What would you do....?

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SwimdailyAZ

Member
Oct 5, 2019
16
Phoenix, AZ
We purchased a home in AZ not too long ago with a pool. We kept the pool service because the guy who was doing it was very good and they do fountains as well. But, they promoted our pool guy to a supervisor which is great he deserved it. So, now we get a different guy all the time and we have no clue what they are doing.

It appears they haven't backwashed the pump in 2 months. No charges for DE on the invoice. We've got a small problem with mustard algae for a while now and occasionally they will add algaecide to the pool. For the most part, they haven't been trying to get rid of it at all. From May - Sept. they added 1-gallon (@ $11.95 per gallon) algaecide in June and 1 in July.

Last week we tested the chlorine levels a few hours after the pool guy left the test came back orange. Too high. We tested it 5 days later and it was still orange.

This week they decide oh you have yellow algae so we added 6 gallons of liquid chlorine plus algaecide. That is 768 oz. of liquid chlorine and who knows how much algaecide. We tested the pool water about 8 hours later and the test came back orange again.

To me our pool is sizable. I'm told it's 15,000 gallons. Does adding 6 gallons of liquid chlorine seem like a lot to be adding? We've only ever been charged for 4 gallons in a single month and now it's 6. We are charged $5.95 per gallon.

I saw somewhere that when you add shock and algaecide to the pool you should run the pump for 24 hours. And you should make sure the jets are not just moving the water at the surface but are also directing the water down towards the bottom of the pool especially in the deep end as well. This is to ensure there aren't any dead spots since the chemicals have to make contact with the algae to kill it. Is this accurate?

Please answer the questions in red. Would you get a new pool service or stay will the same one? Company suggestions are welcome.

PS We tried managing the water in our spa ourselves to no avail.

Can you tell I'm frustrated? I haven't been able to exercise (swim) for a week because the chlorine is high. They did finally get the hot tub levels correct.

unhappy swimmer in AZ
 
As long as you are unwilling to take ownership and manage your pool on your own you will always have issues with any company. The major tenant of this site is owners testing their own water and managing using TFP methods.

The test strips that you are using are rarely correct and are only guesstimates.

The first step to managing your own pool is to purchase either of the two recommended test kits.
 
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Is pouring 6 gallons of chlorine in 15,000 gallons excessive or corrosive to equipment? As I said previously last week the free chlorine levels were off the charts testing above 5ppm. So, yes the pool had adequate free chlorine before they added 6 gallons of chlorine.

To answer the first comments about the purpose of the forum although nobody answered my questions.
We are trying to take control of the pool but, we have to learn about it first. In the meantime, we have to use a service, especially for the chemicals. The service just brushes the pool, backwashes, yearly maintenance, and chemicals minus the chlorine tabs. Living in AZ with very hard water we need to learn which chemicals will add calcium to our already hard water and which will not. We don't have the manuals to the filter or pump so we have no idea how to replace the DE or the maintenance it needs. It is a Hayward but I cannot find the pump manual for it on the web. Which is why I turned here because I noticed postings from AZ on here. Arizona has such a unique environment that even the growing seasons are different here than the rest of the country. Pool supply stores aren't easy to find (will not go to Leslie's) here. With experiences at most pool stores, I'm not sure I trust them anyway for advice.

Thank you for letting me know algaecide doesn't work once you've got algae. That helps.
 
SwimdailyAZ said:
Is pouring 6 gallons of chlorine in 15,000 gallons excessive or corrosive to equipment? As I said previously last week the free chlorine levels were off the charts testing above 5ppm. So, yes the pool had adequate free chlorine before they added 6 gallons of chlorine.
Click to expand...

Chlorine is not corrosive to pool equipment.

Each gallon of 10% chlorine gives you 6.7 ppm. That is 2 to 3 days of chlorine consumption.

Chlorine over 5 ppm is not off the charts. It depends on your CYA level. See FC/CYA Levels. Read ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry



SwimdailyAZ said:
Living in AZ with very hard water we need to learn which chemicals will add calcium to our already hard water and which will not.
Click to expand...


Only chemical that adds calcium is Cal-Hypo. Read Calcium Hypochlorite - Further Reading

SwimdailyAZ said:
We don't have the manuals to the filter or pump so we have no idea how to replace the DE or the maintenance it needs. It is a Hayward but I cannot find the pump manual for it on the web.
Click to expand...


What model number pump? Post pics of the pump and any labels on it.

SwimdailyAZ said:
Which is why I turned here because I noticed postings from AZ on here. Arizona has such a unique environment that even the growing seasons are different here than the rest of the country.
Click to expand...


Water chemistry is the same all over. Each region has some unique characteristics.

@mknauss @MyAZPool and others can comment.

SwimdailyAZ said:
Pool supply stores aren't easy to find (will not go to Leslie's) here. With experiences at most pool stores, I'm not sure I trust them anyway for advice.
Click to expand...

Agreed!
 
Welcome to the forum! Where in Arizona? Yuma is different than Flagstaff.

In most cases, the fill water is high in calcium and TA. Other than that, there really is no special things about having a pool here. We have more evaporation, but that only matters if the fill water is high in calcium and TA!
 
mknauss said:
Welcome to the forum! Where in Arizona? Yuma is different than Flagstaff.
Click to expand...

Thank you. We are in the Phoenix area so our fill water is loaded with calcium. In fact, we have what looks like calcium or some kind of white rough scale we have to wipe off the pool tiles at the beginning of summer and from time to time the rest of the year.

ajw22 said:
What model number pump? Post pics of the pump and any labels on it.
Click to expand...

The pump says Hanning on it not sure if that is a brand or not. It's a 1.5THP, RPM 600-3000, Z1 ECM Frame 71, SP27156Z.

Filter: Hayward Pro-Grid DE Filter, model DE4820, Flow 96 gallons, Effective Filtration Area 48 squared. the ID is 21110503050482006.

The vacuum is a really old Hayward and all that's about all I can tell you about it.

I've been reading about these robotic vacuums that have an actual brush, have their own reusable filters, can be operated by remote control, programmed to clean certain areas, and don't use the pump to operate. Has anyone tried one? Just curious if they are gimmicks (product of the millennials) or if they do a better job than the traditional vacuums.

Thank you
 
SwimdailyAZ said:
The pump says Hanning on it not sure if that is a brand or not. It's a 1.5THP, RPM 600-3000, Z1 ECM Frame 71, SP27156Z.
Click to expand...

Those are all motor specs. Pics of the pump would help to identify it. Especially the pump basket and lid as well as the control panel on the pump.
 

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We got ya! To help you best we are going to have to ask questions and give suggestions to get all of us on the same page. Each pool is different so we have to dial in you and your pool to make sure we understand what you are dealing with.

If we don't answer a question please ask it again. Sometimes we will answer one but forget about the other.

You, your wallet, and your pool will be better off if you send the pool company on it's way. We can and will help you with every thing about your especially the chemicals. Look in my siggy below for the recommended chemicals. That shows you what we use in our pools IF they are needed.

When will your test kit get there? That is going to be your best tool to take over the care of your pool. I am betting the pool service does not even test the water before they add anything. They just "throw and go" most of the time :( They push all of the levels way up in hopes some will still be there when they come back in a week. That is not good for the pool or your body in the long run.

Kim:kim:
 
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SwimdailyAZ
Hey, welcome to the forum.
Since being tagged on your thread regarding the issue of high calcium hardness in our area, I'll just give you some food for thought on this issue and how I have personally chose to deal with it.

Our Calcium Hardness (CH) in this area appears to average about 250ppm out of the tap. 250ppm (or slightly higher) is good for a pool if it stayed at that level, but it doesn't in our neck of the woods.

We also have high water evaporation in our area. Pool water in the desert can evaporate anywhere between 60 to 140 gallons per day in the summer depending on many factors, to include pool/spa surface area, exposure to the sun and many other weather conditions. For example, my pool/spa surface area is 678 square feet and I average about 110 gallons per day of water loss due to evaporation and occasional filter backwash's in the summer.

When the water evaporates, the calcium does not evaporate with it. It stays behind in our pools. Because of the high evaporation in our area, the CH in our pools tends to rise fairly rapidly because we are replacing that evaporated water with tap water that is already at 250ppm. According to the TFP Pool Math App, the maximum CH is recommended to be about 450ppm but I have noticed that many in our area accept a max CH of 500ppm -- 600ppm etc.

There are two practical methods to combat this continuous rise in CH from what I can ascertain.

1. Most just replace the high CH pool water with new tap (city) water by using the partial drain and replace method. I did this for years but decided to try something different as explained below.

2. I finally tired of continuously having to partially drain and refill my pool. It really became a pain for me and I am all about making my pool maintenance as "Trouble Free" as possible (the reason I participate on this site :)), which btw is by far the best repository of pool knowledge IMHO.

So I did some research here and on the internet and I decided that I was going to try using the soft water from the house to compensate for pool water loss due to evaporation. The CH from my softener is 25PPM versus the 250PPM right out of the untreated tap. When I first started using soft water instead of straight city water to compensate for evaporation water loss, my pool water CH was around 550ppm and climbing. (NOTE: It was only that low at the time because I had performed a complete drain and refill only about two years prior). My pool water CH is now at 275 and slowly dropping. When it gets to around 200-250, I will begin to alternate between city water and soft water to keep it between approximately 200ppm and 250ppm.

Consequently, I plumbed my pool auto refill valve to allow me to select either soft or hard water. Yes, it was a bit of work initially but I feel as though am reaping the benefits of it now. If interested, you can read more about that project on my thread HERE. You can also find several other threads here on TFP, regarding the use of softened water to compensate for evaporated pool water.

A few things to keep in mind when using this method.

1. Of course a water softener is required :p, and it must be of a make/model that will handle the extra load of approximately 100 gallons per day. Preferably a non-electric type and which allows for regeneration at the same time that water usage is allowed (dual tank type design).

2. Salt usage for the softener WILL increase. I calculated, that before I began to use soft water in my pool, my salt usage was about 6 bags a year. Now it looks like I will use about 12 bags per year. This is a cost increase of about $36.00 per year. For me, that is small price to pay to keep my pool water CH constant at about 200ppm to 250ppm.

I hope this is helpful to you. This is just one guys opinion regarding this issue, so keep researching and find a method that you believe will work best for your specific situation.

Good luck with your pool chemistry. The advice you received above and also on TFP's Pool School is top notch. Please feel free to ping me if you have any specific questions regarding my comments above.

Take care and all the best.
r.
 
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Welcome to TFP.

Now that you’re here, let’s get you going on correcting the wrongs that have been done to your pool.

(The following suggestions are based off IF this was my pool.)

1. Kick pool company to the curb.
2. Order proper test kit.
3. We are coming into the cool season (Nov - Feb) which is the perfect time to do a complete drain. (You never want to drain your pool here in the Valley when temps are above 75 degrees, and the sun is at its highest point of the year)
4. Address any scale build up cleaning, repairs, etc....
5. Refill pool and start fresh with your chemical additions (slowly) to get everything where it should be.

I can guarantee you, if you follow everyone’s advice and guidance, you WILL have a perfectly clear and properly sanitized pool that will offer you years of enjoyment!!! :cheers:
 
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