I can get a picture later today, but there was at one point an ionizer. It was broken when I moved in, so I removed it. This stain has been in the pool as long as I have been here.
This spring I will finally conquer this stain
- Thread starter heyyou488
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- cleaning pool stain stain
Then I am sure that the stains are metals including copper and probably silver.
Just to clarify, it was an ionizer and not an ozonator, right?
Ohh good question. I actually think ozonator. It was a long bar on top of my pool controller. It did not pump water through it so I am thinking Ozonator now that you said it?
- May 3, 2014
- 58,276
- Pool Size
- 6000
- Surface
- Fiberglass
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
I thought that was zero alkalinity? Also, if I use my spot thing with a cup of muriatic acid and leave it on the stain for several minutes it disappears and does not return. See pictures where there are spots without a stain. Those are from leaving a chlorine puck on the stain for like 24 hours or leaving the muriatic acid on the spot for 10-15 minutes. Scrubbing with either does not work. Only prolonged contact.
For zero alkalinity, I would take the system offline and just brush the pool to mix everything in.
Zero alkalinity is corrosive to metal and plaster.
You can remove the light and any ladders or rails.
I would minimize the amount of time that the water is at zero alkalinity. It will take off part of the smooth finish like an acid wash, but much less aggressive than an acid wash.
If it doesn't work in 24 hours, it probably won't work well.
If that doesn't work, sulfamic acid might work.
Note that zero alkalinity has risks that you need to consider before deciding what to do.
Taking the pH that low is very aggressive to everything and there might be unanticipated damage.
Consult a local professional expert and do your own research before deciding what to do.
Do at your own risk.
Zero alkalinity is corrosive to metal and plaster.
You can remove the light and any ladders or rails.
I would minimize the amount of time that the water is at zero alkalinity. It will take off part of the smooth finish like an acid wash, but much less aggressive than an acid wash.
If it doesn't work in 24 hours, it probably won't work well.
If that doesn't work, sulfamic acid might work.
Note that zero alkalinity has risks that you need to consider before deciding what to do.
Taking the pH that low is very aggressive to everything and there might be unanticipated damage.
Consult a local professional expert and do your own research before deciding what to do.
Do at your own risk.
This is an ionizer. It has a control box that sends power to a set of copper/silver bars in a tube attached to the pipe.
The tube has two terminals where the low voltage wires connect.
- May 3, 2014
- 58,276
- Pool Size
- 6000
- Surface
- Fiberglass
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
Nope wasn't that.
This is an ionizer. It has a control box that sends power to a set of copper/silver bars in a tube attached to the pipe.
The tube has two terminals where the low voltage wires connect.
Ok. I still think that it's probably copper and silver. Probably from algaecide.
For zero alkalinity, you can pull the lights up on the deck on their cords.
The light niches might be metal.
In general, zero alkalinity is an aggressive and risky treatment that should only be considered when necessary.
Don't do it unless you're really sure that it's worth the potential risks.
For zero alkalinity, you can pull the lights up on the deck on their cords.
The light niches might be metal.
In general, zero alkalinity is an aggressive and risky treatment that should only be considered when necessary.
Don't do it unless you're really sure that it's worth the potential risks.
The Zero Alkalinity Acid Treatment
The concept of the “Zero Alkalinity” process (also known as a No drain Acid Wash) is to make pool water aggressive enough (by adding acid) to dissolve and remove metal stains or calcium scale from cement-based plaster surfaces, including quartz and pebble swimming pools. Unfortunately, this...
www.troublefreepool.com
Also note that even if the treatment works, the metals will now be in the water instead of the plaster.
Most metals in the water eventually become stains.
If it works, the pool might look good for a year or it might begin to restain in a week or two.
You can add sequestrant and carefully manage the chemistry to reduce the rate of restaining, but it will probably come back to some degree at some point.
Most metals in the water eventually become stains.
If it works, the pool might look good for a year or it might begin to restain in a week or two.
You can add sequestrant and carefully manage the chemistry to reduce the rate of restaining, but it will probably come back to some degree at some point.
I am happy to attempt a stain remover option if you think that is worth it before I go all Dante's Peak and turn my pool into a boat eating lake of acid. Do you think something like Jack's Magic is a better attempt first?
Jack's copper and scale stuff is sulfamic acid. It might work.
Note that it will convert the fc to cc for months.
You just have to use the tc as fc and ignore the cc.
Fc is free chlorine.
Cc is combined chlorine.
Tc is total chlorine.
Note that it will convert the fc to cc for months.
You just have to use the tc as fc and ignore the cc.
Fc is free chlorine.
Cc is combined chlorine.
Tc is total chlorine.
That settles it. I will try that this week before committing to something harmful like zero alkilinity.
Ok. I am probably over emphasizing the risk of zero alkalinity to be safe.
Low pH can work, but the big question is if it will remove the stains without damaging anything else.
The lower the pH goes, the better and faster it will work but the risks also go up as well.
If I was to do the zero alkalinity, I would go right to zero TA and not lower.
I would probably only wait 8 hours before deciding to bail out if it wasn't helping.
I would also watch any metal carefully and bail out if it looked like it was changing color.
Some light niches are copper.
Copper will go from a dull brown to a bright shiny copper color like a new penny when it begins to be etched by low pH.
In any case, hopefully, the sulfamic acid will work and you won't need to try the low pH.
Low pH can work, but the big question is if it will remove the stains without damaging anything else.
The lower the pH goes, the better and faster it will work but the risks also go up as well.
If I was to do the zero alkalinity, I would go right to zero TA and not lower.
I would probably only wait 8 hours before deciding to bail out if it wasn't helping.
I would also watch any metal carefully and bail out if it looked like it was changing color.
Some light niches are copper.
Copper will go from a dull brown to a bright shiny copper color like a new penny when it begins to be etched by low pH.
In any case, hopefully, the sulfamic acid will work and you won't need to try the low pH.
Have you ever taken a water sample to a pool store and asked them to check for metals??
A note for when you get the pool back in line - You list your FC in your original post as running between 2.5-3.5ppm for a CYA of 50. That is entirely too low as the minimum FC for 50 CYA is 4ppm FC. Ideally you want to run 6-8ppm FC so it allows you to lose normal daily amounts of FC to the sun, and swimmers, and still have more than the minimal amount of FC.
Maddie
A note for when you get the pool back in line - You list your FC in your original post as running between 2.5-3.5ppm for a CYA of 50. That is entirely too low as the minimum FC for 50 CYA is 4ppm FC. Ideally you want to run 6-8ppm FC so it allows you to lose normal daily amounts of FC to the sun, and swimmers, and still have more than the minimal amount of FC.
Maddie
borjis
LifeTime Supporter
Ya the only good free test from a pool shop is for metals. The test kits for that are spendy. $ 70 was the cheapest I found for the LaMotte.
I think the Jack's magic will steer you in a good direction. Anything else is guessing. Imo.
I think the Jack's magic will steer you in a good direction. Anything else is guessing. Imo.
Sorry for the long delay. I had to order the stain ID kit since there were not any locally and then get the chemistry right.
So here is where we stand:
I elevated the chlorine to about 40ppm and then let it naturally lower over the course of 2 weeks. This lightened the stains, but did not get rid of them just made them lighter. Once I got the kit and got the chemistry right in the pool. I did the tests with a sock and applying to the stains. None of the tests caused a dramatic change but"treatment #4" did lighten the stain slightly and Treatment #2 changed the color slightly. This seems to fit as treatment #4 is #2 and #1 layered on a stain. However, this is about $400 in chemicals for something that I am not positive will work because my test kit did not leave it completely stain free just changed the stain some. I have heard this is common on older stains.
Do you think I should try treatment #4 even at that price?
So here is where we stand:
I elevated the chlorine to about 40ppm and then let it naturally lower over the course of 2 weeks. This lightened the stains, but did not get rid of them just made them lighter. Once I got the kit and got the chemistry right in the pool. I did the tests with a sock and applying to the stains. None of the tests caused a dramatic change but"treatment #4" did lighten the stain slightly and Treatment #2 changed the color slightly. This seems to fit as treatment #4 is #2 and #1 layered on a stain. However, this is about $400 in chemicals for something that I am not positive will work because my test kit did not leave it completely stain free just changed the stain some. I have heard this is common on older stains.
Do you think I should try treatment #4 even at that price?