Help me understand why the calculator says the target is out of range given the CYA number indicates it?

Just tested my TA and I am either at 50 or 60. It went a pinkish at 50, but one more drop made it red.

The instructions say red, but pink is a lighter shade of it. 50 would be my minimum for TA, so it's either good at 60 or I should be keeping an eye on it if it's 50.

What's the concensus?

Woke up this morning to a seam rip on the side seam of my soft-sided pool about halfway down. The pool drained almost to that spot overnight and will be there soon.

Is there ANY chance I can repair this or should I just retire the pool?

Hello, I've decided to maintain the pool myself and recently got a new Pentair filter and variable speed pump installed. Everything seems to be working but I don't understand the two valves that are between the spa and the pump. I've attached the pictures.

1) The valve has arrows on them pointing towards the pump. When pump is running at max speed 3450, the pressure on the filter is at about 1 PSI. The water is sucked from the skimmer and returned to the pool. I believe this is the normal operation (at lower RPM of course.)
2) When I turned the left valve to point towards the spa (3450 RPM), the jets in the spa furiously short water in the spa, the pressure on the filter shoots to 30PSI and filter starts leaking. I couldn't change direction of the valve at this point and quickly turned off the pump and changed the direction of the valve to point back to the pump.
3) When I turned the right valve to point towards the spa(3450 RPM), the jets in the spa softly shot water in the spa, the water level in spa starts dropping rather fast, and the pressure on the filter is about 10PSI. I pointed the valve back to the pump and pressure returned to 1 PSI.
In all 3 cases above, the Hayward Phoenix attached to the skimmer kept on moving.
I would like to know the function of the valve and when/how they should be used?

Another question I have is about the pump runtime. By reading few things here, it seems like the consensus is that a full water turnover cannot be achieved and hence 3-4 of hours is all that is needed. My question is, how will the surface be skimmed if I have the suction side vacuum attached to the skimmer?
This is a great site and I will be spending a lot more time reading up. Thanks.

Perhaps lots of misinformation out there, do I need an in-line sacrificial zinc anode once I put salt in the pool for a SWG to produce chlorine?

I've been opening and closing my pool for a few seasons now and I assumed my main drain was open. I didn't live here before that and I don't recall how the previous owners closed the system. Recently I dove down in the pool with goggles and saw a rubber plug in the main drain.

The way I normally close is that I blow air through the suction line pipe where it connects to my pump. I have an anthony/sylvan style pool with a two tier plug for the skimmer because the main drain and skimmer are on the same line with a "T" to the pump (See attached diagram). With two people I first blow all the water out of the skimmer and push the two tier plug down 1 tier. Then I keep blowing out to the main drain for a good 1 minute of air bubbles and then plug the suction line at the pump. IT never made too much sense to me, so maybe that is wrong but I haven't had issues. If the main drain was plugged this whole time then I should not have seen any air coming out of there when closing, so I must of forced the plug out and its just gravity keeping it there or the suction when I open up the pool.

So my question is, should I have the main drain plugged? And do I need to plug it while air is coming out of it? So dive in and have someone push air from the suction line in the pump? I assume this is the "right way" because if I don't do this and just plug the main drain without forced air, then there will be water in the pipe between the skimmer and the main drain. I don't want that right?

And let's say I do it the "right way" with forced air, then if I run the pump after that then the air in the pipe between skimmer and main drain will be pulled out and replaced with water. So in fact, there is no way for me to plug the main drain without leaving water in the pipes. So it makes me think that maybe I need to remove the plug on the main drain so that I can close it with forced air, as I believed I was doing. Also, I still don't really get how air just doesn't escape up out of the main drain after I force air in and plug the pump side. Maybe I've had the wrong idea of what is going on this whole time. What should I be doing?

Is the TA calculation in pool math an “approximation” like PH or should it be pretty accurate?

For example, over a period of a week when I’ve added enough MA that should lower TA by ~25, my testing (TF100) shows more like a ~10 drop. This is pretty consistent. I do have high TA fill water but based on my daily evaporation rates I don’t think that would account for anywhere near that difference.

Other than the DE or sand particles I guess, what is the reason for only a cartridge filter being specified here. Not sure why PB didn't spot this as I would assume warranty would now be in jeopardy.

Hi all,

I need a little help with what steps to take to troubleshoot an issue with my SWG, which is a 3 year old Jandy Aquapure 1400. My pool is about 21000 gal.

The main symptom is that it seems like the SWG is having a hard time “keeping up” and I need to run it at a higher percentage and longer than prior summers.

In past summers, I’ve run it at around 75% for 12 hours a day, which according to Pool Math is about 2.5 ppm of FC per day. This summer, I’ve bumped it up to 100% for 14 hours a day which is about 4 ppm FC per day and it’s still having trouble keeping up - I see a couple ppm of FC drop in weekly tests and I top off with liquid chlorine. I try to keep FC at around 7-9 ppm for my CYA of 60-70. I use TFTestkit.

My CYA is about the same - around 60-70. I can’t think of why this summer would be different except something is wrong with the cell, but it seems way too early (3 years, two full summers) for a cell to die.

I do see bubbles coming out…it seems to be working from what I can tell. Most of the time I don’t see any error codes. I have a couple times seen a No Flow code which I don’t understand because there IS flow, and it disappears after a while on its own, and most of the time when I spot check it does not show any errors. I wish it kept a log of errors vs time so I could see how often the no flow is in vs me just spot checking. I have twice seen a 120 error code but have not seen it since I descaled the cell with MA a few months ago.

Is this how SWGs fail as they age - just gradually lose productivity? Most of the forum posts I’ve found is more of a sudden zero production?

Any tips on next steps? It’s still under warranty but I don’t think my pool builder / Jandy will honor it with no error codes…though I haven’t tried.

Hi ya'll, having a trouble holding FC over the past few days. Tested FC yesterday after a week of no testing and had zero FC. The SWG has been set to 100 for a while now, cell looks fine. It's probably 4 years old and haven't had issues w. it before producing. Pool is clear and I don't suspect algae yet. In fact I added liquid yesterday morning to get up to 7 ppm and this morning it was gone. It's been over 100 daily here in Florida but that is an extreme loss with the SWG running so high in conjunction to my add. Thoughts? SLAM?

FC- 1
CC- .5
PH- 7.4
TA- 60
CH- 350
CYA- 80
Salt- 3000
Temp- 90

Hey All!

Is there any way to attach a comment to a test result that’ll show in the logs? I’ve been adding a note after until now, but just figured there may be an easier way?

TIA

Ok. Although I have learned about pool chemistry and maintaining my pool thanks to this site, I am totally new to closing a pool. The problem I am having is the articles on this site are tailored towards pools in US. Around here most of us have concrete overflow pools with separate overflow tanks (the water first overflows into a smaller basin and then sucked to filter), fully tiled, no skimmers, and return jets are at the bottom (hence lowering the water level below the return jets have no meaning for us). Winters are quite mild and no freezing occurs. In order to translate the given advice I would like to understand the objectives behind closing a pool.

Before the winter many people here drain the pool to half and let the algae grow and the frogs sing. Beginning of summer pool is fully drained and cleaned with acid and then refilled with clean water. Why is the practice like this? Pool is drained to half to protect a concrete pool from seismic shocks and avoid overflow from rain. Then it is fully drained and cleaned with acid. Tiles are very resistant to acid. At most you get grout damage which you can fix every 5 years or so. Many people prefer to swim in a freshly filled water rather than water from the previous season. Some people remove the pumps some don’t. I know it is probably not eco friendly but it is how things are done.

If I would like to do a better job than this, and I assume that’s how TFP guys would do, what are my objectives if I don’t expect winter freeze?

One option is to keep the pool running in winter. My pump is not a variable speed pump but I have a timer built in. Do I simply cover the top of the pool? Note that it is not very easy to cover an overflow pool as water needs to overflow from sides. Do I keep the SWG on? How long do I run the pump per day? I can also circulate the water from the deep end drain if I want to disable the overflow tank (just mentioning as an option).

But do I really want this? Water is cheap and electricity is expensive around here and getting the pool cleaned beginning of summer is cheaper than running the pool over the winter even if I add the costs of the salt and cyanuric acid.

Or is my objective to be eco friendly? If not why should I keep the water in the pool during winter and make sure it doesn’t grow algae? Or is it because draining the pool is a problem? I can easily drain my pool because I already have drain piping which enables me to empty the pool to a place where it is ok by local rules and regulations.

Basically what are my objectives for winter and what am I trying to achieve?

Thanks

I am considering using borates in my pool but I have yet to find a test kit that meets the criteria for me.

My favorite water tests are hands down drop titrations. I find them the most accurate and while I’ve thought about it I have yet to splurge on a colorimeter. I’d love to figure out how to use my spectrophotometer as a pool colorimeter but I can’t find the exact math/procedures (if anyone has any tips I’d be pleased to hear them).

Taylor makes a boron drop test kit, but I do not believe or at least am not confident enough that it would accurately measure borate concentration. Has anyone used it?

Are my options really only between strips and a colorimeter?

Thanks

Hello, I was looking at wetedge’s startup guide, https://wetedgetechnologies.com/files/28_Start_Up_Instructions_07_16_1.pdf

It’s stating to use orenda sc-1000 chelating agent. looking online there isn’t a place that I can find to get it in time. Amazon has it by a third party which should arrive on time. Not sure the reliability of the seller.

We are scheduled to have plaster this weekend. I’ve read @onBalance different startup guides. I feel like I’m over my head right now and stressing.
Everyone has a different method. Is this something I should hire out?

I have my Taylor k2006-c kit and speed stir, I am ready, but feel overwhelmed. I know I should be buying chemicals now.

Hello everyone, I really need some help! This is our 4th year with our Intex XTR 20'x48" pool. After $50 to $100 weekly trips to Leslie's pools, we switched to TFP method a few months ago. I bought the better TFP test kit, everything has been great and SO easy this year. Until a couple of weeks ago..... We went on vacation for a few days and came home to a slightly green pool. After researching, it appears to be due to low chlorine and a bunch of rain. I cleaned the pool really well, used some Green Out and did my normal water testing. everything was great, nice and clear for 2 weeks. I just did my weekly water testing 2 days ago, things weren't bad, I added recommended chemicals from the Pool Math app.

Today, It looks like we have some mustard algae! My levels should've been right on after testing and adjusting 2 days before, WTF? I freaked out and added 20-30 oz of liquid chlorine, that I had left in a bottle (10%). I went ahead and tested my water afterwards. I'm no chemist and I'm still learning, but the numbers don't seem to be off much. Why am I getting mustard algae and how do I treat to knock it out, using the TFP method?

Current levels are:
CL: 5
BR: 10
pH: 7.8 (Pool Math says to add 4.7 oz Dry Acid)
FC: 5 (Pool Math says add 10 oz liquid chlorine)
CC: .5
TC: 5.5
TA: 70 (Target 70)
CYA: 50 (Target 45)
CH: 275 (Target 300, add 30 oz Calcium Chloride)

As in the title, I got pressured into getting a pool. My wife mentioned wanting one to her mother, so her mom found one on marketplace cheap. It seemed like a good deal at $100, so I eventually agreed. It is an Intex Prism Frame oval 10x20x48". It was without a pump and filter, so we planned to purchase one. Luckily, a neighbor had an extra from her old pool, a really nice Krystal clear 1600GPH with a 12" sand filter. It had new sand last year. Bonus, she kept the valves and fittings so when I unrolled this thing and found they were missing I was saved. I filled this thing up with 4400+ gallons of water and setup the pump. there was a delay between filling and pump setup, about 5 days. The water had a little green tinge to it. added a powdered shock packet, because I hadn't yet found TFP. The filter has the water looking amazing. Unfortunately, I bought test strips instead of a real water test kit, and I can't afford to purchase one yet. According to the strip the FC is at 0. My TH is 200, TA is 240, pH is 8.4 and CYA is 79. I know from reading other posts that I shouldn't trust this, but I don't know what to do at this point. If I'm lucky, I can stretch my SSI and get a proper test kit August 1st. Yesterday evening, I went to Walmart and got two jugs of liquid chlorine from the pool section. I poured one whole gallon in and this morning got the test results I reported in this thread. I'm now out of money. My ears are open....

Side note: About 20 years ago, I worked for a pool company and worked in construction, service, and even did hot tub delivery and service while I was there. I didn't have to help with water treatment, or chemicals other than acid washing pools and filling chlorine jugs. Did some openings and closings as well. So I am not clueless, but I only remember so much.

Hi All,
1st time pool builder and thought I'd put this out there to see what advice might be given for the equipment layout. I've read that it's a good idea to have a pressure gauge before and after the pump, any advice on type or brand of gauge would also be welcome.
Thanks in advance.

I've thought about adding borates for the past 5 years or so, and now, since I finally got an SWCG last year, I need something fun to do with my chemistry.

Pool math says I need 50 lbs of boric acid to get my borates to 50ppm so plan to order from Duda Diesel.

The adding borates article says I should first lower my TA to the low end of acceptable range, but how necessary is that? My TA has always been high at 110-120 but Ph had been remarkably stable and tends to stick around 7.4-7.6. Even when I add cya to start the season, my Ph will decline a bit initially then just go right back to its happy place. I've been a tfper for 10+ years now and have deliberately adjusted Ph maybe 5 times, and probably once in the last 3 years because my Ph just self corrects if something causes it to get to the high or low 7s. Given the stability of my Ph I've never bothered to adjust my TA, ever.

With that fact pattern, is it still necessary or a good idea to adjust my TA down before adding borates? What are potential consequences if I just leave it as us?

Thx
Paul

I have a 2 year old Blue Works BLSC chlorinator that recently does not chlorinate. The unit indicates flow but the generate light blinks green. The unit reads Temp empo and when I go into the menu it shows the water temp is 72.5. Cell volts: 28.2v, cell amp: -0.0, salinity now: 0000ppm. Measured salinity is approximately 3800ppm.
I am trying to determine if it needs a new cell or if there is an issue with the unit itself. Any tips to troubleshoot? I'd hate to purchase a new cell only to find the unit itself is faulty.

I check FC daily and adjust SWCG. I don't always log FC and SWCG adjustment. FC is always between 7-11. SWG 10-20%.

FC 36 hours ago was 9. Test this morning and FC = 5.5.

We had rain last night, but about .1 inches. So I thought I got some stratified rain water in my sample even though I took sample 18" down. So I brushed a bunch and turned on robot. Retested the same.

I clean my kit religiously. My reagents are new. My sample volumes are correct. The SWCG shows no error and makes chlorine.

The only other thing I can think of is that the salt level is 2800. Maybe there is some magical point where the SWCG is happy showing 3200 for salt level, but with only 2800 actual it is not as efficient. I can't believe that is the case as I haven't added water for a while and have a cover. Doesn't make sense to have a 4ppm FC drop in 36 hours because of lower salt.

I'm stumped.

Hello everyone and thank you for reading. I used TFP methods last season and it was great. This year I have had a tough time keeping up with testing and adding chlorine and have struggled with algae. I also added a solar dome heater and I wonder if that has made a difference. Anyways the pool Information should be in my signature I hope; above ground 16,000gal vinyl lined. It's old, so I want to make a minimal investment. My husband can handle plumbing and electrical so we could do the instal. Questions are, what model SWG and size should I go with? What do I need to hook it up, I think I need an inline timer to make sure it runs a minimum amount each day, currently I turn it the 1hp pump on and off manually. I try to run it while sun is on the solar heater each day (10-4ish). And what else do I need to figure out before I can do this, oh and are these things likely to go on sale, and is buying a used one an option?

Thank you!!!!!

Renting a house that has a pool, first time ever owning a pool. LBI area of NJ. Learning as I go and happy to have found this communit.

Hey all,

TLDR: Are using chlorine pucks really that bad, if I keep my CYA and other levels within range?

So after 3 years of temporary pools, I'm upgrading to a permanent AGP. I use the TFP methods, including adding liquid chlorine daily. My best friend is on year 2 of his permanent AGP and swears by chlorine pucks and his test strips. Now, I got him to admit he didn't know the pucks have stabilizer in them, and he could not tell exactly what his CYA level is (He said somewhere between 50 - 100). However, he does not need to add chlorine everyday like I do and I'm just wondering if using a puck here and there is really that bad, if I continue to maintain my CYA level and FC levels in good relationship to each other?

Thanks!

I've been a pool owner for 3 years. Year one was easy, but the last two years have been a never ending battle with algae. I don't feel like it should be this hard, but I must be missing something.

Here's what I've done:

• Make sure pH and alkalinity is balanced
• CYA was high at one point, so drained some water and added new water until it was in the ideal 30-50 range
• Checking phosphates multiple times a week, using phosphate killer if it gets over 300. I use a preventative phosphate treatment weekly, but that doesn't seem to keep up, so I have to use the killer.
• Brushing the pool walls daily
• Running my robo-vacuum at least once a day
• Backwashing the sand filter daily (lots of really green water gets expelled)
• Double-shocking the pool. Kept free chlorine > 4 for quite awhile.
• Running the filter 24/7
• I try to skim the pool if it gets a lot of leaves in it, but I live out in the country and there are a lot of trees around, so I'm sure there are a lot of smaller particles that get in there.
• I haven't used algaecide since many people recommend not doing that

Despite all of this, I have new algae growing every day, and the deep end is perpetually a cloudy green-ish color. I can still vaguely make out the bottom of the deep end (9 ft) when the sun it out, so it's not completely green (probably because of my unsustainable hours of maintenance).

The best luck I have is with the phosphate killer. This gives me a pile of dead algae on the bottom (which I vacuum to waste) and the water clears up. Then it's cloudy and green again in a day or two. I feel like I have to use phosphate killer every 1-2 weeks though, which is not ideal.

Can anyone think of anything else I might be doing wrong? Are there issues with my filter (it generally seems to be working, based on the color of the backwash water)?

FWIW, in year 1 (when I was a new pool owner and everything went great), I never had to use phosphate killer, never had any sign of algae (other than when the pool was opened), and rarely brushed the walls.

Recently moved into a rental with a plunge pool. It currently has a salt water/mineral chlorinator. What chemicals do I need to put in it?

Thank you

Greetings, new to TFP, I got a ton of clorine and ready to slam your way. I ordered the good test kit pro in the mean time I am relying on test straps. That said Pools about 27k gal. It's not solid green more teal and I wanna get it good again. I put 2 gallons of this shock in this evening. Prior the clorine levels showed 0. When I go in the math app to measure how much I need it asks the type I have but this doesn't sound like those. Sodium Hypoclorite is active at 12.5%. What type should I select and should I add more than the 2 gallons tonight. Cya was 40 and I backwashed and rinsed filter before adding anything earlier.

Hello everyone. We are in the decision making process of picking remodeling options for our pool (currently white plaster) and have decided to go with a pebble finish. Stonescapes has good options for what we want but we are hesitating on the color. We like lighter tones with a blue/gray water color. Our pool builder has recommended the salt and pepper finish and provided samples but we haven't been able to see pictures of how salt and pepper looks in real life. We would add abalone shells and touch of glass for a nice sparkle. There are multiple videos and photos of the French gray color, which we like but think it may be a bit darker than what we'd want. Does anyone have any experience with how the salt and pepper looks, and maybe provide some pictures? Any advice would be much appreciated. Thanks.

It's typically 85F where I am, with summers around 90F. The pool is often some 92F degrees and it sucks. Can't even get in the pool to cool off!

Are there any solutions for this?

I don't have an infinity edge (and it doesn't make sense for my yard) but I imagine that'd provide a significant amount of evaporative cooling (and water loss).

I've been running my pool for two years now with a SWCG (as a deactivated SWCG was present when I bought the house). I just noticed on the filter label that it's "Freshwater Only", but I can't find any information on that requirement online and can't think of why that might be. Any clues?

I've also been finding that my salt levels drop faster than one would expect - irregularly, but maybe 400ppm in a month on a fast-dropping month, despite there being no apparent leak in the pool. My understanding is that salt-wise, the system is closed outside of splashes and leaks, though, and I can't imagine how a DE filter would change that. I always change the medium, never bothering to backwash.

I'm also finding that my SWCG is re-throwing a cell-maintenance LED very shortly after acid-washing the cell, despite that performance seems fine (chlorine levels and bubbles), and this may just be the result of me rolling the dice on an open-box Amazon warehouse cell/controller.