Pool leaking... had 'leaks' fixed in pool light and skimmers HOWEVER pool still leaking

[emilton]

Hi all

First time pool owner and someone struggling to fix an issue that seems to never end. Also worried I am being taken advantage of by contractors due to my lack of knowledge. A quick background

1) Have a large underground pool and attached spa. Saw that when pump was running the pool level would drop to skimmer line so immediately knew there was an issue, likely a leak.

2) Got a leak detector out who tested and told me I have small leaks in the pool light and skimmers, so got these fixed.

3) This did not fix the issue and leak prevailed at the same rate.

4) Things that could not be tested were:
a) the sheer descent (it is plumed into the main plumbing so cannot be taken out of the system to test, not can it be pressure tested without drilling through my concrete deck)
b) the spa spillover into pool - they checked and saw no obvious leak nor heard anything here but this could still be an issue

5) I have had tests done running pool without spa and this seemed to find that the issue was the spa given pool didn't leak, but water pressure of sheer descent was very low - one guy told me this could be a filter issue and pool needs to be backwashed properly. I read online how to backwash and did this which solves the pressure issue but only for 30 mins and it starts to decrease again to a near stop - could this signify an issue and leak somewhere or separate issue?

So my questions are:
- If everything else was good, does it have to be the sheer descent? Will I have to drill into the decking to cut the pipe and pressure test/see whats under there? I essentially just want to take this out of the entire system now as its more trouble than its worth!
- Could there be another issue that would cause water level to drop?
- Is there anything I need to do to my filter that could cause this?

Please help! I am keen to try and fix it as much myself but understand when a professional is needed. Getting the leaks fixed and then follow up work has cost me a pretty penny so far and I am left with a pool that when the pump is run for 8 hours will leak from half way up skimmer to bottom!

Thanks

 

[Jimrahbe]

E,

I suspect that your filter issue has nothing to do with any leaks.. Tell us more..

Show us several pics of your equipment pad, showing the whole thing, as well as details.

Tell us how much water is lost each day.. An 1" or 1/4" or ???

Does the water drop if you have the pump off for a day?

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[CrystalRiver]

What does your filter pressure gauge say? When the system is off, when it's running just after backwash, and after 30 minutes when you lose flow.

 

[emilton]

Jim,

Attached are further pictures of my equipment and pool. Let me know if anything else more specific needed. Heater is old and not connected. Whole system was recently replumbed and pump is brand new.

100% pool does not leak when pump is off. Have tested this numerous times and water level remains constant. I only lose water when pump is on.

Last night I had the pump on, spa off for 8 hours and lost more than an inch, probs more like 1.5-2. If you see in the tile the water level was half way up (this is half way up skimmer) and fell to the bottom of that tile. Water loss is fast in my view when pump is on.

One weird thing that happened and has a few times has been that I have done this test but the water level has not dropped over the same period. This is what baffles me. Still more times it has than it hasn’t but I have run this pool before and the level has remained constant.

 

[emilton]

What does your filter pressure gauge say? When the system is off, when it's running just after backwash, and after 30 minutes when you lose flow.

From research I think it’s rather high. Just checked and when pump off it is at 0. When pump on it is at 30psi (sheer descent dribbling out at best right now when I turned pump on). Stays at this pressure.

 

[mknauss]

Welcome to the forum!
Can you see the exit of your waste line from the MPV on your filter?
I suggest you read ABC's of Pool Water Chemistry.

 

[emilton]

Welcome to the forum!
Can you see the exit of your waste line from the MPV on your filter?
I suggest you read ABC's of Pool Water Chemistry.

I’m not entirely sure what you mean here?

 

[CrystalRiver]

From research I think it’s rather high. Just checked and when pump off it is at 0. When pump on it is at 30psi (sheer descent dribbling out at best right now when I turned pump on). Stays at this pressure.

So it's at 30 right after you thoroughly backwash, and then it stays there? Backwashing should lower the pressure.

 

[emilton]

It doesn’t change. I’m thinking I need to clean the filter as pressure is v low on sheer descent water coming out and this seems to be because filter is dirty?

 

[Jimrahbe]

E,

What Marty is thinking is that the filter is so dirty, that it is causing the water to back up and go out the backwash pipe, even though the Multiport Valve (MPV) is in the Filter position.

If you can see the end of the backwash pipe, you need to check to see if water if running out when the pump is on.

Your MPV may also have a site glass where you can check to see of there is flow out the backwash pipe.

I agree with Marty, that is the first place that I would look.

Thanks for the pics.. I was hoping there were more pipes coming out of the ground.. Before I dug up any decking or concrete, I would dig right at the pad to see if you can tell where the return water is going.. Might not be true, but I was hoping the shear was plumbed back somewhere around the equipment pad.

I assume the shear runs constantly when the pump is running in the pool mode.. and NOT in the spa mode, is that true?

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[emilton]

I assume if there was a site glass in the backwash it would be obvious right? All that is here is pipe. As said, I don’t know pools too well.

Is there anything from the pics below I need to look for with pump on? Seems like also next point of attack would be to open up and clean the filter?

And yes descent on when pool pump on. Spa by itself means no descent.

 

[Jimrahbe]

E,

The rounded glass bulb on your MPV is a site glass.. When the MPV is in the "Filter" position, there should be no water movement in that glass bulb..

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[emilton]

I can confirm there is nothing in here when the pump is on.

 

[mknauss]

That would imply you are not bypassing to waste when you are in filter.

Your observations are implying you are losing several hundred gallons of water in a few hours. That is non-trivial amount of water. It has to go somewhere. Take a hard look around the pool/yard.

 

[emilton]

I know right, I completely agree hence why I’m confused. I have looked everywhere around the yard and pool to no avail. Nowhere in the vicinity is there any wet patches, puddles of water or anything that looks untoward so I really have no idea where this water is going but as you said it has to be going somewhere.

I assume now the filter being too dirty is not to blame and it must be either the sheer descent or the leak detections I have done was wrong somehow?

Is there anything else I can check myself?