- Feb 2, 2021
- 221
- Pool Size
- 12500
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- CircuPool RJ-45
Converting to salt.
- Thread starter MA5177
- Start date
- Status
- Jul 17, 2019
- 4,070
- Pool Size
- 13000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
Its all run through my automation system that controls all of my equipment. Mine is an Intellicenter, but each of the major manufactures have their own line of automation systems, sometimes more than one. Do you have one in your current setup?
Below is the screen from mine. My SWCG is turned off now because the water is colder than 54 degrees, but to adjust my chlorine output, I just change the % output next to Pool and Spa (set to 5% and 10% currently).
- Feb 2, 2021
- 221
- Pool Size
- 12500
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- CircuPool RJ-45
My current setup consists of a pump, filter and mechanical timer LOL! That is pretty cool
- Jul 17, 2019
- 4,070
- Pool Size
- 13000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
Thanks. The automation is cool, but I wouldnt get one just for a SWCG. In your setup, you would just walk over to the equipment pad and make the adjustment to the % output, usually via a touch pad and up/down arrows. Unless you really want to micro-manage it, you can usually get by with adjusting the % output about once a season depending on the weather and how much you use your pool.
mguzzy
Gold Supporter
You are right the cost is a wash.. but that is only if you are looking at the direct comparison of the cost of chlorine VS the cost of the SWG... that doesn't not take into account your time. Is your time worth anything? Mine is, I bill hourly. SWG are hugely convenient in the amount to time you save fussing with the chems and hauling chlorine. And by that measure I paid off my $1500 investment in my SWG in the first year. By most dollar by dollar comparisons a SWG will cost the same as about 3 to 5 years worth of chlorine (ironically that is the length of the warranties on these gizmos). So depending on how long it lasts is another factor. Without knowing what I was doing my first SWG cell lasted 9 years.. that means the last 5 years or so was FREE CHLORINE! Then the replacement was only the cell, not the whole unit. So now my outlay was ~$500 for equipment for the next ~10 yrs. I am on my second cell and after having discovered TFP I think I am doing a better job of managing my chem so I expect this cell to last longer.. (fingers crossed). And I have had the same SWG controller installed since 2005.. heck, the toasters in my house don't last that long... imagine the cost if I had to go to Starbux everytime I wanted toast!
Second... @Newdude chimed in with.. "you need to run your pump all the time" well not really. The Dude has a VSP.. its different if you have single speed. You can run a variable speed pump longer and the flow rates are also much slower, and the cost to operate is cheaper than a single speed pump. Sounds like you have a single speed pump and have a VSP ready to install. Go for it. I'm still running on a single speed pump. Right now its not cost effective for me to change, yeah It will be cheaper to run, but it will take me almost 10yrs to recoup the cost. So until then I'll wait for electricity prices to sky rocket, or a killer rebate or if it dies then I will replace it. But for now, my pool (see the specs in my sig) can get enough FC with a runtime of about 5.5 hours running between 30-70% output depending on the bather load, time of the season etc.
Third, are all the other cool benefits of a salt water pool that you can't put a price tag on... like how it feels, How easy it is on people with sensitive skin, etc etc.
Yeah, it won't generate when the water temp is below ~50 deg depending on the cell... but that depends on your swim season in SoCal... Here in the northern part of the state no one wants to swim in the pool when its that cold anyway for a few months. that's my two cents.. time to go, my bagel just popped up...
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Rattus Suffocatus
Silver Supporter
- Jun 5, 2019
- 1,713
- Pool Size
- 14000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- CircuPool Universal40
The cost of the cells is going up a lot. It isn't a wash anymore. It isn't also much more than a wash and it's FAR easier. I do like the convenience and here in Tucson I was too cold for generation for about 2.5 weeks. (!) I figured I'd be out for three months, but nope. Warmish winter here this year but even if that was six it still is amazing. It shuts down if its turned on at 50F water temperature in the morning. For a couple of weeks I'd cycle it in the afternoon and it would then run....
I have my 40K Universal 40 in my 15K m/l pool running for 8 hours now at ... get this... 5% ... to keep the level up enough at 50F. In the heat of the summer I have to turn it up to about 50%. So having an oversized unit is pretty nice.
I have a VSP and as long as you push enough water through it that the flow sensor is happy, it does work. I run all but the first 2 hours in the morning at about 175W-200W ... pool looks pretty good now except for all of the xeroscaping rocks the dogs have knocked in over the winter. One big cleanup in the spring and we should be GTG...
I still think it works at current prices. If they rise much more though then liquid chlorine or even pucks and water changes may become less expensive.
Only other gripe is that at least my SWCG is sensitive to TA. So I do have to use a lot of acid to drive it down so it doesn't scale up. But the water is kinda terrible here to start with.
I have my 40K Universal 40 in my 15K m/l pool running for 8 hours now at ... get this... 5% ... to keep the level up enough at 50F. In the heat of the summer I have to turn it up to about 50%. So having an oversized unit is pretty nice.
I have a VSP and as long as you push enough water through it that the flow sensor is happy, it does work. I run all but the first 2 hours in the morning at about 175W-200W ... pool looks pretty good now except for all of the xeroscaping rocks the dogs have knocked in over the winter. One big cleanup in the spring and we should be GTG...
I still think it works at current prices. If they rise much more though then liquid chlorine or even pucks and water changes may become less expensive.
Only other gripe is that at least my SWCG is sensitive to TA. So I do have to use a lot of acid to drive it down so it doesn't scale up. But the water is kinda terrible here to start with.
- Feb 2, 2021
- 221
- Pool Size
- 12500
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- CircuPool RJ-45
Im in Orange County, California. Water is pretty hard here too at about 250+ total devolved solids in our city water.
So what I have learned in the past couple days about SWG.... Cons: fairly expensive startup, uses more acid than using pucks w/ conditioner, have to run the pump a lot longer than normal, high replacement costs, needs to be cleaned and maintained, need to keep up on the salt content, one more thing to break.
Pros: Less or no chlorine to buy and add
Im still not sold on it, I remember when People I knew used to say “ I have a salt water pool and don’t use chlorine ” like it was something unique or special. But they didn’t even realize they still have a chlorine pool LOL.
Since we may be moving in a couple years or maybe sooner I think I’m sticking with the old tried and true chlorine pucks
- Nov 12, 2017
- 12,639
- Pool Size
- 12300
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
Spoken like one who's never had an SWG! 
Kidding. Your reasoning is sound, especially the part about moving and not being able to recoup the initial investment. That's a fair point. SWGs last for many years, but need to be owned for all those years to get your ROI.
I could quibble:
- Yes, you buy less chlorine, but significantly less. Like 90-100% less.
- And yes, it seems acid consumption goes up, but a true comparison should state that it seems like more than it is. "Conditioner" in a puck is acid. When you stop using pucks for an SWG, you stop adding the conditioner/acid, so yes, you have to add some acid, but that's only because you stopped adding acid.
- Humans, chlorine and acid leave salt behind, as a byproduct. So not all pools need to "keep up on the salt content." If anything, they have to figure out how to lower it, just as they would in a non-SWG pool. If you live in a climate with a lot of rain, or otherwise lose a lot of pool water (other than by evaporation), then yes, you might have to keep up. I add about a bag a year, once a year. $7.
- Following TFP guidelines for chemical balance minimizes and in most cases eliminates any reason to clean an SWG. There is no other maintenance, other than adjusting the output % a few times a year. And that's a push of a button or a click of a mouse.
The initial startup cost argument is valid. As is the notion of running your pump longer. One more thing to break: absolutely.
Pros? Yes, less chlorine to buy and add... and drive to pick up, and lug from store to car, then car to house, then house to pool. So that's a trip to the store every week or two. And dosing your pool every day or two. Plus storing it all somewhere. You kind'a washed over those negatives that an SWG eliminates. With the exception of the odd party or two, I don't touch chlorine for at least nine months a year. And because my FC is so stable during all that time, I only have to test for it once a week. That is a HUGE reduction in pool maintenance over liquid chlorine users. And it is that reduction in chores that is at the core of all the support here for an SWG.
You also missed this pro. Because an SWG adds chlorine very often, a very little at a time, not only is your FC stable 24/7, you can lower your FC level some, which is nice for most of us who appreciate having a little less in the pool. And because pouring in liquid chlorine, every day, is such a drag, most folks will pour in more, so that they can go an extra day or two without having to do it, so they end up spiking their FC, and/or re-dosing only after FC drops dangerously low. So for a lot of the time, your FC is either uncomfortably high, or too close to not properly sanitizing your pool. Let's face it, we're lazy, and without an SWG the FC level is rarely going to be at the best level for your pool and your family...
SWG users can leave their pools for a week or two while away. Liquid chlorine users have to resort to using pucks or friends or neighbors. I think it's safe to say all three of those "solutions" are not sustainable.
I'd like to think that's a slightly fairer comparison...
Kidding. Your reasoning is sound, especially the part about moving and not being able to recoup the initial investment. That's a fair point. SWGs last for many years, but need to be owned for all those years to get your ROI.
I could quibble:
- Yes, you buy less chlorine, but significantly less. Like 90-100% less.
- And yes, it seems acid consumption goes up, but a true comparison should state that it seems like more than it is. "Conditioner" in a puck is acid. When you stop using pucks for an SWG, you stop adding the conditioner/acid, so yes, you have to add some acid, but that's only because you stopped adding acid.
- Humans, chlorine and acid leave salt behind, as a byproduct. So not all pools need to "keep up on the salt content." If anything, they have to figure out how to lower it, just as they would in a non-SWG pool. If you live in a climate with a lot of rain, or otherwise lose a lot of pool water (other than by evaporation), then yes, you might have to keep up. I add about a bag a year, once a year. $7.
- Following TFP guidelines for chemical balance minimizes and in most cases eliminates any reason to clean an SWG. There is no other maintenance, other than adjusting the output % a few times a year. And that's a push of a button or a click of a mouse.
The initial startup cost argument is valid. As is the notion of running your pump longer. One more thing to break: absolutely.
Pros? Yes, less chlorine to buy and add... and drive to pick up, and lug from store to car, then car to house, then house to pool. So that's a trip to the store every week or two. And dosing your pool every day or two. Plus storing it all somewhere. You kind'a washed over those negatives that an SWG eliminates. With the exception of the odd party or two, I don't touch chlorine for at least nine months a year. And because my FC is so stable during all that time, I only have to test for it once a week. That is a HUGE reduction in pool maintenance over liquid chlorine users. And it is that reduction in chores that is at the core of all the support here for an SWG.
You also missed this pro. Because an SWG adds chlorine very often, a very little at a time, not only is your FC stable 24/7, you can lower your FC level some, which is nice for most of us who appreciate having a little less in the pool. And because pouring in liquid chlorine, every day, is such a drag, most folks will pour in more, so that they can go an extra day or two without having to do it, so they end up spiking their FC, and/or re-dosing only after FC drops dangerously low. So for a lot of the time, your FC is either uncomfortably high, or too close to not properly sanitizing your pool. Let's face it, we're lazy, and without an SWG the FC level is rarely going to be at the best level for your pool and your family...
SWG users can leave their pools for a week or two while away. Liquid chlorine users have to resort to using pucks or friends or neighbors. I think it's safe to say all three of those "solutions" are not sustainable.
I'd like to think that's a slightly fairer comparison...
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mguzzy
Gold Supporter
MA... you must be retired? Just a guess if your time is not a consideration in factoring the cost of an SWG. I get it.. when my dad retired and he started doing projects around the house.. he figued his time and labor were free. Otherwise he would be watching the soaps all day... not say that is what you are doing
And YES.. a saltwater, SWG chlorinated pool.. is still a chlorine pool, the chlorine is just from different source. Once I added the salt to my pool maintenance doses are about two 40 pound bags a year.. that is ~$13 bux.
I will argue the benefit of a SWG pool all day.. The only downside I can think of is it makes one lazy about monitoring their pool.. because its about as close to maintenance free as one can get.
If you are looking at the ROI for a two year window.. well that's another story.
And YES.. a saltwater, SWG chlorinated pool.. is still a chlorine pool, the chlorine is just from different source. Once I added the salt to my pool maintenance doses are about two 40 pound bags a year.. that is ~$13 bux.
I will argue the benefit of a SWG pool all day.. The only downside I can think of is it makes one lazy about monitoring their pool.. because its about as close to maintenance free as one can get.
If you are looking at the ROI for a two year window.. well that's another story.
Rattus Suffocatus
Silver Supporter
- Jun 5, 2019
- 1,713
- Pool Size
- 14000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- CircuPool Universal40
Bleach/Liquid Chlorine breaks down into salt. I had a salt level of 800 PPM when I started the SWCG and that wasn't even a full year on bleach. You can use water softener salt at $5 a bag. SO the cost of salt is negligible. I might need to add a bag in the spring, but probably not. I might just put in a 1/4 of a bag from the water softener.
Running the pump longer? Not if you have a big enough SWCG. I could probably run the pump two hours a day total now if I wanted to total. In the summer.. if I went to 100%, probably 4 hours?
Cleaning.. It's at about 9 months old now.. I've descaled it once. I need to do it again before I open up the pool It took 20 minutes to do.
Acid.. yes you use a lot more... maybe 4x. It's still much much much less than hauling bleach. In a year I've gone though maybe 5 gallon of acid?
Mainly, though it's nice that you can not worry about the pool for about a week if something comes up, even in the summer. It's probably worth it for that alone... I am concerned about the rare earth metals prices now, but I am sure that all of this eventually will pass....
Everyone in the family likes the feel of the water better too. The salt buffers the water to be closer to your own fluids....
Running the pump longer? Not if you have a big enough SWCG. I could probably run the pump two hours a day total now if I wanted to total. In the summer.. if I went to 100%, probably 4 hours?
Cleaning.. It's at about 9 months old now.. I've descaled it once. I need to do it again before I open up the pool It took 20 minutes to do.
Acid.. yes you use a lot more... maybe 4x. It's still much much much less than hauling bleach. In a year I've gone though maybe 5 gallon of acid?
Mainly, though it's nice that you can not worry about the pool for about a week if something comes up, even in the summer. It's probably worth it for that alone... I am concerned about the rare earth metals prices now, but I am sure that all of this eventually will pass....
Everyone in the family likes the feel of the water better too. The salt buffers the water to be closer to your own fluids....
- Nov 12, 2017
- 12,639
- Pool Size
- 12300
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
As you can see, we here at TFP are actually all robots, spewing the exact same pro-SWG propaganda our microchip brains have been programmed with... 
- Jul 21, 2013
- 65,127
- Pool Size
- 35000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
- Feb 2, 2021
- 221
- Pool Size
- 12500
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- CircuPool RJ-45
MA... you must be retired? Just a guess if your time is not a consideration in factoring the cost of an SWG. I get it.. when my dad retired and he started doing projects around the house.. he figued his time and labor were free. Otherwise he would be watching the soaps all day... not say that is what you are doing
Also Yes an SWG causes a rise in pH and it needs to be controlled by adding an occasional does of MA.. but the amount of Acid I use is pretty minimal.. perhaps two gallons over the course of the summer... that less than $20 bux.
And YES.. a saltwater, SWG chlorinated pool.. is still a chlorine pool, the chlorine is just from different source. Once I added the salt to my pool maintenance doses are about two 40 pound bags a year.. that is ~$13 bux.
I will argue the benefit of a SWG pool all day.. The only downside I can think of is it makes one lazy about monitoring their pool.. because its about as close to maintenance free as one can get.
If you are looking at the ROI for a two year window.. well that's another story.
Thanks for all the feedback all, no I’m not retired and no I don’t have a lot of time to mess with the pool probably why it’s in bad shape to begin with.
Once I get the pool all re tiled, plastered etc I may take a second look at adding the SWG. I don’t mind spending some money if it saves me a lot of time.
For now I’m concentrating on picking a robot and other stuff, we demo high end houses and I have thrown out some of these SWG systems without really knowing much about them
That said I’m gunna keep a lookout for another.But being in the business I am, I have got lots of pumps and filters over the years, most of them I sold but I have a pretty good setup now plus a VSP I need to test and install
mguzzy
Gold Supporter
Well kewl.. surplus werks!.. I would learn how to read the date codes on the cells so you know how to find one with some life left in it.. you are welcome to chime in and ask about any booty you have recovered!Thanks for all the feedback all, no I’m not retired and no I don’t have a lot of time to mess with the pool probably why it’s in bad shape to begin with.
....
For now I’m concentrating on picking a robot and other stuff, we demo high end houses and I have thrown out some of these SWG systems without really knowing much about them
But being in the business I am, I have got lots of pumps and filters over the years, most of them I sold but I have a pretty good setup now plus a VSP I need to test and install
I hope you didn't take exception to the "are you retired" crack.. my snarcsm knob has been turned on high lately!
- Feb 2, 2021
- 221
- Pool Size
- 12500
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- CircuPool RJ-45
Haha no all good here my friend, my skin is pretty thick on the internet.
- Feb 2, 2021
- 221
- Pool Size
- 12500
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- CircuPool RJ-45
So... what is the go to brand for a SWG? IC40?
One more SWG drawback thought about... Using your pool water as a backup drinking water supply! Having all that salt in there is probably no good to drink, in a SHTF situation could you drink it?
One more SWG drawback thought about... Using your pool water as a backup drinking water supply! Having all that salt in there is probably no good to drink, in a SHTF situation could you drink it?
- Nov 12, 2017
- 12,639
- Pool Size
- 12300
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
All pools are saltwater pools, and none are particularly good for drinking. Any filter you'd have to have to make pool water potable would also take out the salt, if you dared. A SWG is not a pro or con for drinking out of your pool.
Using liquid chlorine and muriatic acid and swimming in your pool all leave salt behind. Salt doesn't evaporate with the water. So it eventually accumulates. SWG or no, you'll eventually have a saltwater pool.
I would recommend a Pentair IC20/40/60 SWG only if you have a Pentair automation controller. Since we can't seem to coerce you into filling out your signature (hint, not-so-subtle-hint), we don't know what you've got. If you don't have automation, then CircuPool seems to be the go-to SWG brand here at TFP. If you do have automation, or plan to someday, your SWG brand should match that of your automation. I've never owned a CircuPool (I have Pentair automation and an IC40), but many here that have CircuPool swear by them.
Using liquid chlorine and muriatic acid and swimming in your pool all leave salt behind. Salt doesn't evaporate with the water. So it eventually accumulates. SWG or no, you'll eventually have a saltwater pool.
I would recommend a Pentair IC20/40/60 SWG only if you have a Pentair automation controller. Since we can't seem to coerce you into filling out your signature (hint, not-so-subtle-hint), we don't know what you've got. If you don't have automation, then CircuPool seems to be the go-to SWG brand here at TFP. If you do have automation, or plan to someday, your SWG brand should match that of your automation. I've never owned a CircuPool (I have Pentair automation and an IC40), but many here that have CircuPool swear by them.
- Feb 2, 2021
- 221
- Pool Size
- 12500
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- CircuPool RJ-45
Good to know about the salt , as for the signature... isn’t that listed under my screen name? I will look into how to fill it out.
But basically no I do not have automation or anything hi tech at all, what I have is a 60 cu foot pentair DE filter and a single speed 1 hp pump... oh and a standard mechanical timer. Basic stuff
Thanks for suggesting the circupool , I will look into those, I don’t really want to spend a fortune on a SWG system, mainly because we MAY be moving in a couple years
- Nov 12, 2017
- 12,639
- Pool Size
- 12300
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
- Nov 12, 2017
- 12,639
- Pool Size
- 12300
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
There's virtually nothing you can do to a working swimming pool to increase the resale value of your home. Any money you spend on it will just be a house-warming gift for the next owner, that won't even be recognized or appreciated as one until after they move in. You probably shouldn't put any money into the pool until you decide to stay.
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