Automated valve installation, 3 position actuator?

[Tallredrider]

My PB went the cheap route and put all manual valves in my install. That isn't all bad, but I have a dream of returning from a ski trip and turning on my hot water heater and jacuzzi with the app and not having to adjust my valves by hand, which is what I would have to do now. Then I have a piping hot spa when I arrive home.

I have 1 VS pump that runs water to both an elevated spa and the pool. Most of the time, I keep the valve for the returns open to both pool and spa, and it makes a nice waterfall from the spa into my pool. The pool is new and now it is going to be 114 degrees where I live Sunday, so I don't see me heating the spa anytime soon, but I would like to turn off the returns to the pool and just heat the spa when the weather cools.

If I haven't confused enough already, what I want is the abilty to run my return automatically to the spa, pool or both. It seems that the Hayward GVA-24 that I purchased only allows 2 positions, so that bites. Is there an automated valve that will connect to my Hayward equipment that will allow me to do this? The only solution it seems will be to put 1 position to run it to the spa, and the other to both, then manually do it for the odd situation where I would only want to send returns to the pool.

Any thoughts?

 

[ajw22]

Please list the “Hayward equipment“ you have in your signature. Please list what test kit. Details save us the trouble of constantly asking you when you ask for thoughts.

What automation panel?

Use SPILLOVER mode when you want yo see your waterfall running. Your panel probably has POOL, SPA, and SPILLOVER modes.

 

[Tallredrider]

I have updated my signature, I hope that helps. Thank you for the response.

What exactly does SPILLOVER mode do? It does have that on the control module and app. What I need it to do is stop in the middle of the 2 cams on the automated valve. I am going to venture a guess that SPILLOVER mode just shuts off the spa intakes, but leaves the returns going into the spa.

Additional question, but might be related. I notice that there is a valve body on the spa return, but no valve. It looks just like the other manual valves, but no handle. What is that?

 

[ajw22]

. What I need it to do is stop in the middle of the 2 cams on the automated valve.

You can only have two positions on the actuator.

I am going to venture a guess that SPILLOVER mode just shuts off the spa intakes, but leaves the returns going into the spa.

This is the way your valves should be set…

• POOL mode suctions from the pool and returns to the pool
• SPA mode suctions from the spa and returns to the spa.
• SPILLOVER mode suctions from the pool and returns to the spa

Additional question, but might be related. I notice that there is a valve body on the spa return, but no valve. It looks just like the other manual valves, but no handle. What is that?

Post pics of what you are asking about.

 

[ajw22]

I have updated my signature, I hope that helps.

What model number VS pumps?

What model number SWG cell?

What type and model filter?

2005C test kit or 2006C? You need FAS/DPD test that is in 2006C kit to follow TFP methods.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Tall,

Show us several pics of your equipment pad and we will tell you want is possible and what is not.

We need to see all the valves and where all the plumbing goes.

As pointed out above.. You only get two positions when using an actuator. That said, it should be easy to switch between the pool and spa modes unless your builder did not plumb it correctly.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[1poolman1]

My PB went the cheap route and put all manual valves in my install. That isn't all bad, but I have a dream of returning from a ski trip and turning on my hot water heater and jacuzzi with the app and not having to adjust my valves by hand, which is what I would have to do now. Then I have a piping hot spa when I arrive home.

I have 1 VS pump that runs water to both an elevated spa and the pool. Most of the time, I keep the valve for the returns open to both pool and spa, and it makes a nice waterfall from the spa into my pool. The pool is new and now it is going to be 114 degrees where I live Sunday, so I don't see me heating the spa anytime soon, but I would like to turn off the returns to the pool and just heat the spa when the weather cools.

If I haven't confused enough already, what I want is the abilty to run my return automatically to the spa, pool or both. It seems that the Hayward GVA-24 that I purchased only allows 2 positions, so that bites. Is there an automated valve that will connect to my Hayward equipment that will allow me to do this? The only solution it seems will be to put 1 position to run it to the spa, and the other to both, then manually do it for the odd situation where I would only want to send returns to the pool.

Any thoughts?

Your pool builder didn't put the actuators on the valves that he should have. Normally an actuator will switch completely from pool suction to spa suction in a 180-degree sweep. The return actuator is set to swing from a completely closed pool return in spa mode, to a partially open spa return in pool mode so that filtered water will keep the spa fresh (it only truly filters in spa mode). It will then continually spill over. Some like to use the "spillover" capability of their system, some don't.

Hayward actuators are among the easiest to adjust. I always recommend that you take a picture with your phone before you make any changes so you can start over if needed. A video is below:

 

[Jimrahbe]

Tall,

In my mind, 'real' pool builders plumb the system with an adjustable make up line that adds water to the spa, so that you can adjust the spillover.

We need to see pics of your equipment pad.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[SoDel]

Your pool builder didn't put the actuators on the valves that he should have. Normally an actuator will switch completely from pool suction to spa suction in a 180-degree sweep. The return actuator is set to swing from a completely closed pool return in spa mode, to a partially open spa return in pool mode so that filtered water will keep the spa fresh (it only truly filters in spa mode). It will then continually spill over. Some like to use the "spillover" capability of their system, some don't.

Hayward actuators are among the easiest to adjust. I always recommend that you take a picture with your phone before you make any changes so you can start over if needed. A video is below:

My pool / spa valve actuators were adjusted that way (by the PB several years ago) and for me at least it has worked perfectly keeping the spa as crystal clear as the pool. Only downside is that tiny bit of aeration from the bit of spa spillover all day long but it’s working well so I have no plans to mess with it. Someone suggested along the way that it be adjusted for all spa or all pool and then run a schedule on the automation to flush the spa periodically, which makes sense too, but I’m happy with it working exactly as you describe.

Another thing I do is run a schedule for the spa jet pump to run about 5 minutes a day to keep the water in those pipes reasonably fresh. If the OP goes forward with automation, does this make sense to do or did I overthink it?

 

[Tallredrider]

You can only have two positions on the actuator.



This is the way your valves should be set…

• POOL mode suctions from the pool and returns to the pool
• SPA mode suctions from the spa and returns to the spa.
• SPILLOVER mode suctions from the pool and returns to the spa

Post pics of what you are asking about.

I want to be able to return to both spa and pool at the same time, and pool and spa individually. Goint to both creates A small spillover, keeping the spa fresh while the bulk goes into the pool returns. Visuals below. It just doesn't feel right to have no pool return running except for the waterfall, but maybe that is just me. See response to 1poolman below.

What model number VS pumps?

What model number SWG cell?

What type and model filter?

2005C test kit or 2006C? You need FAS/DPD test that is in 2006C kit to follow TFP methods.

Updated signature.

Tall,


You only get two positions when using an actuator. That said, it should be easy to switch between the pool and spa modes unless your builder did not plumb it correctly.

Thanks,

Jim R.

I think that is the crux of it. 2 positions only. And unless someone suddenly has a better idea, I will plumb the return valve to either go all spa or 1/2 and 1/2. The 1/2 and 1/2 with pool intake will keep my waterfall going and the spa fresh. Is there anytime I would want to isolate the pool only? That is all that I am trying to preserve. On my own, I can't think of any reason I would not want spa getting return or suction.

Your pool builder didn't put the actuators on the valves that he should have. Normally an actuator will switch completely from pool suction to spa suction in a 180-degree sweep. The return actuator is set to swing from a completely closed pool return in spa mode, to a partially open spa return in pool mode so that filtered water will keep the spa fresh (it only truly filters in spa mode). It will then continually spill over. Some like to use the "spillover" capability of their system, some don't.

Hayward actuators are among the easiest to adjust. I always recommend that you take a picture with your phone before you make any changes so you can start over if needed. A video is below:

He did this. I can get suction from both pool or spa with a 180 degree sweep. I can also put it in the middle and get suction from both. I have never done that, because the spa drains when I do this. It sits higher so water suctions much easier from the spa. I can adjust manually both the returns and suction just right to get an equilibrium, but then that all goes out the door if I change pump speed. So the suction side of my system is easy - Pool or spa is all I need.

Tall,

In my mind, 'real' pool builders plumb the system with an adjustable make up line that adds water to the spa, so that you can adjust the spillover.

We need to see pics of your equipment pad.

Thanks,

Jim R.

Maybe that is what this is? The top pipe is coming from my heater. It then splits to the right to my spa, and to the left to the pool. The spa line has that black connection that looks like a pool valve, but with no handle. It is on the right just after the elbow, what is that? EDIT: it is a check valve.




And here is the suction side. Valve by the pump chooses pool on the right, spa on the left. The pool side has individual pipes and valves for the suction on the bottom of the pool, skimmer, or vacuum port.

 

[Tallredrider]

Tall,

In my mind, 'real' pool builders plumb the system with an adjustable make up line that adds water to the spa, so that you can adjust the spillover.

We need to see pics of your equipment pad.

Thanks,

Jim R.

Hmmm. There is no makeup line. I am going to guess he figured I can adjust the return valve in tiny increments by hand, so did not include a makeup line. Then I decided I wanted to automate and do wish I had greater adjustability.

And I do notice those wires next to my heater... MY PB is really good with concrete. Electrical, not as much. I am going to have to clean that up.

 

[Jimrahbe]

The spa line has that black connection that looks like a pool valve, but with no handle. It is on the right just after the elbow, what is that?

Tall,

The "valve" with no handle, is a check valve. It prevents water from a raised spa from draining back into the pool when the pump is off.

I need to see all of your Return lines.. Back up a couple of feet...

Normally you would never run the Pool and Spa at the same time. You might be able to do it manually, but your automation is not set up to do that.

The top pipe is coming from my heater. It then splits to the right to my spa, and to the left to the pool.

Tall,

The valve in your pic is called the Return valve and it does just what you say.. It either sends water to the pool or to the spa. In the Pool mode you offset the valve to allow a little water to go to the spa. This is what causes your spillover and keeps your spa water fresh. When in the Spa mode, your spa does not spillover because the Intake valve has moved to suck water from the spa only.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Tallredrider]

There are only those 2 returns, pool and spa. No branches, nothing else. And yup, that is a check valve on the spa return. The water level of the spa sits about 1 foot above my pool equipment, and the pool is about 6 feet below that. With the valve equally open, most of the water goes to the pool due to lower flow resistance.

Related, but separate - My pool is slow to prime when I have let air into the system. It eventually gets there, but runs dry for longer than I am comfortable with. This is because of the 6 feet in elevation drop of my pool compared to my equipment. I assume it is made for that? Specs on the pump say it can lift 8 feet of water.