Reviving out of service pool: FG & deck Refresh

[mas985]

So this would indicate that I should have a Hartford Loop. Any specs on height, width?

Edit: But then again, the quoted post was for putting a loop at the spa - mine would be at the equip pad ... so guess I'm still not sure.

Hartford loop at the pad is worthless. Won't accomplish anything except maybe keeping the blower dry.

 

[dianedebuda]

Thanks. One less thing to have to make space for.

 

[dianedebuda]

Scooped on Mon. Saw snake briefly. Don't know if it was the same one that made a mad dash after seeing me or a cohort. ?

Tried to get temp AG pump, but order was cancelled as no longer available. After thinking about my pad build and pool water efforts ahead, decided that trying to do both at the same time was not a good plan considering my stamina level. So guess I'll just try to scoop enough that I don't get a leaf/muck build up again while doing the pad.

Had 4-1/4" of heavy rain yesterday which wiped out any pool work. Doubt that I'm going to get to do much for the next week or so because of more forecast heavy t-storms. Maybe I should fantasize and write posts about going to the pool store and getting this and that to clean up my swamp. I mean, just about every other swamp to pool thread has that. But the best I'd truthfully be able to come up with would be scenerios of using up the last of the existing shock and tablets on hand from several years ago. Since there's not much of that here, wouldn't be dramatic enough to be very interesting.

Updated Shopping list:
--changed pump as recommended by polytec because of price
--change qty of Hi-Temp Union for use on pump only

*IntelliCenter i8PSIC60 (521903-IC60)
*IntelliFlo VSF 3 HP pump (011056) will use RPM, not GPM
*Quad 60 DE filter (188592)
*Pentair multi-port 2" (261055)
*Pentair 263047 Solar Valve w/ drain-down (263047)
*ordered today from polytec

IntelliFlo GFCI Breaker 2-Pole 20A (PA220GF)
CMP Hi-Temp Union 2" (pair) (21063-200-000) qty 1 (pump)
Jandy 4724 NeverLube 2-Way 1.5-2" qty 7 (6 for entry/exit pad, 1 for filter drain)
Jandy 4716 NeverLube 2-Way 2-2.5" qty 2
Jandy 4717 NeverLube 3-Way 2-2.5" qty 2
Jandy 7305 2-2.5 Check Valve qty 3 (added 1 for blower air)
FlowVis 2" (FV-C)
Zodiac (Jandy) 4424 Actuator
also ordered today

Already have:
1 Jandy Actuator
2 temp sensors compatible with Goldline GL-235 solar control

 

[dianedebuda]

Polytec order (except IntelliCenter) to be delivered today. Unexpectedly fast.

Got dangerous part of electric removed from pad yesterday. Guess today will be the will they or won't they work day for the pvc ball valves. Can't remove plumbing if they don't without draining some on pool since pad is below water line. Heavy t-storms forecast for tomorrow and Sun is delayed Mother's Day at son's. Hope to sneak over to HD & check their chlorine status.

Another change to logical plumbing diagram:
--added line for manual vac before pump's 2-way Jandy. This is to allow vacuuming when water level may go below skimmer. Don't see it'd get used much after swamp conversion, but expect signifcant use during (vac to waste). Thought about putting a Jandy there, but think I'll just put a tee with a threaded connection for cap/line swap since expect low usage normally. Will put a hose bib on short, removable pvc section planned for between threaded connect and vac hose so can fill hose easily & not have a prime problem. Main and Skimmer Jandy 2-ways would be turned off if using manual vac line. Will have a leaf catcher in hose section to replace function of skimmer's basket.

 

[dianedebuda]

Was lucky about the pvc ball valves yesterday. Giant crescent wrench held vertically on valve handle to lessen breakage potential and a piece of rebar in handle to turn. Was able to enter Demo Mode and felt like I was in one of those DIY show episodes. The existing equipment & pvc plumbing didn't stand a chance when I'm armed with pipe wrenches and a recip saw. Placed new filter & pump today temporarily to visualize where control panel should be located. Going to set up electric first before the equip & plumbing make it hard to move around. Now if I can just figure out/remember what the purpose was for 4 of the 5 never-connected electrical wires coming up from underground routing... Suspect they are from the shed, but why? 3-way switches for lights? Extraterrestrial monitoring station?

Pool pad after old equipment removed.

 

[DeanP66]

This is gonna fun to see the transformation. Keep those pics coming all along the way!!!

 

[dianedebuda]

SWG vertical installation question
Manual says a bypass loop is needed for flows over 80 gpm and shows


Earlier they show another diagram w/o the valve that I would assume to be for a "normal" vertical install.

Don't understand why you'd need a bypass w/o the valve. Am assuming with my setup that I'd not be going to 80+ gpm. I would have thought just an upside-down U-shape would work. Am I missing something here?

 

[mguzzy]

I do not have such bypass valve.. all the return water goes through the the cell. I can see if you have over 80 GPM then you would need something like that to optimize performance of the cell. but I don't see that kind of a high volume pump in your proposed setup. I'll look again, but I think I would not worry about a by pass loop. Just go for the U

 

[dianedebuda]

Been playing tinker toys with layout of my new equipment & pvc for my pad. Unfortunately have had a ton of rain, so had to create a mock up inside 'cause there's a lot of tweeking to get all of it inside the small area and still be easy to use. Have pretty much settled on the layout, but have had to order some pvc fittings not available locally so that's going to delay me another week or so.

In the meantime and between t-storms, have been getting electrical updated and doing general cleanup in the actual pad. And parts shopping - talk about a time sink. Example: took 3 days going to 4 HD & 3 Lowes in 3 towns to get most of the pvc that I initially thought I'd need. Jeez. How I miss my favorite plumbing supply that closed when the owner retired.

Today I scooped half of the pool for the first time since the last post. Mostly just a little muck and very few new leaves, so am really glad about that. Plan to do the other half tomorrow.

Starting to acquire chems. Currently have 51 gals of 10% chlorine (date 20123). For grins, ran the tests so I could determine what other pre-SLAM chems I'll need.
--No chlorine
--Ph 8.2 or above
--CYA 0
--CH 150
--TA 140
Have to wait until equipment is operational to add chems, but going to get a couple of gals of muriatic acid to bring down Ph and have ordered liquid stabilizer (no desire to squeeze sock in algae soup that may or may not still be home to my snake )

Also did a check for ammonia and maybe there's a little, but doesn't look like I'll be facing a huge drain on my chlorine to combat it.

That's all for now.

 

[dianedebuda]

Time to take the mock up out for a test fit. Toyed with it inside quite a bit because of the weather, but need to see where things are for real so I can finish my electrical and water/irrigation mods.

First the logical layout again

The mock-up site with 2x4s denoting pipe entry/exit

The drain & waste module

The Filter module

The Pump module

The empty pad

Put 'em together and what have you got? Bibbidi-bobbidi-boo.


Had to do some minor tweaks to allow IntelliCenter door to open and had to go back to an earlier iteration configuring the SWG, but all in all, seems to fit fairly well at this point even though it ain't pretty and I'm sure the head gods are furious.

Ah, another use of duct tape: keeping loosely fitted pvc together so they can be transported as a unit.

Hoping some of the pool building gurus like jimmythegreek, RDspaguy and mas985 are watching and can weigh in on my logical layout to concept trial effort.

 

[kimkats]

I was doing SO good following it piece by piece THEN you took it outside LOL

I love the way your head works and the planning you are putting into this! Can't wait to hear what the others say about it!

 

[mguzzy]

Now that is just cool.. I think that is the most involved dry-fit I have ever seen, like watching NASA or SpaceX build a crew capsule!

 

[GDN]

That is just crazy impressive. I'm glad you believe in labels. I was first wondering if you'd ever be able to get the pump out if something goes wrong, but it does look like you've got a union on that front section of pipe so it would come off and you can slide the pump out.

 

[dianedebuda]

it does look like you've got a union on that front section of pipe so it would come off and you can slide the pump out.

Yes, everything HAS to be removable for replacement & maintenance with so much in so little space. I noticed that the pump-to-filter union was missing as I took the pictures. Must have happened when I was tweaking on the pad to get room for the IntelliCenter door to open.

In case anyone is wondering why the filter is on a platform: it is to have proper gravity feed of the drain into the existing waste line buried in the yard. The "real" platform is stacked concrete 16x16 pavers. Pump is to be elevated a couple of inches too just to keep its feet dry.

 

[Brett S]

Ah, another use of duct tape: keeping loosely fitted pvc together so they can be transported as a unit.

That is quite impressive, but I’m a little afraid that you might have set yourself up for failure. The problem with dry fitting PVC is that when the pipes have glue on them they will go much farther into the fittings... on the order of 1/2 an inch per fitting, so all those pipes that you have carefully measured out and dry fit may be as much as one inch too short by the time you glue them into their fittings.

What you may need to do at this point is keep your plan as is, since obviously that seems to work well, but plan to cut new longer pipes for each section as you work and glue everything together.

Good luck in any case. After going through all that I’m sure you can make this work

 

[jimmythegreek]

What is the theory for the automated 2way on the filter drain? The 2 way upstream of the solar 3 way is for throttling flow? With a vs you just adjust speed for solar flow usually. I always use a check valve on the downstream of solar and i use pentair solar 3ways they have a check valve in the diverter they drain nicely.
Overall looks good and the pre planning is excellent. You really had to go thru the effort with such a tight fit.

 

[dianedebuda]

What is the theory for the automated 2way on the filter drain?

Drain is low & hard to get at for old coots like us.

The 2 way upstream of the solar 3 way is for throttling flow? With a vs you just adjust speed for solar flow usually. I always use a check valve on the downstream of solar and i use pentair solar 3ways they have a check valve in the diverter they drain nicely.

Will likely run at a higher speed with jets compared to returns. The 2 way is just for insuring the solar panels don't get more flow than they're designed for in that situation. If only the Intellivalves were controllable via programming, I wouldn't be doing this. There is a check valve on the solar downsteam, but it doesn't show up too well in the pic. You were the one that told me about the Pentair solar valve back when I was first doing the logical layout.

Overall looks good and the pre planning is excellent. You really had to go thru the effort with such a tight fit.

Thanks. You and the others helped so much when I was doing the logical design.

 

[dianedebuda]

The problem with dry fitting PVC is that when the pipes have glue on them they will go much farther into the fittings... on the order of 1/2 an inch per fitting, so all those pipes that you have carefully measured out and dry fit may be as much as one inch too short by the time you glue them into their fittings.

This was never intended as a dry fit - just a mock-up. The pipe cuts were rough sized and only have a minimal amount inside the fittings - that's why the duct tape was needed. Figured a couple of sticks of pipe were cheap throw-aways to visualize the project & make quick mods as needed.

But I never explicitly posted that intent here and you were absolutely correct to point this out.

 

[Chrissykr]

I gotta say this is all way over my head but impressive!

 

[Brett S]

This was never intended as a dry fit - just a mock-up. The pipe cuts were rough sized and only have a minimal amount inside the fittings - that's why the duct tape was needed. Figured a couple of sticks of pipe were cheap throw-aways to visualize the project & make quick mods as needed.

But I never explicitly posted that intent here and you were absolutely correct to point this out.

That makes a lot of sense. Normally I’m not a fan of dry fitting for simple runs because the dimensions always change as you glue. But in this case, with the complexity of your system I’m not sure you really had a choice. I think doing a mock-up like that and then planning to cut the actual pipes to the proper length as you go is absolutely the right way to do it.

Its also a good idea to do something to either mark the joints that you haven’t glued or the joints that you have glued as you go (although the duct tape that’s already there might perform this function well). I was plumbing a large aquarium once and as I was gluing a T fitting I wound up putting one of the pipes in dry to hold the fitting in place as I glued in the other pipes, but then I forgot to go back and glue the first pipe. Of course when I fired things up I had a big leak there and it was a bit of trouble to try to get that joint glued because the other joints were preventing me from moving the pipe. With the number of fittings and connections you have it would be easy to accidentally miss one on glue day.