator while you are updating your pad?

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The inline chlorinator is in off position. I switched to liquid chlorine.

Shhhhhhhhh or it will HEAR you and turn 2 more lights on. !!!!

thecabana said:

.is it possible that the chlorine manufactured just a month ago is 6% rather than the labeled 12.5%? Have you seen that before? It seems the most plausible to me

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With the current state of quality control ? Please don't even get me started.


It could also be from the store. They may have left the pallet baking in the sun out back for 2 weeks.

toddclare said:

New pool this past july, and kept it "open" if not cold all summer (Atlanta, GA USA). Once the temps got low enough, I shut down the salt water generator and maintained successfully with LC all winter. Levels are good and ready for the spring and summer.

Now that the water temp is rising, wanted to check in on the right method in the transition time. For example, my temp is hovering in the mid 50s but has gone up to 62 once and will continue to go up and down. I ASSUME I'll wait until I'm consistently over 60 most or all of the time before turning on the SWG?

Also what about the case where I might heat the pool this weekend? It'll be up well over 60 for the couple of days -- just keep LC knowing those temps are artificial or?

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Note that it’s the water temperature that controls whether the SWCG makes any chlorine or not. The air temp doesn’t matter. If water is over 60F it’ll probably make chlorine. If it’s below that then it may or may not.

Deciding to use the heater in extra cold weather is anseparate issue mentioned above.

Thanks from looking because I have zero electric for anything. I guess we'll have to some pool to view for we get this motor and/or pump after work.

Crosby,
Newly plastered pools (less than 30 days) have completely different needs than when the plaster has been under water for at least one month. Keep that in mind as I offer suggestions for you to follow for the first month of your new pool.

Since your plaster is less than 30 days old, the pH will always be very difficult to keep under 8.3. That is just the way it is. Fortunately, there is one way to ease that difficulty, and that is by maintaining the CSI (or LSI) at about +0.4 to +0.5 for 20 to 30 days. To achieve that high CSI, it is best to have a high alkalinity if possible, and the pH between 7.8 and 8.3. The calcium hardness should never be adjusted upward (if needed) until the pH is under 8.0. Daily additions of small amounts of acid will probably be needed for the first two to three weeks.

The following is an explanation about the above program, and it only applies to new plaster, not a plaster pool that is beyond 30 days. If or when the pH is low and/or the alkalinity is low, and the CSI is below +0.4, some plaster material (calcium hydroxide) will dissolve into the pool water and immediately cause the pH to rise dramatically. That is exactly why the pH in your pool water was tested at 8.7 (if I read that above correctly). Only by maintaining the CSI at a high level will prevent the dissolution of calcium hydroxide from the plaster surface. Once 30 days have past, there is no longer any calcium hydroxide on the plaster surface because it has been carbonated. It is no longer a problem to deal with. I have proven the above information through many experiments.

One other point, do not use liquid chlorine for the first month unless you add acid at the same time. Liquid chlorine has a very high pH and could cause scaling when added if not neutralized by adding acid at the same time and brushing afterwards to remove scale (if present) and to circulate the water.

My suggestion to you right now is to add acid and bicarb at the same time to lower the pH. If you add 7 lbs. of bicarb for every gallon of 31.45% acid, that will negate any change to the TA. But it will lower the pH. I would proceed to get the CSI to a higher level mentioned above. Brushing is always necessary and vital for new plaster pools. Thousands of pools are successfully using the Bicarb Startup program or the Orenda's Positive LSI Calcium startup program.

Once your pool is beyond 30 days, maintaining the CSI near the 0.0 level, and maintaining a low TA will help ease the constant pH rise and have to add acid constantly. Of course, the concept of using carbon dioxide is a good choice for pH control, but only when the alkalinity has been lowered.

If anyone sees something that I missed or has questions, please respond. Thanks.

Jsf721 said:

Won’t this system tell you current chlorine readings ?

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They haven’t released that part of the system yet. It tells you if your salt level is in range. Over the summer they’ll release an upgrade to add an ORP and PH probe. It looks like it’s just a new cell housing that you swap out. And also a port to add muriatic acid with a peristaltic pump if that’s something you want to do.

Not a day goes by that a member doesn't go the extra mile for a stranger. Some days not an hour goes by.

Well done @Buggs.

+3. Give your money to a 3rd party who said they'd pay the subs. The court won't care about the 3rd party when the sub isn't paid, you'll be responsible.

You then need to go after the 3rd party seperately, and in the case of a folded business, there may be nothing to go after. Or very little left once split however many ways there are lawsuits against the business.

DBissett said:

Heres the volts plus specs.

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If you have 230V running your pump, which you probably do, a Nidec Neptune NPTT225 motor will work.
Please check, or have someone check, your voltage. A good way is to just look at your circuit breaker for the pump. Is it a double-pole breaker, two handles connected? Then you have a 230V system.

Can you post pictures of your equipment pad so we can see everything? Include the labels on the pumps...

jmastron said:

(I leave the SWCG's dial at 100% and adjust the WiFi plug's on/off time to get the chlorinating I want, making sure it's within the pump run time).

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I'd recommend running your cell at some % other than 100. Running cells at 100% is not good for the catalytic coating on the plates. Along with cleaning your cell with acid, running a cell for prolonged periods at 100% shortens the life of the cell. 90% would be fine.

FYI: In answer to the OP's original question, I asked Taylor:

Jim: "What is a Taylor Kit #57087? How does it differ from a Taylor Kit K2006C?

Taylor:
"Good morning, Jim, The #57087 and the K-2006C are the same exact kit. If you are ordering through ECOLAB that is just their reference number for the K-2006C. Hope this helps! Please let us know if we can help in any way or have any questions!

Thank you,
Customer Service Representative
Taylor Water Technologies LLC, 31 Loveton Circle, Sparks, Maryland 21152
800-TEST KIT (837-8548), 410-472-4340,
www.taylortechnologies.com"

So i always said I would want a consistant system, good (swg) or bad (jug lugging), because knowing what to expect helps me sleep better.

But I always had to close because crazy leaves at the old place so I never put it into practice. At the new wide open yard, I'm opening real early and shutting it down near freezing. Ive found to my delight that when the temps are dancing the cold water shutoff, it only needs to kick on for a warmer day to match the low UV demand. 4 to 6 ppm goes a long way when it's cool. Once or twice I stepped in with LC when the FC was getting low and the SWG stayed off, but most weeks I didnt need to.

Welcome to the forum!

I suggest you read through Pool Care Basics - Trouble Free Pool and even look at a few of our videos TFP-TV - Trouble Free Pool