Suggestions for a trouble free controller setup for a Pentair system

[SunnySwimmer]

We have a vacation home with a Pentair EasyTouch pool & spa that we also rent out as a vacation rental. The controller set up has been giving us and our guests a lot of headache. Any suggestions for a pool controller system that would let us do the following?

- Guests only have access to spa controls and not pool heating controls. We don't wants guests to be able to control the pool heat, but want only us to be able to heat the pool up if the guest paid for pool heating
- VERY RELIABLE system. The Pentair EasyTouch sensor or controls glitch every few weeks and we have to reset them with a breaker by sending expensive maintenace people
- Power outage proof. The EasyTouch goes glitching every time there's a power outage, which happens about once a month in our area
- Does not need an app to use the spa. Currently, guests have to download the ScreenLogic app, which is terribly confusing. We have to explain how to use it to almost every guest, even if we provide detailed written instructions
- Guests can turn off the spa & lights, if they want, overriding the light schedule

Another larger problem is that the spa & pool are on the same gas heater. It makes it confusing for guests that only the spa or the pool can be heated at once. Given that the spa & pool are on one plumbing, is there a way to add a second heater to be able to heat them independently without a crazy amount of demo-ing & replumbing?


We are considering switching to iAquaLink with their Pentair conversion kit + running a Jandy Spa side remote to let guests control the spa. The iAquaLink app is way better rated, is actually updated (unlike ScreenLogic, which hasn't been updated in 4 years) and seems to have some power outage handling mechanism, but not sure if it will be much better than EasyTouch.

Any suggestions or opinions welcome. We are at our wits end.

 

[ajw22]

Welcome to TFP.

Are you aware that Pentair has an identical IS-4 Spa Side 4 Button Remote that is functionally identical to the Jandy Spa Side Remote just a different form factor? In fact the Jandy Spa Side Remote will work with the EasyTouch. So you can give your guests that wired spa control with your EasyTouch.

Do you know what is glitching and what is done to reset it?

To heat the pool and spa at the same time you need to replumb adding another pump and gas heater to circulate both bodies of water simultaneously. You also need to confirm your gas service is adequate to run two heaters simultaneously or upgrade your gas service. And you need to change your EasyTouch to a system that can handle two bodies of water.

 

[SunnySwimmer]

Welcome to TFP.

Are you aware that Pentair has an identical IS-4 Spa Side 4 Button Remote that is functionally identical to the Jandy Spa Side Remote just a different form factor? In fact the Jandy Spa Side Remote will work with the EasyTouch. So you can give your guests that wired spa control with your EasyTouch.

Do you know what is glitching and what is done to reset it?

To heat the pool and spa at the same time you need to replumb adding another pump and gas heater to circulate both bodies of water simultaneously. You also need to confirm your gas service is adequate to run two heaters simultaneously or upgrade your gas service. And you need to change your EasyTouch to a system that can handle two bodies of water.

Thank you for the reply!

When the EasyTouch system glitches, the spa or pool temp will be stuck at a given temperature and not changing at all. The temp is only stuck in the ScreenLogic app, though. If we go to the control panel and physically adjust the spa or pool temp, it works fine. To get the app temp sensor and controls working again, we have to reset the breaker on the panel, but this is happening every couple of weeks and it's becoming a lot of headache. It may have to do with the frequent power outages in our area.

Just now I learned about the Intellicenter upgrade kit for EasyTouch. Perhaps if we go that route, we can then use the IntelliCenter app, which seem updated at least and might not have these software glitches?

About the controller, yes, I saw the is4. Was wondering about iAquaLink + their spa side control because their app and software just seem better maintained, but also open to the is4 if we can get the Pentair software & controller to be reliable. I also saw the Pentair is10 and Spa Command controls, but not sure if we can program those more advanced remotes so that guests can only control the spa controls + lights without being able to control the pool heating. Ideally, the remote would show the spa temperature, though, in order for guests to know if the spa is at the correct temperature.

 

[1poolman1]

Thank you for the reply!

When the EasyTouch system glitches, the spa or pool temp will be stuck at a given temperature and not changing at all. The temp is only stuck in the ScreenLogic app, though. If we go to the control panel and physically adjust the spa or pool temp, it works fine. To get the app temp sensor and controls working again, we have to reset the breaker on the panel, but this is happening every couple of weeks and it's becoming a lot of headache. It may have to do with the frequent power outages in our area.

Just now I learned about the Intellicenter upgrade kit for EasyTouch. Perhaps if we go that route, we can then use the IntelliCenter app, which seem updated at least and might not have these software glitches?

About the controller, yes, I saw the is4. Was wondering about iAquaLink + their spa side control because their app and software just seem better maintained, but also open to the is4 if we can get the Pentair software & controller to be reliable. I also saw the Pentair is10 and Spa Command controls, but not sure if we can program those more advanced remotes so that guests can only control the spa controls + lights without being able to control the pool heating. Ideally, we the remote would show the spa temperature, though in order for guests to know if the spa is at the correct temperature.

There is a wired remote available for the Easy Touch that would probably be easier to install than a spa-side button. Mounts on an inside wall. Price is about $100.00 more than the iS4 but the install should be much easier. Its also very much less than the extremely difficult to obtain Jandy wired remotes.
You're giving all tour guests continued access to your system, even when they are gone.

 

[ajw22]

Have you considered wiring the EasyTouch control board power and all your network components power through UPS batteries so the power does not glitch on them?

 

[bradgray]

+1 IntelliCenter upgrade. But every wireless option will be vulnerable to AP issues.

I would not use Pentair's spa command. We have seen issues with reliability and they are pricey for the gamble.

We manage a few hundred STRs, and I hate to unceremoniously squash your dreams; there is simply no way to give guests access to only some of the settings/data. It's all or nothing. I'm confused though, why you had them use screenlogic which requires multiple button presses and screens to toggle the spa, when they could simply walk to your ET panel and press the Valve button once to change the mode with all temperatures already preset and harder to foul up.

You either need to provide sufficient instruction and specify what they do and do NOT touch (we provide private YT tutorial videos to our partners that guests can access with QR codes), or you'll need to schedule the spa to operate during specific times of day so no one has to touch anything. Same thing with your lights.

You mentioned you believed guests need to know when the spa is at the correct temp - I would disagree. I'd argue it's better if they do not know and you give them a general expectation of when it'll be hot.

As a general rule, the less privilege you give the guest and the simpler the instructions, the less exposure you have to mismanaged expectations and complaints. As well as of course, costly inadvertent mistakes and failures.

 

[SunnySwimmer]

+1 IntelliCenter upgrade. But every wireless option will be vulnerable to AP issues.

I would not use Pentair's spa command. We have seen issues with them being reliable and they are pricey for the gamble.

We manage a few hundred STRs, and I hate to unceremoniously squash your dreams. There is simply no way to give guests access to only some of the settings/data. It's all or nothing. I'm confused though, why you had them use screenlogic which requires multiple button presses and screens to toggle the spa, when they could simply walk to your ET panel and press the Valve button once to change the mode with all temperatures already preset and harder to foul up.

You either need to provide sufficient instruction and specify what they do and do NOT touch (we provide private YT tutorial videos to our partners that guests can access with QR codes), or you'll need to schedule the spa to operate during specific times of day so no one has to touch anything. Same thing with your lights.

You mentioned you believed guests need to know when the spa is at the correct temp - I would disagree. I'd argue it's better if they do not know and you give them a general expectation of when it'll be hot.

As a general rule, the less privilege you give the guest and the simpler the instructions, the less exposure you have to mismanaged expectations and complaints. As well as of course, costly inadvertent mistakes and failures.

I am so glad you responded here! Exactly the type of advice we were looking for!

100% agreed on everything you said. We want to give the minimum amount of control and information possible to avoid any complaints or issues, but still want them to be able to control the spa heating & jets on their own and for us to be able to control the pool heating remotely reliably.

I am thinking ideally we would want them to be able to see & control the spa temp, because I expect we are bound to get a guest who will ask to control the spa temp or will complain about the temp being too low or high, but perhaps just telling them it's set to 103 and cannot be changed is enough. In that case, which Pentair controller would be most appropriate? The is4 spa side controller? Or would you recommend the indoor 4 or 8-circuit controller like this one? With the indoor controller, I am worried they will start going into the "Menu" section and start messing with settings.

We don't have guests walk over to the ET panel, because all the pool equipment along with the ET panel is located off to the side of the house outside the backyard fence a good distance from the pool and spa itself. The area is also not landscaped at all and is just not a presentable area of the house.

Do you find that the IntelliCenter is generally reliable for controlling the pool heating remotely? With EasyTouch, it just frequently glitches or gets stuck on a certain temp and we have to keep sending service people to either adjust the temp on the ET panel or reset the breaker panel altogether to get the app working properly again.

Do you have any experience with iAquaLink? The app seems so much better rated than anything Pentair has put out.

 

[SunnySwimmer]

Have you considered wiring the EasyTouch control board power and all your network components power through UPS batteries so the power does not glitch on them?

That is an interesting idea! We could certainly add UPS to our network cabinet for the WiFi, router etc, but not sure how we would add the UPS to the EasyTouch panel. I will ask our GC/electrician about this. We are considering getting solar + a battery so that at least short power outages don't mess up the equipment, but that is a big investment!

 

[SunnySwimmer]

There is a wired remote available for the Easy Touch that would probably be easier to install than a spa-side button. Mounts on an inside wall. Price is about $100.00 more than the iS4 but the install should be much easier. Its also very much less than the extremely difficult to obtain Jandy wired remotes.
You're giving all tour guests continued access to your system, even when they are gone.

Do you mean this one? That would make sense. I'm thinking we could program the four buttons as "Spa Jets" (turn spa jets on/off), "Spa Heat" (turn on/off spa heat only), "Lights" (for turning pool & spa lights on/off). Would that make sense?

Could renters still go into the "Menu" through the "Menu" button and mess settings up?

With ScreenLogic, guests just login into the local system through the "Local" login option and we don't give them our remote login credentials, so I hope they can't control the pool after leaving!

 

[bradgray]

I am thinking ideally we would want them to be able to see & control the spa temp, because I expect we are bound to get a guest who will ask to control the spa temp or will complain about the temp being too low or high, but perhaps just telling them it's set to 103 and cannot be changed is enough.

Our experience is that you invite problems by drawing attention to details. It's true, you will be setting a standard that may not fit every guest, but they are a severe minority and shouldn't be the most influential on your procedures. As a legitimate example, we lock all of our acrylic spas at 104. Out of thousands of guests scattered across properties in a given month, 4 or 5 will say it's too hot. When locked at 102, 200 will say it's too cold. When it's unlocked entirely, people turn them down and use them as a kiddie pool or mess up filtration cycles.

We don't let the 4 or 5 make it harder or troublesome for everyone else, including ourselves or our management partners.

In that case, which Pentair controller would be most appropriate? The is4 spa side controller?

No, I don't recommend those. They're a criminally expensive plastic button. They also seem to not get along with IntelliCenter systems as well as ET systems.

Or would you recommend the indoor 4 or 8-circuit controller like this one? With the indoor controller, I am worried they will start going into the "Menu" section and start messing with settings.

I share your concern. We have several accounts with these and they can and do sometimes make those changes. But again, this is where the tutorials are powerful. We also cover/obscure navigational buttons and place language on the controllers to guide behavior.

If you have remote access, you can also schedule a check-up at a certain time each night or morning. We do this for certain VIP or trouble properties. Helps ensure things aren't wrong for very long, if they do get changed.

Do you find that the IntelliCenter is generally reliable for controlling the pool heating remotely?

Not any more than the Screenlogic. I have AP issues with both about the same frequency. But its just a numbers game for us with our volume; there will always be units we cant access for various reasons. I've never blamed Pentair.

With EasyTouch, it just frequently glitches or gets stuck on a certain temp and we have to keep sending service people to either adjust the temp on the ET panel or reset the breaker panel altogether to get the app working properly again.

I'm surprised I've never seen this issue. You may have something wrong with your personality board. This is where the IntelliCenter upgrade may have value.

Do you have any experience with iAquaLink? The app seems so much better rated than anything Pentair has put out.

Yes. The app is fine, but Jandy equipment is at the very bottom of my list. I would NOT recommend changing your automation. For so many layered reasons.

Pentair is hands-down the best for STRs.

 

[Rocket J Squirrel]

@SunnySwimmer, your ET is glitching. Every ET everywhere is not, as you seem to hypothesize. Mine has worked fine for almost 5 years without a glitch. I suggest your ET is defective. You could have it repaired or replaced.

 

[SunnySwimmer]

Our experience is that you invite problems by drawing attention to details. It's true, you will be setting a standard that may not fit every guest, but they are a severe minority and shouldn't be the most influential on your procedures. As a legitimate example, we lock all of our acrylic spas at 104. Out of thousands of guests scattered across properties in a given month, 4 or 5 will say it's too hot. When locked at 102, 200 will say it's too cold. When it's unlocked entirely, people turn them down and use them as a kiddie pool or mess up filtration cycles.

We don't let the 4 or 5 make it harder or troublesome for everyone else, including ourselves or our management partners.

No, I don't recommend those. They're a criminally expensive plastic button. They also seem to not get along with IntelliCenter systems as well as ET systems.

I share your concern. We have several accounts with these and they can and do sometimes make those changes. But again, this is where the tutorials are powerful. We also cover/obscure navigational buttons and place language on the controllers to guide behavior.

If you have remote access, you can also schedule a check-up at a certain time each night or morning. We do this for certain VIP or trouble properties. Helps ensure things aren't wrong for very long, if they do get changed.

Not any more than the Screenlogic. I have AP issues with both about the same frequency. But its just a numbers game for us with our volume; there will always be units we cant access for various reasons. I've never blamed Pentair.

I'm surprised I've never seen this issue. You may have something wrong with your personality board. This is where the IntelliCenter upgrade may have value.

Yes. The app is fine, but Jandy equipment is at the very bottom of my list. I would NOT recommend changing your automation. For so many layered reasons.

Pentair is hands-down the best for STRs.

Wow thanks so much for such a thorough and thoughtful response! This is really amazing to hear and learn from someone so experienced in exactly the issue we have been dealing with for so long.

Definitely turned away from Jandy now, especially since all the rest of our equipment is Pentair.

Do you have experience with the IntelliCenter indoor controller 522035? I can't find any reviews or even online videos of this controller.

So we are now thinking of doing the IntelliCenter upgrade kit + IntelliCenter indoor controller 522035. That way guests will have access to everything, but at least if everything is easy to use and we can monitor remotely that would be a fine solution. They won't have to download or use any app.

The IntelliCenter also looks to have better scheduling (can set one time scheduled events to enable pool heating for given dates in the future after a guest requests them, instead of us turning the pool heat on/off manually the day of) and also has a web UI, which would be nice to have to control the system from our computers.

 

[SunnySwimmer]

@SunnySwimmer, your ET is glitching. Every ET everywhere is not, as you seem to hypothesize. Mine has worked fine for almost 5 years without a glitch. I suggest your ET is defective. You could have it repaired or replaced.

That is possible. Our frequent power outages may be to blame. Also in a vacation rental the system is under heavy use pretty much every day, so I can imagine it gets more wear and tear than if it was just ourselves there.

 

[ajw22]

That is an interesting idea! We could certainly add UPS to our network cabinet for the WiFi, router etc, but not sure how we would add the UPS to the EasyTouch panel. I will ask our GC/electrician about this. We are considering getting solar + a battery so that at least short power outages don't mess up the equipment, but that is a big investment!

If you ask to put UPS to the EasyTouch panel it becomes a big job.

I suggested just powering the EasyTouch control board transformer circuit with a UPS. That just requires pulling a circuit connected to a UPS from outside the panel into it and connecting the transformer power to the new circuit.

I agree with the discussion about the Aqualink not being appropriate. I had an Aqualink and replaced it with an IntelliCenter. The Aqualink is not better than your EasyTouch and the IntelliCenter is better than both. The IntelliCenter has its glitches and bugs and is not a rock solid appliance like you really want. And all networked electronic equipment does not like unreliable power.

@bradgray has good advice based on experience.