Variable speed pump power connection

[Chgorob1]

I just upgraded my IntelliCenter system with a Pentair 3hp variable speed pump from a single speed pump. I successfully connected the control wires to the panel. However the problem lies in a variable speed pump needs to have power all the time and right now when it calls to turn off it cuts the power completely.
Do I just disconnect power from the relay and connect directly the circuit breaker to the pump? Or do I still need a jumper to give power to that relay for some other reason?
Here are some photos maybe I am completely wrong.

 

[Jimrahbe]

C,

I assume you do not have a salt cell, as I don't see one.

This means that the Pump/Filter relay (upper left) is not really used now with a VS pump.

The fix is very simple. With the power off... On the pump/filter relay, just move the wire from pin 2 and connect it to pin 1 and move the wire on pin 4 and connect it to pin 3. You should end up with two wires on pin1 and two wires on pin 3 and nothing on pins 2 or 4.

Your pump will now have constant AC power.

Might want to turn the power back on..

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Dirk]

@Jimrahbe, he's got a booster pump on a dedicated breaker running through relay #2. Shouldn't that also be wired through the pool relay, so that the booster pump can't come on unless the main pump is also running (both relay #1 and #2 would have to be closed)? Or is that only done with mechanical timers, and the booster pump protection redundancy is achieved in some other way?

 

[Jimrahbe]

Dirk,

His current system is not set up that way. If he has not had any issues with this in the past, then I see no reason to change.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Chgorob1]

Dirk,

His current system is not set up that way. If he has not had any issues with this in the past, then I see no reason to change.

Thanks,

Jim R.

When I first got my IntelliCenter I did have the problem where the booster pump could go on without the main pump going with it and not only would sweeper not work correctly but I was afraid booster would overheat. The installer since fixed that, I am assuming within the software?
Also I just tested it and the pool primed and went on When I turn on the booster (Sweeper) via the Intellicenter panel.
Although I did get this error (which I was constantly getting when the pump powered off).
Thank you!

 

[Chgorob1]

C,

I assume you do not have a salt cell, as I don't see one.

This means that the Pump/Filter relay (upper left) is not really used now with a VS pump.

The fix is very simple. With the power off... On the pump/filter relay, just move the wire from pin 2 and connect it to pin 1 and move the wire on pin 4 and connect it to pin 3. You should end up with two wires on pin1 and two wires on pin 3 and nothing on pins 2 or 4.

Your pump will now have constant AC power.

Might want to turn the power back on..

Thanks,

Jim R.

So I completed that and here’s a picture. When I turn the pool function off the VSF no longer loses power. Thank you!
I was hoping that the air saying communication lost we go away but it still comes on but only sometimes now. I knew without power it couldn’t communicate but I thought that would fix it.

Also I was using from left to right the four bottom pins as one through four.
However as you can see there are actually small numbers next to them and the two above that go to the control panel.

So I hope I did it correctly.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Rob,

You got that error because the VS pump was powered "through" the pump/filter relay. When the relay shut off, the pump would lose power, and that would cause the communications to report an error as the pump was powering down.

I assume they set the booster pump to run as master cleaner, which I think makes the filter pump come on first. But then again, I live in this Century and have a robot cleaner, so have not played with exactly how the booster works.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Rob,

Your wiring is correct. I was just following your lead on the numbers. Almost everyone says 1, 2, 3, 4, but I agree, that is not how the relay is labeled.

Your pump should no longer report a loss of compunctions failure, so I am puzzled why it is doing it now???

Please run this test. With the system in Auto Mode, and the VS pump running, go look at the pump's display. It should say, "Display Not Active"..

If it does, put the IntelliCenter into the Service Mode, and see what the pump's display shows after about 30 seconds or so... It should show RPM or something other than "Display not active" and it should allow you to run the pump from the pump's control panel. Putting the system back into Auto Mode will restart the pump, but it might take a minute or so..

Just to be clear, you should not normally be turning the pump on and off by pushing any buttons. It should run on a schedule. If when running the schedule you need to shut the pump off, you should just put the system in the Service mode.

When you do that you should not get a com error.

Please let me know what happens.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Chgorob1]

Rob,

You got that error because the VS pump was powered "through" the pump/filter relay. When the relay shut off, the pump would lose power, and that would cause the communications to report an error as the pump was powering down.

I assume they set the booster pump to run as master cleaner, which I think makes the filter pump come on first. But then again, I live in this Century and have a robot cleaner, so have not played with exactly how the booster works.

Thanks,

Jim R.

Wow I didn’t know my Nautilis was so antiquated
OK what is the best robot so when it craps out I can buy that?

 

[Chgorob1]

Also I have a zero depth pool entry so would a robot leave the pool? Or do you set up some kind of barrier like a robot vac?

 

[Chgorob1]

Rob,

Your wiring is correct. I was just following your lead on the numbers. Almost everyone says 1, 2, 3, 4, but I agree, that is not how the relay is labeled.

Your pump should no longer report a loss of compunctions failure, so I am puzzled why it is doing it now???

Please run this test. With the system in Auto Mode, and the VS pump running, go look at the pump's display. It should say, "Display Not Active"..

If it does, put the IntelliCenter into the Service Mode, and see what the pump's display shows after about 30 seconds or so... It should show RPM or something other than "Display not active" and it should allow you to run the pump from the pump's control panel. Putting the system back into Auto Mode will restart the pump, but it might take a minute or so..

Just to be clear, you should not normally be turning the pump on and off by pushing any buttons. It should run on a schedule. If when running the schedule you need to shut the pump off, you should just put the system in the Service mode.

When you do that you should not get a com error.

Please let me know what happens.

Thanks,

Jim R.

OK when I turned on the pool in auto mode it immediately showed the RPMs etc. and no error. Then for kicks I put it in spa mode and it updated the RPMs still no error.
Then from spa when I pushed the Cleaner button the mode automatically switched to Pool mode, but now I got that error so I think it only comes on for the cleaner right now.
I can still run your test but I wanted to give you this information.

 

[Chgorob1]

Update it took a few minutes but even with the cleaner on it now shows the correct information in the display. So does that mean it’s going to give me an air for a few minutes every time?

 

[Jimrahbe]

Rob,

I have a pretty liberal use of the word "Century."

Sorry, but I am confused as to what you are seeing, or what is going on.

Let's start over...

Is your pump running a schedule, or are you just pushing buttons to turn it on?

Try this.

With the system in the Auto mode and Pool circuit on. What does the pump's display show after 30 seconds or so???

Show me your screenshots of your schedules or just tell me what they are.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Dirk]

With today's energy costs, a pressure-side cleaner like yours, which requires both the main pump and a booster pump, is one of the least cost-effective ways to clean a pool. If you go robot, the issue of how your booster pump is wired and/or scheduled will be moot.

I had my plumbing converted so I could switch from a pressure-side cleaner to a suction-side type, which eliminated the need for my booster pump. So a bit less energy.

A robot, which doesn't need any pump to be running, and does its thing via a small, on-board motor, is that much more energy efficient.

Robots also brush the finish, including the edge tile, which the other types of cleaners don't do (or not as well). So there's that.

I have reasons to still prefer my suction-side cleaner to a robot, but that's a topic for a different post. You'll find lots of opinions here about robot brands. Never owned one myself, so I can't help with that.

 

[Chgorob1]

Rob,

I have a pretty liberal use of the word "Century."

Sorry, but I am confused as to what you are seeing, or what is going on.

Let's start over...

Is your pump running a schedule, or are you just pushing buttons to turn it on?

Try this.

With the system in the Auto mode and Pool circuit on. What does the pump's display show after 30 seconds or so???

Show me your screenshots of your schedules or just tell me what they are.

Thanks,

Jim R.

My pool is set up on schedules which I will attach. The majority are the big waterfall on the hour you can skip over probably. I will be making some modifications now that I have variable speed but this is what it is right now.
I put it in pool mode by pushing the button on the touchscreen.
I’m not entirely sure what auto mode is but I am assuming it’s when you’re running schedules and the opposite of service mode.
You can see from the pictures I start from scratch and initially I get the error badge but when I clicked it, about 10 seconds later , it switched to the RPM display and no longer had an error.

Let me know if I forgot something important

 

[Chgorob1]

With today's energy costs, a pressure-side cleaner like yours, which requires both the main pump and a booster pump, is one of the least cost-effective ways to clean a pool. If you go robot, the issue of how your booster pump is wired and/or scheduled will be moot.

I had my plumbing converted so I could switch from a pressure-side cleaner to a suction-side type, which eliminated the need for my booster pump. So a bit less energy.

A robot, which doesn't need any pump to be running, and does its thing via a small, on-board motor, is that much more energy efficient.

Robots also brush the finish, including the edge tile, which the other types of cleaners don't do (or not as well). So there's that.

I have reasons to still prefer my suction-side cleaner to a robot, but that's a topic for a different post. You'll find lots of opinions here about robot brands. Never owned one myself, so I can help with that.

Thank you that’s helpful. I currently have pebble Tec at the latter part of it’s life so would a robot be any worse than my Polaris?

 

[Jimrahbe]

I'll be back tomorrow...

Jim R.

 

[Dirk]

Thank you that’s helpful. I currently have pebble Tec at the latter part of it’s life so would a robot be any worse than my Polaris?

Worse in what way? Worse wearing out the Pebble? No, I don't think so. They each run around on wheels. The robot has a brush vs Polaris with that tail. If I had to guess I'd say the tail is worse, but I don't think either would impact the wear and tear on the pebble all that much.

I had a typo in my post. I meant to write that I've never owned a robot so can't be of any help recommending a brand. I think Jim can help with that, along with the programming. I used to have a Polaris. I hated that stupid tail. It took me a full day of abrading/bufffing to get its spray residue off my windows (previous home owner just let it shoot everywhere). I had a two-speed pump and a booster. When I switched to a VS pump and a suction-side cleaner my PG&E bill went down over $50 a month. That was about four years ago: 12 x 50 x 4 = $2,400! That's the pump and the vac!!

 

[Chgorob1]

Worse in what way? Worse wearing out the Pebble? No, I don't think so. They each run around on wheels. The robot has a brush vs Polaris with that tail. If I had to guess I'd say the tail is worse, but I don't think either would impact the wear and tear on the pebble all that much.

I had a typo in my post. I meant to write that I've never owned a robot so can't be of any help recommending a brand. I think Jim can help with that, along with the programming. I used to have a Polaris. I hated that stupid tail. It took me a full day of abrading/bufffing to get its spray residue off my windows (previous home owner just let it shoot everywhere). I had a two-speed pump and a booster. When I switched to a VS pump and a suction-side cleaner my PG&E bill went down over $50 a month. That was about four years ago: 12 x 50 x 4 = $2,400! That's the pump and the vac!!

Yes, wear on the pebble surface. Thank you!

 

[Chgorob1]

I'll be back tomorrow...

Jim R.

OK lmk. Also I just added a 24 hour schedule for just the pool filter pump to run at low speed. Because it’s 24 hours it instantly activated and as of five minutes later still has that no communication error. So apparently I still have some kind of issue .
I especially wanted to make sure it was running at the speed I set. If there’s a communication error is there no way to see the speed? I can’t even look on the pump because once you set up the controller connector it deactivates screen on the variable speed pump.