- May 3, 2014
- 62,685
- Pool Size
- 6000
- Surface
- Fiberglass
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
No
Keep adding the same amount of chlorine each day while waiting on the test kit.
Cartridge filter in series with DE filter, and balance water before or after slam method?
- Thread starter Jeffsp
- Start date
Keep adding the same amount of chlorine each day while waiting on the test kit.
It sounds like you are limping along the best you can until you are armed and can launch a proper attack.
Thank you guys for the responses and help. Looks like my test kit is due to arrive tomorrow, so pretty ready to get this under way and fixed.
I’m suspecting that everything will be low, alkalinity, ph, and cya. If it is, do I adjust alkalinity before ph?
Do I just adjust ph and cya? And then move onto slamming the pool? Can I adjust them at the same time?
Thank you for the help again
I’m suspecting that everything will be low, alkalinity, ph, and cya. If it is, do I adjust alkalinity before ph?
Do I just adjust ph and cya? And then move onto slamming the pool? Can I adjust them at the same time?
Thank you for the help again
Report back with #s. It's easy enough to do but it can also wait until after. *important step here with new kit* Read directions carefully and wipe the tip with a damp paper towel in between drops. The test bottle for TA gets static charged in shipping and it messes up the drips for the first several tests.
Ok. Updating again. Test kit showed today. Tested at about 2pm today:
Used the FAS-DPD test,
FC: .2-.4 (think it was actually zero, it never turned pink, had to add additional powder to make it pink, and 1-2 drops to bring it back to clear)
CC: 2
pH: 6.8
TA: 60
CH: 150
CYA: 0, never even turned the water cloudy.
As per pool math, Added 2lb 10 oz of ph rise, pre-dissolved in a bucket before adding, 3.9lbs of stabilizer thru a sock in the wall skimmer, and about 2 hours later, my nightly half gallon of liquid chlorine to add 5ppm of chlorine.
Reverted back to my cartridge filter, just to improve flow, and circulation. Retested again about 4 hours later, and got much better numbers:
FC: 4
CC: 1
pH: 7.4
CYA: 50
I finally have free chlorine. Even showed up on the test strips ( used them in the meantime just to see if they showed any change)
So the pool is still a green color, I finally have FC reading, even with the strips, which they never showed before on the test strips either.
Now that I have Some free chlorine and other levels are at what they should be, should I start the slam process?
I can add enough chlorine tonight to get to the 20ppm, but I have work tomorrow and may not get to retest the water and add chlorine until tomorrow until about 3:30pm.
Should I maintain at the 5ppm and then start the slam process tomorrow afternoon and carry thru the weekend? Or should I get the chlorine up now?
Thanks all for the help
Used the FAS-DPD test,
FC: .2-.4 (think it was actually zero, it never turned pink, had to add additional powder to make it pink, and 1-2 drops to bring it back to clear)
CC: 2
pH: 6.8
TA: 60
CH: 150
CYA: 0, never even turned the water cloudy.
As per pool math, Added 2lb 10 oz of ph rise, pre-dissolved in a bucket before adding, 3.9lbs of stabilizer thru a sock in the wall skimmer, and about 2 hours later, my nightly half gallon of liquid chlorine to add 5ppm of chlorine.
Reverted back to my cartridge filter, just to improve flow, and circulation. Retested again about 4 hours later, and got much better numbers:
FC: 4
CC: 1
pH: 7.4
CYA: 50
I finally have free chlorine. Even showed up on the test strips ( used them in the meantime just to see if they showed any change)
So the pool is still a green color, I finally have FC reading, even with the strips, which they never showed before on the test strips either.
Now that I have Some free chlorine and other levels are at what they should be, should I start the slam process?
I can add enough chlorine tonight to get to the 20ppm, but I have work tomorrow and may not get to retest the water and add chlorine until tomorrow until about 3:30pm.
Should I maintain at the 5ppm and then start the slam process tomorrow afternoon and carry thru the weekend? Or should I get the chlorine up now?
Thanks all for the help
Last edited:
- May 3, 2014
- 62,685
- Pool Size
- 6000
- Surface
- Fiberglass
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
Many people have waited until the weekend when they can be more available. Starting tonight or in the morning wont hurt either. If you need to get a break from the pool you can test/dose earlier than your 2-3 hour time to buy that much time off after. You can hit the pool hard while still getting your weekend errands/activities done.
Thank you again for all the help. I decided to go ahead and added 1.7 gallons of chlorine to the pool as per pool math to get it up to 20ppm. I added it at 9:30 last night.
This morning at 5am, I tested again. Found FC 3 and CC 1. I added another 2 gallons of chlorine. The color of the pool water has not changed, in fact, I think it might be slightly darker looking. I hope I’m on the right track, I was hoping to see a little less green this morning now that I’m starting to get FC readings.
Couple of questions, should I be testing after adding chlorine to confirm that FC has really been dosed to the required amount of FC, and how long after should I test?
I will test again today around 4 and adjust chlorine as needed. How long between testing and dosing is ideal? If I test more frequently and keep the level up, will I stand a better chance of using less chlorine?
Thank you all again.
It's a process. Being patient is the hardest step of the process.
You 'should', but if you're testing and adding all the time for SLAM, you'll kill your kit testing a 2nd time for confirmation. So we advise to save supplies and trust that the FC is high enough even if the bottle wasn't full strength. More often than not, it was.
15 mins with good circulation is all you ever need to mix bleach.
So as the process goes, it gets longer between doses as it holds. 2-3 hours is best to start, do the best you can. But 2 hours turns into 4 which turns into 8 and if you hit it hard over the weekend, you'd likely have enough window to get a full workday in on Monday.
You aren't hurting anything now by going longer between doses, it all helps, but anytime below SLAM level makes the process take longer. Go hard as soon as you get the chance.
You got this.
Thank you again. In my previous experience, eventually the green dropped out and the pool turned cloudy white. Will that likely happen? This is the greenest it’s ever been, and no progress really has been made?It's a process. Being patient is the hardest step of the process.
You 'should', but if you're testing and adding all the time for SLAM, you'll kill your kit testing a 2nd time for confirmation. So we advise to save supplies and trust that the FC is high enough even if the bottle wasn't full strength. More often than not, it was.
15 mins with good circulation is all you ever need to mix bleach.
So as the process goes, it gets longer between doses as it holds. 2-3 hours is best to start, do the best you can. But 2 hours turns into 4 which turns into 8 and if you hit it hard over the weekend, you'd likely have enough window to get a full workday in on Monday.
You aren't hurting anything now by going longer between doses, it all helps, but anytime below SLAM level makes the process take longer. Go hard as soon as you get the chance.
You got this.
I ask because I made the switch back over to my cartridge filter, and I’m getting no change yet. What’s more is the pressure hasn’t even increased in the filter, leading me to believe, maybe it’s not actually filtering out any dead algae. I have another cartridge that I will drop in there, and let go one more night, but I’m wondering if I should go back with the DE filter and just keeping regenerating and changing out DE as needed? Does dead algae clog the filter just as easily as live algae?
I guess also what I’m asking too is, can the pool get to the point where it’s “clean” and passes the overnight chlorine drop test, if my filtration isn’t keeping up?
So it didn't go green overnight and it won't be undone quickly either. Green is alive algae. Milky/cloudy blue is dead or mostly dead algae. The filter has zero to do with killing algae and that's chlorines job. If the pool is still green you have more algae to kill, and the attention should be on keeping the FC at SLAM level. You also absolutely must remove any clumps of muck / leaves / etc or the yucky patches will consume the FC in no time. Testing and adding every 2-3 hours really helps Jumpstart the process at first, but you have to stay at it. It not 'well I did it twice at 2 hours and now I'm taking 15 hours off'. Life gets in the way sometimes. We get that. We all have to manage our days as well. So. Believe me. We totally get it. But anytime the pool is below SLAM it will take longer, no matter how bad of a SLAM it is. Do the best you can and the results will follow.
Got any pics for reference?
Got any pics for reference?
Again, thank you very much for all help and encouragement. I’ve had this happen a few times in the past couple years, and I’ve always been able to bring it back within a couple days with a couple bags of shock. But this has been the worst I’ve ever had it, and I know I’ve only actually just started the Slam process last night, but it feels like I’ve just been dumping excessive amounts of chlorine with no change at all. Without proper testing and balancing it’s pretty obvious how I ended up here.So it didn't go green overnight and it won't be undone quickly either. Green is alive algae. Milky/cloudy blue is dead or mostly dead algae. The filter has zero to do with killing algae and that's chlorines job. If the pool is still green you have more algae to kill, and the attention should be on keeping the FC at SLAM level. You also absolutely must remove any clumps of muck / leaves / etc or the yucky patches will consume the FC in no time. Testing and adding every 2-3 hours really helps Jumpstart the process at first, but you have to stay at it. It not 'well I did it twice at 2 hours and now I'm taking 15 hours off'. Life gets in the way sometimes. We get that. We all have to manage our days as well. So. Believe me. We totally get it. But anytime the pool is below SLAM it will take longer, no matter how bad of a SLAM it is. Do the best you can and the results will follow.
Got any pics for reference?
I don’t have a picture on my phone, but I’ll add one later on when I can get one. I guess I wasn’t sure if the filter would pull out what is dead even if some algae is still alive. As you can tell, I’m now starting to doubt my filtration as well, so it’s kinda a relief to hear that regardless of what the filter is doing, I need the green to at least drop out first.
As for if there’s any debris on the bottom, I cannot tell. The water is dark enough that I can’t see the bottom. Before it greened up last weekend, there was maybe a few leaves on the bottom, but not much at all. I have a pentair crawly vacuum that I’ve dropped in a few times, but it tends to miss things and likes to repeat paths it’s already made. Would it be best for me to drop that back in and let it go for most of the time? Or to try and manually vacuum it?
And finally, if for some reason, as a last resort, do you think a complete or partial water changed would become necessary if for some reason I don’t have any success of this weekend?
Draining is always the easiest path. You may not have a clear drainage path, or water costs may be outrageous, or even a moral issue with exchanging water with the earth (its impossible to 'waste' but sucking thousands of new gallons takes energy and possibly trucking it and isn't perfect either).
So some folks chose to stand and fight. At which point, the process just works. It may take several days or even a week to get over the green, and then several days or even a week to filter it all out. There are easy ones (not yours unfortunately), and longer ones, but most fit into the week or two category.
Without accurate testing and controlled dosing, it's 'dump and pray' as you used to do. Maybe you get it all, but without an Overnight Chlorine Loss Test to prove its gone, it'll be back soon.
Have another read at SLAM Process. It's a boat ton of info to process and each run through it sinks in some more. Process it again and then read it again.
Brushing and vacuuming are just as important. Make sure to be hitting those at least once a day as well. Brushing is quick so there's no reason it can't be several times a day.
Get some pics up when you can. Keep us posted.
Here’s the current color. Not pretty at all.
I do think I’m starting make headway though. The water is more of clear green, rather then the hazy green it was. I can just barely make out the pattern on the bottom.
Also more importantly, this morning FC was at 3 and I added 2 gallons of chlorine at 5AM to get it up to slam levels. I then rechecked at about 4PM today, and was at 10.5 for FC. So it’s starting to not burn free chlorine as quickly. I will check again at 6 or 7pm and adjust as needed. Also considering if I should drain a small portion of the pool to try and drop my CYA closer to 30, and maybe use a little less chlorine.
Hopefully it’ll get there.
Thank you all again
Just a couple more questions,
My combined chlorine is consistently at 1 at every test. Shouldn’t it be going up suggesting that the FC is doing its job?
Again, no real change in color this morning, so I’m just concerned if there could be any other issues.
I’m going to retest my cya today and confirm that it’s 50ppm for sure. If my first test was off and cya is more then 50ppm, would that cause high FC but low CC?
During the test, at 60ppm, I could faintly make out the black dot, it wasn’t till about 50 that I couldn’t see it anymore. I didn’t look at the dot while filling, I just filled to each interval and checked so I guess there’s a possibility that it could be in between and maybe at 55ppm. Should I maybe just change out some water and add back? If I find that cya is higher then originally thought, is there a way to determine how much water would need to be changed out to get to a desired level of cya? If I end up having to change some water out, I’d prefer to get closer to 30-40ppm.
And finally, I’ve been trying to check the FC every few hours and add back to get to the 20ppm slam number. Is there a threshold that needs to be met in order for the chlorine to be doing it’s job? Is the 20ppm that threshold? Should I be shooting only for 20ppm or should I be going over that? When I test and find FC at 15ppm, is the chlorine still sanatizing at that point? Or do I need to make better attempts to keep it consistently at 20 all the time? While I’m finding the pool is keeping more FC each time I test, I still will probably need to start testing every hour to keep it that consistent.
My combined chlorine is consistently at 1 at every test. Shouldn’t it be going up suggesting that the FC is doing its job?
Again, no real change in color this morning, so I’m just concerned if there could be any other issues.
I’m going to retest my cya today and confirm that it’s 50ppm for sure. If my first test was off and cya is more then 50ppm, would that cause high FC but low CC?
During the test, at 60ppm, I could faintly make out the black dot, it wasn’t till about 50 that I couldn’t see it anymore. I didn’t look at the dot while filling, I just filled to each interval and checked so I guess there’s a possibility that it could be in between and maybe at 55ppm. Should I maybe just change out some water and add back? If I find that cya is higher then originally thought, is there a way to determine how much water would need to be changed out to get to a desired level of cya? If I end up having to change some water out, I’d prefer to get closer to 30-40ppm.
And finally, I’ve been trying to check the FC every few hours and add back to get to the 20ppm slam number. Is there a threshold that needs to be met in order for the chlorine to be doing it’s job? Is the 20ppm that threshold? Should I be shooting only for 20ppm or should I be going over that? When I test and find FC at 15ppm, is the chlorine still sanatizing at that point? Or do I need to make better attempts to keep it consistently at 20 all the time? While I’m finding the pool is keeping more FC each time I test, I still will probably need to start testing every hour to keep it that consistent.
It depends on the snapshot in time that your sample was taken. You are likely to have more overnight without the sun burning them off. Or if you brush well and stir a bunch up, an immediate test may show an increase but later on not so much.
It's just one tool of several.
No. FC at normal target level is enough to produce that many CCs. Being a little off on your SLAM target won't matter.
Use 60 as we always round up.
To reduce 60 CYA to 30, it requires a 50% drain. The fill water has 0 CYA so it's an even % or fraction. At 60, 15 CYA is 1/4, 20 is 1/3, 30 is half, etc.
SLAM (40% of CYA, 24 FC for 60 CYA) has been optimized between killing efficiency and waste to the sun. No need to tweak it further, it has stood the test of time for thousands of members.
No need to test every hour, every two hours is still great. A leftover 15 FC still has 15 to donate to the fight. Think of it like 20 friends came to help you move but 5 went to lunch. The 15 of you left are still going to make a big dent in the loading, but 20 would have helped even more. 3 of you still make progress and although slower, it's still forward progress no matter what.
Thank you so much again Newdude. This really is very helpful. My thinking was that you needed to be above the 40% of CYA for the chlorine to oxidize everything and that anything under 40%, the CYA would inhibit it’s ability to work.
So I’ve been going with 50 for my CYA, so I’ve been underdosing a bit then.
Do you think I would have better results changing out a 1/4-1/3 of the water in hopes to drop CYA to around 40-45ppm?
I assume the only problem with that, is I will have to start the slam process all over again, but I would then hopefully, have slightly cleaner water to start, and won’t have to use quite as much chlorine throughout the process.
So I’ve been going with 50 for my CYA, so I’ve been underdosing a bit then.
Do you think I would have better results changing out a 1/4-1/3 of the water in hopes to drop CYA to around 40-45ppm?
I assume the only problem with that, is I will have to start the slam process all over again, but I would then hopefully, have slightly cleaner water to start, and won’t have to use quite as much chlorine throughout the process.
None whatsoever. Any level on the CYA chart is equal. So you'll be as efficient at a 12FC 30 CYA slam as you will with a 28FC 70CYA slam.
However. It requires far less chlorine to maintain a 12FC. So you are in fact greatly helping yourself, and your wallet by draining. Draining or filling isn't always viable so sometimes it makes more sense to stand and fight. Like with poor exit directions for the water to go, or iron laden well filling.
If you do drain, you only have to fight the (half ?) That's left so right away it got easier. And then it's more economical to maintain the lower FC for slam so you won twice.
This is what I was thinking. Unfortunately I got called into work today, so I won’t be able to get started till around 3 this afternoon, but I’ll drop my pump in and then pull a siphon on 2 different hoses to drain it down some what quickly. Then the fill process.
Once I start filling should I start adding chlorine I assume? Should I go with 5ppm until full? Also, I’m sure I will need to check and possibly adjust my ph once full as well.