First time testing

[quantumcosmic]

Hi all,
I first started here last year trying to get my pool right. I was not able to buy a test kit until now (I got the TF Pro Salt) and it showed up yesterday and I just finished testing.

Here are my levels:
pH + Chlorine Testing block - Cl - 5+ | Br - 10+ | pH - 8.2+ (see photo)
FC - 7.5
CC - 0.5
TA - 230-240 - redid the test and got ~300.
CH - 200
CYA - >30, the view tube tops out at 30ml and the black dot was still pretty visible at that level
SC - 3600

Entering some of those values into PoolMath says to drain and fill the whole pool, which is prob right but I’m hoping there’s something I can do to avoid it.

I’m located in Phoenix, Arizona if it helps any. All my equipment info is in my signature.
Looking for any and all help, thanks!

 

[JodieM]

Ignore the chlorine side of the PH comparator. Do the drop test for chlorine, it’s accurate.
Your PH and Alkalinity are high, but that’s no reason to drain a pool.
Follow pool math instructions to lower PH with Muriatic Acid. Aerate your water to increase the pH and repeat reducing PH and aerating until the TA comes down into normal range.
You need more CYA - salt pools need 60-80 ppm.

 

[Texas Splash]

Entering some of those values into PoolMath says to drain and fill the whole pool,

Before you consider that drain, let's clarify. You noted your CYA was greater than 30, but your description (seeing the dot when the tube is full) indicates the CYA to be below 30. So your CYA is low correct? Also, your CH of 200 is phenomenal for the Phx area if you tested correctly. With a low CH and low CYA, there is no reason to exchange water.

My biggest question for you is how does the water look? Is it 100% crystal everywhere down to the deepest end? If you have ANY doubts, do an Overnight Chlorine Loss Test before increasing the CYA or anything else. It's always best to confirm you have no excessive organics first. We can coach you from there.

 

[quantumcosmic]

Before you consider that drain, let's clarify. You noted your CYA was greater than 30, but your description (seeing the dot when the tube is full) indicates the CYA to be below 30. So your CYA is low correct? Also, your CH of 200 is phenomenal for the Phx area if you tested correctly. With a low CH and low CYA, there is no reason to exchange water.

My biggest question for you is how does the water look? Is it 100% crystal everywhere down to the deepest end? If you have ANY doubts, do an Overnight Chlorine Loss Test before increasing the CYA or anything else. It's always best to confirm you have no excessive organics first. We can coach you from there.

I followed the tftest website instructions to the letter.

I’ve attached a photo of the deep end of my pool which is 6’. I would consider the water crystal clear.

What I mean by >30 is that the CYA View Tube included with the TF Pro Salt kit goes to 30ml max. When filled with 30ml of pool water and test fluid the black dot of still very visible. Maybe med-dark gray. So it would take much more than 30ml of mixed fluid to make the dot disappear per the instructions.

I will start the OCLT when I get home tonight or this weekend if not tonight.

 

[Texas Splash]

When filled with 30ml of pool water and test fluid the black dot of still very visible.

That means your CYA is low. It should never be lower than 30, and for a salt pool we recommend about 70. But yes, do the OCLT just to be 100% sure. If you pass that, then add granular stabilizer via the sock method to increase the CYA to about 70. If this is your first time, make it a goal of 60 to be safe. You can always add more later. If you have any questions about the sock method let us know.

 

[pjt]

pH + Chlorine Testing block - Cl - 5+ | Br - 10+ | pH - 8.2+ (see photo)

Just use the pH part of the block. Ignore the chlorine part since you have a much better FC/CC test (FAS-DPD).

Technique for the pH test: pH reading?

TA - 230-240

Keep adding drops until there is no further color change. If a drop does not result in further color change (final color should be ~Barbie pink), do not count it and the test is complete. TA will slowly come down over time as you add MA for pH management. Don't stress over high TA.

Entering some of those values into PoolMath says to drain and fill the whole pool, which is prob right but I’m hoping there’s something I can do to avoid it.

That suggestion is totally wrong. No reason at all to drain your pool.

CH - 200

That's low for your area. Do you have a water softener on your fill line? CH management is a challenge in your area due to the high calcium of the water supply.

CYA - >30

You need CYA now to protect your FC. 80 is a good target for SWCG users like you.

I got the TF Pro Salt

Add that to your signature when you have a minute.

 

[quantumcosmic]

That means your CYA is low. It should never be lower than 30, and for a salt pool we recommend about 70. But yes, do the OCLT just to be 100% sure. If you pass that, then add granular stabilizer via the sock method to increase the CYA to about 70. If this is your first time, make it a goal of 60 to be safe. You can always add more later. If you have any questions about the sock method let us know.

It’s worth noting that I haven’t touched the water with anything since probably October.

I will read the replies here when I get home and edit this reply. I just thought I should let it know I haven’t added anything.

 

[quantumcosmic]

Just use the pH part of the block. Ignore the chlorine part since you have a much better FC/CC test (FAS-DPD).

Technique for the pH test: pH reading?


Keep adding drops until there is no further color change. If a drop does not result in further color change (final color should be ~Barbie pink), do not count it and the test is complete. TA will slowly come down over time as you add MA for pH management. Don't stress over high TA.


That suggestion is totally wrong. No reason at all to drain your pool.


That's low for your area. Do you have a water softener on your fill line? CH management is a challenge in your area due to the high calcium of the water supply.


You need CYA now to protect your FC. 80 is a good target for SWCG users like you.


Add that to your signature when you have a minute.

I will redo the TA as I stopped once the color began to change.

Glad I won’t have to drain it, thanks!

Now that you mention it, I do have a whole house softener and I do believe the water level control is fed from a bib that would use softened water.

I have added the test kit to my signature.

As far as FC, in this thread there are recommendations to aim for 60 to start and then 70 or 80 as a maintenance level. Which should I aim for, 70 or 80?

My pump just kicked on and the SWCG is unplugged, so in about 30min I will do and FAS-DPD for the night. I’ll post my results in the morning.

Another thing, the SC being so high, is this a cause for concern or will it balance out?

 

[pjt]

I do have a whole house softener and I do believe the water level control is fed from a bib that would use softened water.

Do you have an unsoftened bib you could occasionally use to top up your pool? You need to increase your CH to ~250.

As far as FC, in this thread there are recommendations to aim for 60 to start and then 70 or 80 as a maintenance level. Which should I aim for, 70 or 80?

You mean CYA, not FC. I would target 80. Approach it slowly. It's easy to add more CYA, but the only practical way to lower it is a partial drain and fill.

the SC being so high, is this a cause for concern or will it balance out?

I'm guessing SC = Salt. You posted 3600, which is perfect for the IC40.

 

[quantumcosmic]

Do you have an unsoftened bib you could occasionally use to top up your pool? You need to increase your CH to ~250.


You mean CYA, not FC. I would target 80. Approach it slowly. It's easy to add more CYA, but the only practical way to lower it is a partial drain and fill.


I'm guessing SC = Salt. You posted 3600, which is perfect for the IC40.

I think I have 1 bib that may not be softened but I would have to check into it more. How frequently might I want to top up with harder water?

Yes, CYA, thanks. Is there some kind of calculator to figure out how much CYA stabilizer I should add based on my other values?

I just did the night test for OCLT and came up with a value of either 7.5-8 FC. Is the .5 that much of a difference? I’ll report the morning FC once I test that tomorrow.

I also redid the TA test and came up with ~300 as a result before the color no longer changed.

 

[pjt]

How frequently might I want to top up with harder water?

You can use hard water to slowly increase your CH over time. You should have a CH of at least 250 in a plaster pool, so I would use it frequently to top up your pool until your CH comes up.

Is there some kind of calculator to figure out how much CYA stabilizer I should add based on my other values?

PoolMath --> "Effects of Adding" --> "Dry Stabilizer"

Is the .5 that much of a difference?

No.

I also redid the TA test and came up with ~300 as a result before the color no longer changed.

Great. Your TA will come down with MA additions.

 

[quantumcosmic]

Alright so after testing this morning with the SWCG off overnight, it would seem I have 0 chlorine if I am understanding the test right. When I put the DPD powder into the water while stirring, there is no observable color change. I ran the test 2x, first time put in powder and then began adding drops of the 871, no change. I then rinsed and dried everything and ran it again. I added powder, no change, a bit more powder, no change. I did not bother with drops the 2nd time around since I verified the powder made no change. So, now what?

Quick edit: I just want to add that I would not be surprised if there are extra organic in the water. I have a mesquite tree right up against my back wall and if the wind blows, like it does frequently, I end up with a ton of leaves in the water. I assume the filters are pretty full of gunk so I will be cleaning them this week sometime.

 

[Texas Splash]

I added powder, no change, a bit more powder, no change.

The test tube should turn pink immediately after adding the powder. You have zero chlorine which is never a good thing. You will need to add some liquid chlorine ASAP to prevent algae if it hasn't started already. I would grab a couple gallons at the store now. Add one gallon right away then test again in about an hour. Add the second gallon after that if the FC drops below 3 ppm.

Then it will be time to try and figure out why your FC is crashing to zero. Either the SWG is not operating as designed or you already have algae eating the chlorine.

 

[quantumcosmic]

The test tube should turn pink immediately after adding the powder. You have zero chlorine which is never a good thing. You will need to add some liquid chlorine ASAP to prevent algae if it hasn't started already. I would grab a couple gallons at the store now. Add one gallon right away then test again in about an hour. Add the second gallon after that if the FC drops below 3 ppm.

Then it will be time to try and figure out why your FC is crashing to zero. Either the SWG is not operating as designed or you already have algae eating the chlorine.

There is no visible algae anywhere and never has been. I will clean the filter and then add chlorine tonight.

And I know the swg is working because yesterday morning I had chlorine.

 

[Texas Splash]

For some TFP perspective, we gauge a pool's chlorine loss in a 24 hr period. If a pool consumed more than 4 ppm of chlorine in a 24 hrs period, one of the following is occurring:
- Improper FAS-DPD testing
- Large pool party/bather's load naturally using more chlorine
- CYA is too low resulting in FC loss to UV
- Algae. This should be ruled out by passing the Overnight Chlorine Loss Test before adding stabilizer.

Algae in not always visible. Pre-bloom is often undetectable to the eye until cloudiness occurs followed by the green.

 

[Newdude]

+1. Algae is microscopic. If you can see it, it's already waaaaaaaaaaaaay too late.

 

[quantumcosmic]

So what am I to do? The pool hasn’t had visible algae for 3 years, including the whole year we lived out of state and performed 0 maintenance on it. I last added any kind of chemicals before January this year.

 

[Texas Splash]

So what am I to do?

Just be mindful of the note above and watch accordingly. We're not implying you have algae at the moment, but to see all your FC drop to zero in warm weather is reason for caution. Those of us with SWG's tend to kick back and let the pool run itself (I certainly do), but odd things happen. Your first instinct may be to add stabilizer, but before you do, consider the OCLT first. If you pass that, no worries. Add some stabilizer and press-on.

 

[quantumcosmic]

Just be mindful of the note above and watch accordingly. We're not implying you have algae at the moment, but to see all your FC drop to zero in warm weather is reason for caution. Those of us with SWG's tend to kick back and let the pool run itself (I certainly do), but odd things happen. Your first instinct may be to add stabilizer, but before you do, consider the OCLT first. If you pass that, no worries. Add some stabilizer and press-on.

I did the OCLT last night and this morning with the result in the morning of 0 chlorine. The test didn’t turn a bit pink.

So now what? Add chlorine? What % and how much? Is there a good calculator to use? My biggest goal is to have the water feel as best as possible. Also would like to prevent equipment damage from chemical imbalances.

 

[Texas Splash]

So now what? Add chlorine? What % and how much? Is there a good calculator to use?

Yes to all. You should add a good 5-7 ppm worth of 10% chlorine right away. The PoolMath APP can help you with the exact dosage. By my calculations, one gallon of 10% should be just over 7 ppm in your 12.4K pool. I'd do that right away then check again this evening and add the other gallon if necessary so that you can do a good OCLT with good FC readings.