Thinking about going Salt - have a few questions

[bbillingsley1985]

I don't know how I missed this but I'm just now reading about the 180 minute cycle that the Hayward's go on. So if I understand correctly in my mind, the aquarite cell % is really only doing 2 things....its either on at 100% or its off.....it doesn't half production to 50% as an example, it would just run at 100% for an hour and a half, and then turn off the remaining hour and a half. Am I understanding that right? That probably answers my power question above meaning when it was shut off it probably would be producing close to 0 watts.

The one thing I'm a little confused about is the reverse polarity. So let's say I set it at 50% speed and leave it on 24/7. Which of the following happens:

Scenario A
12:00 to 1:30 am - 100% turned on
1:30 am to 3:00 am - 0% off
reverse polarity starts
3:00 am to 4:30 am - 100% turned on
4:30 am to 6:00 am - 0% off
repeating that cycle

Scenario B
12:00 am to 1:30 am - 100% turned on
1:30 am to 3:00 am - 0% off
reverse polarity starts
3:00 am to 4:30 am - 0% off (off for 3 straight house here)
4:30 am to 6:00 am - 100% turned on
reverse polarity starts
6:00 am to 7:30 am - 100% again (running for 3 straight hours here)

 

[bbillingsley1985]

Couple of things I found out in case it ever helps anyone. Thought I'd post what a Hayward Rep told me about the following issue. So I searched online and this forum for a very minor (but annoying for me) issue where on the omni hub panel itself and in the omnilogic phone app, when you check diagnostics it only tells you the average salt level, and the T-15 cell number. All the other options such as current, voltage, instant salt etc. are blank or N/A (I'll attach a pic). Where it's annoying for me is I was trying to test out my scenarios above and realized that on the app, if I set it to say 50% and leave it on 24 hours, as far as the app is concerned, its always on and always shows generating. In reality though, by checking the amps, you can tell rather its actually producing chlorine on its 180 minute cycle or not. So you can check this at the aquarite panel, but cannot check it in the app, which is annoying. I found another post where someone had this same issue and the response they got was that unfortunately there's no way to change that. I went ahead and emailed hayward support and asked them the same question and I got a response back with the following:

"This information does not currently transfer over. It is on our very long lists of things to do, but it does not have a high priority today. You cannot enable it at this time."

Sounds like though its possible they fix it, it may be years down the road.

To answer my question on the previous post, now that I figured out what reverse polarity actually is, which in my mind is just reversing the current to try to discourage calcium deposits......it sounds like my Scenario A is how this thing will go. Meaning at say 40%, it's going to run at 100% for 72 minutes on, 108 minutes off (only able to really tell by checking amps on aquarite diagnostics because aquarite and app both show it generating), reverse polarity, then repeat that exact same cycle of 100% for 72 minutes, off for 108 minutes. So I think I have that all understood now. The term reverse polarity threw me off and made me think it was going to reverse the time that it ran, not currents.

It probably isn't worth messing with, but if I wanted to kind of control when it changes polarity, since it always changes polarity when it turns off/on, using the same 40% example, that's 9.6 hours of run time in a 24 hour period. Say you thought you could get by with about 9 hours, I guess you could set a schedule to run at 100% from 7 am to 9:59 am, 2 pm to 4:59 pm, and then 7 pm to 9:59 pm. This should turn it off right before it reverses, then when it kicks back on it will reverse and essentially you could force it to only do 3 reverse polarities per day instead of the 8 or so that it would do per day on a 40% 24/7 cycle. Not enough info to know if extra polarity switches would hurt the cell or not.....if I get bored I could research that some and see what might be the best practice. If anyone has further information on that feel free to reply.

 

[TexEdmond]

is it producing the exact same chlorine rather I'm running my pump on full blast vs a lower speed, making the pump speed irrelevant for swg purposes as long as flow is more than flow switch?

Bingo. That's why so many of us just run the pump at the bare minimum.

So at 1750 rpm my watts from the app tells me usually the 160's watts range.

Off the top of my head that sounds about similar to my system and many others here. Understand that the [RPM / GPM / Pump wattage] relationship is NOT linear. As pump RPM increases, your power draw will rise exponentially. It takes a tremendous amount of energy to push an incompressible fluid through small tubes.

if we just ballpark it

I wouldn't recommend trying to estimate your SWG power draw this way. There's going to be loss in whatever electronics convert your 110/220V alternating current into 25V direct current. If you wanted to get a more accurate reading of your actual energy usage, you might consider a clamp style current meter on the feed to your pool panel. Run it a few days with manual chlorine added to get a baseline for your pump usage. Then turn on the SWG and run it a few days without changing the pump setting. Then it's just simple subtraction without having to get into the reverse engineering by electrical theory.

All that said, we're talking about a few bucks a month.... I dumped $60 last night on a spontaneous mexican restaurant trip, so the money is really neglibile from any energy perspective.

I did the same but with sushi. There's costs involved with owning a pool. It is not an investment, it's a bottomless hole in your backyard where you put your money. Doing the SWG thing was about convenience and peace of mind for me, and I personally refuse to allow myself to try to calculate the break-even cost. It was worth it not having to drive as often to the hardware store for liquid chlorine, and it's worth it only having to check the chems every few days.

I'm also in a weird situation electricity-wise because our house is on well water with an aerobic septic system that also runs 24/7. So basically our power and water bills are combined and it's hard to unscramble that omelet.

its either on at 100% or its off.....it doesn't half production to 50% as an example, it would just run at 100% for an hour and a half, and then turn off the remaining hour and a half. Am I understanding that right?

The cell itself is either [PRODUCING CHLORINE] or it's [OFF]. So, multiply your pump runtime by your SWG percentage and that's the total amount of time your cell is in [PRODUCING CHLORINE] mode. Polarity might mean something different to them, but in electrical terms that usually means that the thing that usually gets positive voltage now gets negative voltage. This can be very dangerous to DC electronics, but it's obvious the manufacturer of your device engineered that in. It might be some kind of anode / cathode reversal that the system uses to balance out wear and corrosion on the SWG plates. That's another reason folks here choose to run their pumps at low RPM all day long, for some reason it just seems wise to me to spread out the SWG runtime as long as possible instead of running the SWG at 100% and then just turning the system off when the chlorine level has reached a high enough level to hold over until the next day's run.

 

[bbillingsley1985]

Thanks Tex,

That all makes sense. On the power deal, I found it interesting that at 1750 rpm it was pushing 160 watts (all according to omnilogic app). I cleaned the 4 cartridge filters a little over a week ago (had risen about the 5 psi pressure so time for a cleaning)....and after cleaning I noticed that now the 1750 rpm is pushing a lot more water out of the returns compared to what it used to push. Also interesting that its closer to 200-210 watts now at that same speed. The more water pushing out makes sense because with the filters being clean and less clogged, more flow, but the fact that the wattage was higher was just interesting to me. I sort of thought that at 1750 the pump was running the exact same regardless. Playing a little further with it, I now found that running it at closer to 1250 rpm's produces about the same water through the returns as 1750 with a dirty filter did. 1750 used to be close to flagging the flow switch....now that 1000-1250 is when it flags the flow switch. Good lesson on how dirty filters can affect things.

 

[HermanTX]

“now that 1000-1250 is when it flags the flow switch. Good lesson on how dirty filters can affect things.”

The guidance I have seen on this forum is to taken the minimum flow to activate the flow switch, then add 200rpm. This accounts for dirty filter. Yours appears to be a little higher but within reason.

I have a Jandy SWCG (will install soon) and it states it also produces chlorine when in reverse (polarizing) flow. So as stated earlier, the cell really has 2 modes. Producing Chlorine or Off.

 

[bbillingsley1985]

It's now been 3 weeks since I installed it and wow what a difference. I haven't had to add 1 thing to my pool since setup. Everyone who has been over to swim has complimented and has liked the salt feel a lot better compared to non salt. Someone here who described it as "feeling like you get out of the shower when getting out of a salt pool vs feeling like you need a shower when getting out of a non salt pool" is very accurate. Feels a lot better on your skin and just feels more luxurious I guess.

I ran a new set of tests with the TFT Pro last night and here's what I came up with:

FC 10 (had swg set to 35% and that was maintaining 8 but with some cloudy days I probably didn't lose as much FC....so dialed it down to 30% to ease that closer to 8-9 range)
PH 7.3-7.4 range (was the same 7.3 - 7.4 range when I started so no real change.....from reading some posts here, I expected it to shoot up pretty quickly but maybe only a small increase in 3 weeks)
alk 60 - no change
cya 60 - no change
CH 175 - I noticed it was 150 3 weeks ago and now 175, so only a very minor change but I do wonder will continuously running a swg increase CH over time and will that ever be a problem?
Salt 3200 - chlorinator says 3100 so that seems just fine

The pool math app says FC is outside recommended range of 3-9 (that will be rectified with my swg % adjustment), but it also says PH and CYA are outside of ideal range, though in. At this time I like my cya at 60 just in case I royally screw something up and have to slam (knock on wood I've never had to slam since owning the pool but never know), I'd rather it be 60 than 80 and swg seems to do just fine at the 30-35% range keeping it in....so I'm good leaving it at 60.

I also don't think I want to touch PH and alkalinity. Yea I could add a little baking soda and creep TA to more of an 80 and PH 7.6 but I'd honestly rather them both stay on the lower end if they are expected to creep up over time anyway. I read a post where someone was having to add Muriatic Acid every few days. I feel like at this rate I may make it through the rest of the season (~2 more months) without having to add any....so I don't know if I'm doing something wrong or if the fact that that the lower range alk is helping it not to rise too fast.

Anyway, just thought I'd give an update through my chronicles lol.

 

[mknauss]

No need to add anything.

The SWCG will not raise the CH. Only by adding calcium or calcium containing products will CH rise.

 

[HermanTX]

CH 175 - I noticed it was 150 3 weeks ago and now 175, so only a very minor change but I do wonder will continuously running a swg increase CH over time and will that ever be a problem?
Salt 3200 - chlorinator says 3100 so that seems just fine

Your CH test for 10ml sample is 25ppm per drop so being off by 1 drop is no issue.
Similarly for Salt test - each drop is 200ppm so you are within the parameters of that as well.
Don’t sweat the small stuff.
Glad your SWCG is doing great.

 

[bbillingsley1985]

Just figured I'd continue to periodically update this through my chronicles of the SWG system lol. So it's almost been 6 weeks now since I've installed it.....and I still haven't had to add 1 single thing to my pool since installing. I sort of don't know what to do with myself. Pretty much periodically empty skimmers and throw the robot in, and that's all I've had to do in a month in a half.

I try to run tests once a week (double checking FC at more frequent intervals) and everything is staying where they were the last 3 weeks. FC 9 PH 7.3-7.4, alk 60, cya 60, CH 175, salt 3200. I would hate to run these tests without my magnetic stirrer now. So glad I bought the Pro kit which had that. If anyone reading doesn't have one, you may want to take advantage of their blue light one on clearance for $28 or $38 for the taylor one ( Magnetic Stirring Devices ). It's so worth it with the powder FC checks.

One interesting note is my FC. So about 2 weeks ago I checked my FC and it was up to 12. I had already lowered swg to 25% (from 30%) when it was at 10 so i expected it to hold it/go down slightly. It had actually went up. So now for the last 2 weeks I've only been running my SWG at 15% and its holding FC at 9. Mid to late July was the 100 degree temps and the last 3-4 we've had milder (upper 80's low 90's) temps so it's a good lesson on how much FC loss you have depending on sun. Except on the hottest part of the summer, I'm betting 15-20% is going to probably hold me most of the time. Better than what I expected.

I guess the only thing I was a little surprised about is my PH not really rising. I bet I'll make it through the rest of the next ~6 weeks before I close without having to buy any muriatic acid at all. I expected I would of had to do that this year. Sounds like my alk being on the lower end is playing a part in that and obviously where I live compared to hotter climates like Vegas, etc. So that will be a bonus if I seldom will have to add acid....I expected I would be having to add it a lot based on some posts I've read.

Next step will be starting to look at what I need to do to close it properly. I closed it myself last year but didn't really know what the heck I was doing. FC was only 3-4 when I closed it so pool was slightly green when opening in March (though a few days of shock/filtration cleared it up). Sounds like a tentative plan is get FC up to slam a few days prior and let it dwindle down and maybe that will hold. I'm also back and forth on rather to use RV/pool antifreeze. I used a few gallons last year just to idiot proof it in case I missed something closing my first time. Need to research more on if adding just a few gallons over time will negatively effect pool. I like the peace of mind but I also think I do a good job of making sure everything is closed up. My shop vac wasn't enough to blow out the main drain on the bottom (could do everything else) but my friend had a cyclone that we used. That thing cleared it out in 2 seconds lol. I'll be able to borrow it again but wish I had something else cheaper than a cyclone but strong enough to blow the main drain out. All stuff to research in the next 6 weeks or so.

 

[summertimesadness]

Thanks for this thread.... we are upgrading to salt in the spring time. We are closing our pool in October, allowing me a few months of research and purchasing.

 

[bbillingsley1985]

Thanks for this thread.... we are upgrading to salt in the spring time. We are closing our pool in October, allowing me a few months of research and purchasing.

Happy to do it. I just hope I don't annoy the board with it lol. I honestly will probably look back on this at times to as reference if i ever need to make repairs, or just historically see what some of my levels were and what I was doing at that time of the year.

You probably know all of this already, but having researched about 1000 swg possibilities before going with hayward, I'll throw out a little of what I learned. With your pool being a 30k gallon I would look at a 55k minimum swg (always want to shoot for ~ double your pool size). I wish Hayward went up to 60k like the pentairs do but 40k is as high as they go. The having everything hayward and automation is why I went with it (and my pool being only 22k gallons made the 40k work). That said, I was super super close at going with the circupool universal 55 and inyo also had a 55k/60k gallon one in the $1050 or so range but then it sold out.

I say all that to say when fall/winter hits, take a look at both inyo's website and the discount salt pools website and see if they may have some of these on clearance/heavily discounted. If I'm you with a generic pump and appears no automation, I'd look at the following ones. I started price checking these at the end of April of this year, 2022, so I'll throw out the cheapest prices I saw each one too.

Circupool Generic 55k ($1350 as of today): CircuPool Universal55 Saltwater Chlorinator | Discount Salt Pool
Around the 4th of July during a sale this was actually $1289....so don't love this price at the moment compared to that. I'd like to think it will go down in fall/winter but who knows with shortages etc. I liked this because one it was about $400 cheaper than the RJ60+ and the fact that it was universal means you'd have a lot of versatility with replacing anything in the future if there were any shortages on things.

Circupool RJ60+ ($1730 as of today with the size up discount): CircuPool RJ-60 PLUS Saltwater Chlorinator | Discount Salt Pool
This one was $1689 on the 4th of July, so also up a little bit. Probably the top of the line one you can get. Along this board, there's a whole bunch of positive feedback with it.

Circupool Core 55 ($1680 with size up discount): Circupool Core 55 Salt Chlorine Generator | Salt Water Chlorine Pool System
I don't have the exact price but I'm assuming this one was also about $40ish cheaper on 4th of July sale. No electrical work is the big thing with this. That said if your pump is hooked to a timer which I'm assuming it is, it'd probably be better to look at the other two because the electrical work is pretty easy and straightforward and you'd end up tying it in to that timer anyway rather than plugging it into an outlet.

Inyo Pools: Nothing at 60k now but keep your eye opened on their website. There's was cheapest when they had it in stock.....believe it was $1050.

A bigger discussion outside of my scope is if you decide to replace the pump and go automation. If that's the case you may consider a pentair automation system with a 60k swg. Others on this board have pentairs and I'm sure could answer any questions about that when the time comes. There are also maybe less popular brands that do automation.

 

[Saturn94]

…
I guess the only thing I was a little surprised about is my PH not really rising. I bet I'll make it through the rest of the next ~6 weeks before I close without having to buy any muriatic acid at all. I expected I would of had to do that this year. Sounds like my alk being on the lower end is playing a part in that and obviously where I live compared to hotter climates like Vegas, etc. So that will be a bonus if I seldom will have to add acid....I expected I would be having to add it a lot based on some posts I've read…

Years ago I learned about lowering TA to slow pH rise, so I let my TA drop to 60-70. Ever since, pH stays stable all season (vinyl lined pool, AquaRite SWCG). I haven’t had to add acid in years.

 

[Hootz]

Just figured I'd continue to periodically update this through my chronicles of the SWG system lol. So it's almost been 6 weeks now since I've installed it.....and I still haven't had to add 1 single thing to my pool since installing. I sort of don't know what to do with myself. Pretty much periodically empty skimmers and throw the robot in, and that's all I've had to do in a month in a half.

I try to run tests once a week (double checking FC at more frequent intervals) and everything is staying where they were the last 3 weeks. FC 9 PH 7.3-7.4, alk 60, cya 60, CH 175, salt 3200. I would hate to run these tests without my magnetic stirrer now. So glad I bought the Pro kit which had that. If anyone reading doesn't have one, you may want to take advantage of their blue light one on clearance for $28 or $38 for the taylor one ( Magnetic Stirring Devices ). It's so worth it with the powder FC checks.

One interesting note is my FC. So about 2 weeks ago I checked my FC and it was up to 12. I had already lowered swg to 25% (from 30%) when it was at 10 so i expected it to hold it/go down slightly. It had actually went up. So now for the last 2 weeks I've only been running my SWG at 15% and its holding FC at 9. Mid to late July was the 100 degree temps and the last 3-4 we've had milder (upper 80's low 90's) temps so it's a good lesson on how much FC loss you have depending on sun. Except on the hottest part of the summer, I'm betting 15-20% is going to probably hold me most of the time. Better than what I expected.

I guess the only thing I was a little surprised about is my PH not really rising. I bet I'll make it through the rest of the next ~6 weeks before I close without having to buy any muriatic acid at all. I expected I would of had to do that this year. Sounds like my alk being on the lower end is playing a part in that and obviously where I live compared to hotter climates like Vegas, etc. So that will be a bonus if I seldom will have to add acid....I expected I would be having to add it a lot based on some posts I've read.

Next step will be starting to look at what I need to do to close it properly. I closed it myself last year but didn't really know what the heck I was doing. FC was only 3-4 when I closed it so pool was slightly green when opening in March (though a few days of shock/filtration cleared it up). Sounds like a tentative plan is get FC up to slam a few days prior and let it dwindle down and maybe that will hold. I'm also back and forth on rather to use RV/pool antifreeze. I used a few gallons last year just to idiot proof it in case I missed something closing my first time. Need to research more on if adding just a few gallons over time will negatively effect pool. I like the peace of mind but I also think I do a good job of making sure everything is closed up. My shop vac wasn't enough to blow out the main drain on the bottom (could do everything else) but my friend had a cyclone that we used. That thing cleared it out in 2 seconds lol. I'll be able to borrow it again but wish I had something else cheaper than a cyclone but strong enough to blow the main drain out. All stuff to research in the next 6 weeks or so.

The secret to closing your pool is waiting until the water temp gets to 60 degrees and fall is well on it's way ( little chance of warming up). About the first week of October for me. At 60 degrees there is little chance of any bacteria growing even with very low fc. You also should open it early in the spring before the water temp gets much above 60 degrees. I don't use any line antifreeze ( I am further North than you). As far as blowing out the lines I use a mid sized air compressor (21 gallon) at around 5 lbs pressure. No problem blowing out the main.

 

[bbillingsley1985]

Just another update. It's now been 9-10 weeks since I installed the SWG, and still same story. Haven't had to add a single thing to the pool....all levels have pretty much stayed in the same spot they were 2 months ago.

Anticipating the closing and next season. I plan in the next 1-2 weeks to close the pool. Hootz is actually right in my neck of the woods so that was good information for me. This will be the 2nd time now that I've closed my own pool. I'll be able to use a buddies cyclone again so blowing out the lines will be no problem. The first year I lowered the water all the way to where it was just below the 4 return lines (following a youtube video). That made it easy to make sure all water was blown out. After doing that though, I double checked with the pool company and they told me that for a vinyl pool its not a good practice to keep the water that low because it can stretch out the sides more, etc.....don't really remember their reason but to be safe I went ahead and spent 6 or so hours with the water hose and topped it back off to where it was just a few inches below the skimmer, then used a pump to pump excess out in the winter as needed.

Alternatively, what I was told is, using the blower (cyclone), blow it through the returns and you will see bubbles shooting out of all the returns.....cap off each one individually as the air comes through (starting with closest one) and that will achieve the same purpose without having to drain the water below the returns. I'm curious what others opinion of this is and which is the best way to do it? The only other question I'll have is rather or not to use pool/RV antifreeze as a safety in case I inadvertently mess something up. I used about 3-4 total gallons last year as a safety but then I read that even RV antifreeze can over time not be good for the pool. I'm almost inclined to not use it but also nervous that I may mess up something.

Last question I need to answer. My FC is right at 8 and my SWG has only been set to 10% the last 3 or so weeks and its been holding that. How high should I raise the FC to when closing and should I turn up the SWG a bit to get it there or just buy jugs of chlorine? I've read differing things but what I was thinking is just get it up to a FC of 15 or so. I could either turn my SWG up to 35% or something for a week and it'll probably get it there or should I spent about $15 at walmart for jugs of chlorine? I know people generally say chlorine is better but since my SWG isn't having to work hard at all, I don't see much harm in turning it up a little over the next week or so before I close to bump it up there without having to dump any chlorine in. I guess in short....what FC level should I shoot for and what's the best means of getting it there in my situation.

 

[Texas Splash]

We are careful to not lower the water level too much in vinyl pools not only for areas with a high water table, but the water helps keep the walls and liner in-place. Lowering just below the jets probably wasn't a big deal as I suspect winter rains will fill it up again anyways. As for blowing out the lines, either is fine. Exposing the return jets is just a bit easier to see and work with, while under water you may need a second set of hands or rely on Duck Plugs that won't let the water back into the pipe. Using antifreeze is another personal choice. Some people just feel better using it. It won't hurt the pool or water and more than likely will get consumed by the chlorine over time. As for the FC level, we generally recommend increasing the FC to about SLAM level just before disconnecting things so that you have a good, healthy FC level for a few months. If the water is chilly, using liquid chlorine may be more convenient and quicker.

Closing an In Ground Pool

Winterizing a pool is essential for keeping your in-ground pool protected during cold-weather months. This Pool Repair guide will show you how to do it.

www.troublefreepool.com

 

[bbillingsley1985]

Just thought I'd continue to update this thread rather than create a new one as I continue to chronicle my pool journey.

So last year I was able to get the pool closed with little issues in early October. I got the chlorine levels to near slam level, blew out all the lines, drained it to just a few inches below the skimmer and added just a gallon total of the RV antifreeze spread out along the 2 skimmers and the return pipe for a little peace of mind. On about a monthly basis, I would use my sump pump type deal to drain out water as it filled and at the same time I'd go ahead and run my robot vacuum to keep it as clean as possible. Pool has stayed crystal clear and in good shape.

Here in the next week or two I plan to open it. As of today it is still crystal clear but I did buy a few gallons of liquid chlorine to potentially use to give it a good jolt of chlorine (if tests show it low) so the SWG won't have to work hard in colder temps to get it there. The main questions I'm going to work through is I'm curious how my ph, alk and cya changed during the offseason. When I closed the pool pH was 7.4 (never had to adjust it all summer), TA 60 and CYA was 60. The CYA of 60 was on the lower end for swg but because my swg was easily generating what I needed at only 10% use I didn't worry about it increasing it. Here are my questions:

1. Obviously I will run the actual test when I open it but my expectation is that my CYA will be low. I would guestimate maybe half the pool was drained and refilled with rain water over the winter so my guess is maybe it'll be around 30 or so. If we assume its around 30 (again I'll test to get exact level) is the best path just to buy stabilizer? I did notice walmart has clorox stabilizer for around $20 for a 4 lb bag of it. I get scared of anything clorox but it does say 100% cya on the bag. I may search around old posts here to see if there's a different stabilizer that you guys recommend to buy that's maybe a bigger package of 10 lbs or so. The other thing is I have still probably 15 bags of dichlor shock from sams club ( Let us know you're not a robot - Sam's Club ). Instead of dumping in the liquid chlorine, I could dump in some of that. The math works out to about 3 cya gain per 1 lb bag for my pool. I do also have probably 30 lbs of the 3" tablets that would also raise about 3 cya per. So I have a decision to make of just using ballpark about 10 combined shock bags and tablets over the next month to get it up that way or just buy the stabalizer, add it and let the swg do its thing at low levels. For those that have more experince than me on that, what's the best option? If stabalizer, I'm reading about putting it in a sock or something similar near returns. Is that necessary for a vinyl pool? It would be a mistake to just dump it straight into the pool as the bag was saying?

2. I'm going to guess that my pH and TA will also be a little low from the rainwater but if I recall correctly last year I think it was 7.2 when I opened. I was able to avoid buying and having to use muriatic acid all of last year (installed SWG around 4th of July so half the summer) so I want to be careful not to raise it too high. Would the recommendation basically be to make sure TA and pH is maybe on the lower end (7.2+ on pH and 50+ on TA) with the expectation that it will probably rise as we reach summer etc or should I go ahead and try to hit ideal levels of 70 TA, 7.4/7.6 pH?

3. I think I have a handle on CH, salt levels (i expect to have to add some with all the draining) and the rest. The other new thing for me will be managing chlorine for the first month. My expectation is that the pool water will be warm enough for the SWG to run (although maybe close to the lowest end at times) so I pretty much figured to just give it a good jolt of chlorine to start from either the dichlor or bleach and then when all the levels are good and pools is nice and clean, go ahead and reattach my salt cell and let it do its thing (I bought a bypass to use when I closed pool so that i could store the cell out of the elements indoors during the offseason). Does this sound like a good plan?

Just trying to make sure all my ducks are in a row and I have a good plan for how I will open it.

 

[Newdude]

I get scared of anything clorox but it does say 100% cya on the bag.

It's been good to date. Always check the bag for 100% CYA and you're golden.

I'm reading about putting it in a sock or something similar near returns. Is that necessary for a vinyl pool?

Yes. It's acid and you don't want it sitting on the floor of any pool. You can toss the sock in a skimmer but if the pump stops or there is a power outage and you're not watching, it can eat the PVC. If you can guarantee flow through the skimmer, it'll be diluted enough to be safe.

Or just carrot and stick it in front a return and squish it out later. It's rarely an immediate rush, especially at the beginning of the season.

Would the recommendation basically be to make sure TA and pH is maybe on the lower end (7.2+ on pH and 50+ on TA)

60-70 TA and targeting high 7s for PH seems to be real stable for most.

I pretty much figured to just give it a good jolt of chlorine to start from either the dichlor or bleach and then when all the levels are good and pools is nice and clean, go ahead and reattach my salt cell and let it do its thing

Exactly that. SWGs add sloooooowly. If you ever test and need a *now* boost, traditional chlorine mixes in minutes. If you have plenty of FC above minimum and just want a little more because you caught the daily loss increasing in time, you can let the cell handle the difference.

Always pay closer attention anytime you adjust the cell for a few days because it's easy to over/under shoot. Once you're happy you guessed correctly, then be on the lookout for the next needed adjustment in a couple weeks.

Think of it like cruise control. You have to be doing the highway speed before you let it take over. If you want to adjust a couple MPH once moving well, then let the cruise control handle +/- 3 MPH with a few clicks.

 

[bbillingsley1985]

Thanks for the info. If you were me you think just buying stabilizer and using it to relatively quickly increase the cya is the best plan compared to using my old 3" tabs / dichlor shock from before I got the swg? The money is nothing but also don't think I'll hardly ever use the shock/tabs again. Ive also had them close to 2 years now so not sure of the shelf life. If for some reason when I do open it and the pool is a little green, I assume it would be ok to dump X bags of dichlor to get it to slam levels instead of liquid chlorine? I guess my tentative thinking is if its still crystal clear when I open and I don't have to slam, I'll just do the stabilizer but if for some reason I need to slam it and its ok to use the dichlor instead of liquid chlorine, I may do that to kill 2 birds with 1 stone. That said though, since I got it to slam when I closed it I'm still expecting it to be fine. It's definitely fine at the moment but I was going to maybe wait 1-2 more weeks before I open to let the temps rise a bit more.

BTW, I love the cruise control analogy. That's a perfect way of putting it with SWG's.

 

[Newdude]

Tabs are good forever when stored dry and reasonably close to room temperature. There's also no harm in using them up when you know where you're at, and what they'll do to your pool.

However. Numero UNO importante. Before adding CYA over 30, Overnight Chlorine Loss Test. If below 30 at opening, raise to 30 but do not go higher or your SLAM targets will be that much higher. (40% of CYA).

If you read the fine details of the OCLT, it wants you to start about 10 PPM FC for the test, and at that point with 30 CYA, SLAM is only a 12. So I SLAM first and ask questions later. If there was a SLAM need, you're 12 hours into the battle before it even starts.

 

[bbillingsley1985]

Very good point. Thank you!