Installing a Pentair IC60 - Installation and Logic Questions

[Puertex]

Hello All,
I am installing an IC60 SWG and will be connecting it to the Pentair EZ Touch 8.
I have been reading a lot of threads learning what has been said in the past so that I can post semi intelligent questions.
Presently, I run my Intelliflo VS 24/7 at about 1200 RPMs, ramping up (aux 7) twice a day to 2500 RPM for an hour to inject bleach(Stenner), activate skimmer flow and to Spillover from spa into the pool to circulate spa water.
For my new installation, I would like to speed up the pump RPMs enough that I can keep the cell on. Setting the cell to 100%, I would like to optimize the cell run time. For my pool size that should be around 7.5 hrs per day to produce 3 ppm (worst case scenario). The rest of the time I would like to return the pump to 1200 RPMs.
Questions:
- I would appreciate if @Jimrahbe or someone else can clarify why in a previous post he suggested to connect the pump to the line side of the main pump relay while connecting the IC60 to the load side?
-Is the advantage of doing this that the relay is turned on to independently turn the IC60 on and off while the pump keeps running? So when the pool circuit is turned on, basically a speed command is sent to the already running pump and it also turns on the IC60?
- When operating like this, when the pool circuit is off for no IC60, the pump is powered...But at what speed? When the pump is connected to the line side but the pool circuit command is turned off, how is the pump speed determined? If the pool circuit is turned off, will the user generic circuits using the pump run?
- Also, the only way to turn the pump off would be by dropping the breaker?
-By running the cell at 100%, minimizing the run time, does the cell life get maximized?
- How does the IC60 get set up in the panel configuration. My Screenlogic has a setting checkoff box for a chlorinator. Does a new screen show up when this box is selected?
Thanks in advance for the information provided by this forum.
Puertex

 

[Jimrahbe]

P,

All VS pumps should get constant AC power. That is why they are either wired directly to a circuit breaker, or can be wired to the Line (input) side of the Pump/Filter relay, this will also provide constant AC power to the pump.

The IC60 is wired to the Load (output) side of the Pump/Filter relay as the Primary safety device to prevent the cell from getting any AC power unless the pump is running. The key is that the Pump/Filter relay will only close (and turn on the cell) when the System is in AUTO, and in the Pool or Spa mode, and if the pump is being told to run.

Not sure of your electrical rates, but I doubt you'd be able to tell the difference in running the pump at 1200 RPM and at a speed that will turn the cell's flow switch on. My guess would be 1500, maybe a little less or a little more. You should experiment and see where it comes on and then add 100 RPM and see where you are.

In my mind running at 100% does not make sense.. If you are already running at 100% you can't increase your cell's output, you can only run the pump longer. Kind of does away with the whole point of being able to adjust the output via your EasyTouch. When you tell the EasyTouch that you have a SWCG, you will see a page like this..


View media item 1963

My suggestion would be to run your cell 24/7 and set the % output to whatever makes the amount of chlorine you need. With an IC60 it will be down in the 20% to 30% range.

It does not matter if you run 10 hours at 10% or 1 hour at 100% you have still used up the same amount of cell plates.

Your pump should run on a schedule.. If the pump is running and you want to turn it off, what you should do is go into the Service mode. This will cause the EasyTouch to no longer control the pump. In the Service mode, the pump is run from the pump's control panel. That is what the Service mode is for.

When in AUTO, you can also just push the "F" button, but I never recommend this as it is sometimes possible to confuse the EasyTouch scheduling.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Puertex]

P,

All VS pumps should get constant AC power. That is why they are either wired directly to a circuit breaker, or can be wired to the Line (input) side of the Pump/Filter relay, this will also provide constant AC power to the pump.

The IC60 is wired to the Load (output) side of the Pump/Filter relay as the Primary safety device to prevent the cell from getting any AC power unless the pump is running. The key is that the Pump/Filter relay will only close (and turn on the cell) when the System is in AUTO, and in the Pool or Spa mode, and if the pump is being told to run.

Not sure of your electrical rates, but I doubt you'd be able to tell the difference in running the pump at 1200 RPM and at a speed that will turn the cell's flow switch on. My guess would be 1500, maybe a little less or a little more. You should experiment and see where it comes on and then add 100 RPM and see where you are.

In my mind running at 100% does not make sense.. If you are already running at 100% you can't increase your cell's output, you can only run the pump longer. Kind of does away with the whole point of being able to adjust the output via your EasyTouch. When you tell the EasyTouch that you have a SWCG, you will see a page like this..


View media item 1963

My suggestion would be to run your cell 24/7 and set the % output to whatever makes the amount of chlorine you need. With an IC60 it will be down in the 20% to 30% range.

It does not matter if you run 10 hours at 10% or 1 hour at 100% you have still used up the same amount of cell plates.

Your pump should run on a schedule.. If the pump is running and you want to turn it off, what you should do is go into the Service mode. This will cause the EasyTouch to no longer control the pump. In the Service mode, the pump is run from the pump's control panel. That is what the Service mode is for.

When in AUTO, you can also just push the "F" button, but I never recommend this as it is sometimes possible to confuse the EasyTouch scheduling.

Thanks,

Jim R.

P,

All VS pumps should get constant AC power. That is why they are either wired directly to a circuit breaker, or can be wired to the Line (input) side of the Pump/Filter relay, this will also provide constant AC power to the pump.

The IC60 is wired to the Load (output) side of the Pump/Filter relay as the Primary safety device to prevent the cell from getting any AC power unless the pump is running. The key is that the Pump/Filter relay will only close (and turn on the cell) when the System is in AUTO, and in the Pool or Spa mode, and if the pump is being told to run.

Not sure of your electrical rates, but I doubt you'd be able to tell the difference in running the pump at 1200 RPM and at a speed that will turn the cell's flow switch on. My guess would be 1500, maybe a little less or a little more. You should experiment and see where it comes on and then add 100 RPM and see where you are.

In my mind running at 100% does not make sense.. If you are already running at 100% you can't increase your cell's output, you can only run the pump longer. Kind of does away with the whole point of being able to adjust the output via your EasyTouch. When you tell the EasyTouch that you have a SWCG, you will see a page like this..


View media item 1963

My suggestion would be to run your cell 24/7 and set the % output to whatever makes the amount of chlorine you need. With an IC60 it will be down in the 20% to 30% range.

It does not matter if you run 10 hours at 10% or 1 hour at 100% you have still used up the same amount of cell plates.

Your pump should run on a schedule.. If the pump is running and you want to turn it off, what you should do is go into the Service mode. This will cause the EasyTouch to no longer control the pump. In the Service mode, the pump is run from the pump's control panel. That is what the Service mode is for.

When in AUTO, you can also just push the "F" button, but I never recommend this as it is sometimes possible to confuse the EasyTouch scheduling.

Thanks,

Jim R.

Hello Jim,
I did not know that the cell life is based on chlorine production rather than hours of operation.
Also, if the speed required to clear the flow switch, is not significantly higher than the low speed I run, then extending the production over 24 hrs while reducing the cell controller % output makes sense.
Appreciate the feedback !
Puertex

 

[Jimrahbe]

I did not know that the cell life is based on chlorine production rather than hours of operation.

P,

It is really the same basic thing. If the cell is making chlorine, it is using up the cell life. If the cell is not making chlorine , it is not using up the cell life.

A good example is that at 50% output the cell is making chlorine for 2.5 minutes and then it rests (not making chlorine) for 2.5 minute. So if you run the cell for an hour while it is set to 50%, you have only used up a half hour of cell life.

I don't get hung up on cell life. Most cells last 5 to 7 years. Some die early and some last longer. When the cell dies, it does not really matter what the cell shows as remaining cell life, it is still dead.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Puertex]

P,

It is really the same basic thing. If the cell is making chlorine, it is using up the cell life. If the cell is not making chlorine , it is not using up the cell life.

A good example is that at 50% output the cell is making chlorine for 2.5 minutes and then it rests (not making chlorine) for 2.5 minute. So if you run the cell for an hour while it is set to 50%, you have only used up a half hour of cell life.

I don't get hung up on cell life. Most cells last 5 to 7 years. Some die early and some last longer. When the cell dies, it does not really matter what the cell shows as remaining cell life, it is still dead.

Thanks,

Jim R.

Hello Jim,
OK, this clears up how the system works. The % selected does not regulate the cell production rate, it controls the time interval. When the cell is on, it is on 100%.
So, the IC60 generates 1.33 oz(weight)/hr of chlorine and then assuming the pool loses 3 ppm/day, for my pool size I would need 10 oz by weight/day (Thank you Pool Math) the cell would be set at 31%. Nice, plenty of capacity !
Thanks for sharing your knowledge !
Puertex

 

[ajw22]

OK, this clears up how the system works. The % selected does not regulate the cell production rate, it controls the time interval. When the cell is on, it is on 100%.

SWG Generation Cycle Times - Further Reading

www.troublefreepool.com

SWG How It Works - Further Reading

www.troublefreepool.com

 

[Puertex]

P,

All VS pumps should get constant AC power. That is why they are either wired directly to a circuit breaker, or can be wired to the Line (input) side of the Pump/Filter relay, this will also provide constant AC power to the pump.

The IC60 is wired to the Load (output) side of the Pump/Filter relay as the Primary safety device to prevent the cell from getting any AC power unless the pump is running. The key is that the Pump/Filter relay will only close (and turn on the cell) when the System is in AUTO, and in the Pool or Spa mode, and if the pump is being told to run.

Not sure of your electrical rates, but I doubt you'd be able to tell the difference in running the pump at 1200 RPM and at a speed that will turn the cell's flow switch on. My guess would be 1500, maybe a little less or a little more. You should experiment and see where it comes on and then add 100 RPM and see where you are.

In my mind running at 100% does not make sense.. If you are already running at 100% you can't increase your cell's output, you can only run the pump longer. Kind of does away with the whole point of being able to adjust the output via your EasyTouch. When you tell the EasyTouch that you have a SWCG, you will see a page like this..


View media item 1963

My suggestion would be to run your cell 24/7 and set the % output to whatever makes the amount of chlorine you need. With an IC60 it will be down in the 20% to 30% range.

It does not matter if you run 10 hours at 10% or 1 hour at 100% you have still used up the same amount of cell plates.

Your pump should run on a schedule.. If the pump is running and you want to turn it off, what you should do is go into the Service mode. This will cause the EasyTouch to no longer control the pump. In the Service mode, the pump is run from the pump's control panel. That is what the Service mode is for.

When in AUTO, you can also just push the "F" button, but I never recommend this as it is sometimes possible to confuse the EasyTouch scheduling.

Thanks,

Jim R.

I had the IC60 and Aquastar 35000 Pipeline filter installed today.

The install went well and I felt I was relatively well informed (Thanks to TFP!) by the time the work was completed.

I had a PB do the installation, but due to the information I learned here I was able to understand the equipment, ask intelligent questions and set up my Screenlogic programming.

I did spend a few days changing the water chemistry to what is prescribed by TFP for SWGs and I am close to getting there.

The most difficult parameter to adjust for me is bringing the TA down to 70 with MA because I have to then raise the PH with aeration and it takes time but I am almost there.

Thanks,
Puertex

 

[Jimrahbe]

P,

Reducing TA is more of a process rather than a one time deal..

If you keep adding MA, over time the TA will come down. My pool works best with a TA of 50 to 60.

If you are in a rush, you can reduce it in a couple of days.

You test and see where TA and pH are.. You add enough MA to drop the pH to about 7.0 and then test again every couple of hours. When the pH gets up to 7.6 or so, add MA again. Just keep doing this over and over again. At first the drop in TA will not be much or last too long. But as time goes by the drop in TA will get larger the it will tend to say lower longer. All the time you are doing this you should have the pump running with as much aeration as possible.

I have not had to do this in a while, but when I did, it took me two days to get from about 120 or 140 down to 50. Basically all day Sat from breakfast to bedtime, and then the same the next day.

How long it stays down has a lot to do with the TA of your fill water.

Thanks,

Jim R.