My Hot Tub GFI keeps tripping. The first thing I want to do is determine whether the problem is: 1) the hot tub or 2) the wiring to the hot tub. I want to do a simple test where I disconnect the wiring at the hot tub. I would go to the main lugs in the hot tub and remove the wires which are fed from the breaker and have them connected to nothing. If I do that and the GFI does not trip, have I correctly determined whether the problem IS the hot tub? I have read lots of posts about going to the control panel in the hot tub and disconnecting various components of the hot tub (heater, pumps etc). But I want to disconnect the hot tub completely (at the hot tub, not at the breaker) and see if the problem is the hot tub or the way that the hot tub is wired to the breaker. Will this work? Thanks very much.
GFI Hot Tub Problem
- Thread starter BlueBaron
- Start date
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- electrical gfi gfic hot tub
BB,
Most wiring does not go bad...
Most likely you have a bad heater or Ozone device...
I assume that your breaker intermittently pops...
I would start by disconnecting heater and see what happens.
That said, I see no issues with you disconnecting all the AC power right where it comes into the spa's control box.
Thanks,
Jim R.
Most wiring does not go bad...
Most likely you have a bad heater or Ozone device...
I assume that your breaker intermittently pops...
I would start by disconnecting heater and see what happens.
That said, I see no issues with you disconnecting all the AC power right where it comes into the spa's control box.
Thanks,
Jim R.
Not necessarily, as a bad breaker may not trip when not under load, but most likely.
As Jim said, probably the heater unless it was just wired. If new wiring, check that the spa neutral goes to the breaker, not the neutral bar in the panel.
Thank you both very much.
The wiring from the GFI breaker to the hot tub was just replaced last week. The existing wiring was corroded. So it was replaced. The spa neutral does go to the breaker and then to the ground bar in the panel in the hot tub.
I completely disconnected the new wiring from the hot tub and the breaker does not trip. But it does trip as soon as I connect the neutral wire to the ground bar (even when the only wire that is connected to the hot tub panel is the neutral wire).
I think the new wiring is correct. My next plan of action is to do what you said and disconnect the heater.
The wiring from the GFI breaker to the hot tub was just replaced last week. The existing wiring was corroded. So it was replaced. The spa neutral does go to the breaker and then to the ground bar in the panel in the hot tub.
I completely disconnected the new wiring from the hot tub and the breaker does not trip. But it does trip as soon as I connect the neutral wire to the ground bar (even when the only wire that is connected to the hot tub panel is the neutral wire).
I think the new wiring is correct. My next plan of action is to do what you said and disconnect the heater.
BB,
Neutral and Ground are two different things...
Your spa should have connection for the Neutral wire and a different connection for the Ground wire.
Thanks,
Jim R.
Neutral and Ground are two different things...
Your spa should have connection for the Neutral wire and a different connection for the Ground wire.
Thanks,
Jim R.
Thank you, I made a mistake and what I wrote. There is no neutral between the GFCI secondary breaker box and the spa. Just the red, black and ground.
BB,
Show us some pics of the breaker box wiring and the Spa connections.
My spa breaker box has two separate GFCI breakers.. What does yours have?
Thanks,
Jim R.
Show us some pics of the breaker box wiring and the Spa connections.
My spa breaker box has two separate GFCI breakers.. What does yours have?
Thanks,
Jim R.
75 percent of the time a GFCI tripping in a portable spa is due the heating element or an ozone producer
BB,
Just to be clear...
Are you saying with L1 and L2, the two hot lines going to the spa disconnected, the GFCI pops when you connect only the ground wire???
Thanks,
Jim R.
Just to be clear...
Are you saying with L1 and L2, the two hot lines going to the spa disconnected, the GFCI pops when you connect only the ground wire???
Thanks,
Jim R.
If it wasn't tripping before this, wiring is the issue.
This makes no sense. Post pics of wiring and connections at breaker and spa. Get a volt meter (electrical tester).
It's a Sundance?
Hello Jim, Sorry it took so long to reply. I was out of town. I am going to disconnect the heater this am and see what happens. In the meantime, the answer to your question is yes. The GFCI pops when I only connect the ground wire.
BB,
Well, on the surface that makes no sense... I'm sure what you say is true, but can't see why it would pop with just the ground wire.
We really need to see the wiring inside the sub panel.
The sub panel should have a Neutral bus bar that is NOT connected to the sub panel case.. It should also have ground bus bar that should be connected to the case.. Since they are both tied together back at the main circuit breaker panel, I'm not sure why it matters, but just grasping at straws..
Thanks,
Jim R.
When you have a GFCI wired as you do (two pole, no neutral on the load side) the breaker is "looking" at the two legs. What is going out on L1 has to match what is coming in on L2 (and vice versa) within 5ma. If your breaker had a neutral on the load side as well, it compares all three (L1, L2, and the neutral) to make sure what is going out is equal to what is coming in - in total (they run through an induction coil to sense it)
A single pole breaker does the same thing but compares the hot leg to the neutral to make sure the current is the same on each.
If the GFCI trips when you attach the ground, it means there is now a difference in current between L1 and L2, because some of the current is now going to ground.
You have a (likely high resistance) fault somewhere between an energized part and a grounded part.
A single pole breaker does the same thing but compares the hot leg to the neutral to make sure the current is the same on each.
If the GFCI trips when you attach the ground, it means there is now a difference in current between L1 and L2, because some of the current is now going to ground.
You have a (likely high resistance) fault somewhere between an energized part and a grounded part.
@phonedave
The OP says that L1 and L2 are not connected to the spa.. When he connects just the ground wire, the GFCI pops.
Makes my brain hurt...
Jim R.
The OP says that L1 and L2 are not connected to the spa.. When he connects just the ground wire, the GFCI pops.
Makes my brain hurt...
Jim R.
Technicalities. The neutral wire is a current-carrying conductor, meaning in normal operation it has voltage on it, and is therefore still an electrical hazard. The ground however is NOT a current-carrying conductor in normal operation and provides an alternative path to ground for shorted devices, other than through you. And if you have a gfci the neutral and ground cannot connect on the load side.
@phonedave
The OP says that L1 and L2 are not connected to the spa.. When he connects just the ground wire, the GFCI pops.
Makes my brain hurt...
Jim R.
I missed that.
Yeah, I got nothing.
@RDspaguy
I agree with you 100%... when everything is connected and operational..
But, in this case, the OP pops the breaker by just connecting the ground wire from the sub panel to the spa.. There should be no current flow because nothing else is connected ..
Any ideas???
Thanks,
Jim R.
The OP is mistaken. With no wires connected to the breaker you cannot make it trip by connecting a ground to the neutral or ground bar. Sundance does not carry a neutral, so there's nowhere to connect it to the spa as a neutral in any case. The ground connected to the ground lug in the spa and the bar (not breaker) in the panel has nothing to do with the breaker until you connect the hot wires and there is a ground fault (loss of current to ground detectable by the gfci mechanism as described in fantastic detail by @phonedave ). The OP is describing a breakdown in the fundamental laws of physics, or he's wrong.
However, until my advice is tried and requests for info are answered, I will not continue to guess at an obviously mistaken premise. I wish the OP the best of luck, but at this point I'd recommend he call an electrician as I am certain his assessment of the situation is incorrect.