Total newbie! My kids love having a pool!

[Colbuster]

First time pool owner. Pool is 8 months old, ~39,000 gal and no cover. Plaster. Built in spa and slide/waterfall (use as aerator?). I have been using a "pool guy", but after I started growing algae and checking my own chemicals, I realized I am not getting what I am paying for! He says that I should have my alkalinity at or above 120 ppm? Doesn't that seem high? My chlorine is always below 1, salt generator is turned to 100% running 18 hours a day, and my salt level is 3100. pH always ends up above 8.2 a week after they are here. I'm pulling my hair out. I think I need to get a CYA level detector and start doing this all on my own. My temp has been running around 85-88 as we live in southern Utah desert. 109 F yesterday. I have the standard pH, chlorine, alkalinity measuring kit and a salt detector. What else should I get? CYA is enough? What about calcium detector? Thanks in advance!

 

[DrewLG]

I have the standard pH, chlorine, alkalinity measuring kit and a salt detector. What else should I get? CYA is enough? What about calcium detector? Thanks in advance!

Welcome. Well done; getting your own test kit is the first and most important step in maintaining your pool.

You're right, the CYA test is critically important. But if you're going to follow the TFP methodology, you'll also need a specific kind of chlorine test called FAS-DPD, in order to not only measure precisely (to within 0.5 ppm or better) but also measure across a wide range (from 0 to 20+ ppm). I'm almost certain that your test kit (which sounds like a Taylor K-1003 or K-1004) does not have that test. And you'll also want a calcium hardness test, and you'll want a drop test for salt if that isn't what your salt "detector" is.

If you were to buy the CYA, FAS-DPD, CH, and Salt tests to use in conjunction with the pH and TA tests you already have, you'd pay around $110 and have to find some way to store all those individual kits and bottles. And you'd be swirling test solutions by hand, like an animal.

Here's what I would do instead: Take $200 of the money that you're going to save by doing the TFP method, and buy a TF-Pro Salt with SmartStir (except you're going to buy it with a SpeedStir). Click on that link. Select the "XL option" and "Taylor SpeedStir (Save $12)" checkboxes, and no others. The price with those options should be $180. Click "Add to Cart".

Then go to the R-7605 CYA Standard 50ppm page. Price should be $6.50. Click "Add to Cart".

Checkout, and in a few days you'll have everything you need to test for hidden algae, monitor the SLAM process that will kill that algae, balance your water for your safety and your pool's longevity, and tune your SWCG runtime and output level. While you're waiting, buy a squeeze bottle with a pop-up lid for collecting pool water (if you don't already have one). I use one of these bottles, but anything similar will work.

 

[Texas Splash]

Welcome to TFP! I agree ^^, you won't be disappointed with the TF-Pro Salt test kit. You appear to have algae, so you should start reviewing the SLAM Process instructions. Also be sure to bookmark our Pool Care Basics page for lots of great info. If you have any questions let us know.

 

[guinness]

My chlorine is always below 1, salt generator is turned to 100% running 18 hours a day, and my salt level is 3100.

Your IC40 is undersized for your 39000 gallon pool.

 

[Jdevi123]

You will need to buy a lot of chlorinating liquid. Walmart has it for $5 per gallon. Show us what the pool looks like

 

[Colbuster]

Wow. This is awesome. I’ve never been part of such a unique cool group!

Here’s a pic of my pool. I updated my signature so it should have all of my equipment now.

 

[Colbuster]

Welcome. Well done; getting your own test kit is the first and most important step in maintaining your pool.

You're right, the CYA test is critically important. But if you're going to follow the TFP methodology, you'll also need a specific kind of chlorine test called FAS-DPD, in order to not only measure precisely (to within 0.5 ppm or better) but also measure across a wide range (from 0 to 20+ ppm). I'm almost certain that your test kit (which sounds like a Taylor K-1003 or K-1004) does not have that test. And you'll also want a calcium hardness test, and you'll want a drop test for salt if that isn't what your salt "detector" is.

If you were to buy the CYA, FAS-DPD, CH, and Salt tests to use in conjunction with the pH and TA tests you already have, you'd pay around $110 and have to find some way to store all those individual kits and bottles. And you'd be swirling test solutions by hand, like an animal.

Here's what I would do instead: Take $200 of the money that you're going to save by doing the TFP method, and buy a TF-Pro Salt with SmartStir (except you're going to buy it with a SpeedStir). Click on that link. Select the "XL option" and "Taylor SpeedStir (Save $12)" checkboxes, and no others. The price with those options should be $180. Click "Add to Cart".

Then go to the R-7605 CYA Standard 50ppm page. Price should be $6.50. Click "Add to Cart".

Checkout, and in a few days you'll have everything you need to test for hidden algae, monitor the SLAM process that will kill that algae, balance your water for your safety and your pool's longevity, and tune your SWCG runtime and output level. While you're waiting, buy a squeeze bottle with a pop-up lid for collecting pool water (if you don't already have one). I use one of these bottles, but anything similar will work.

Thanks for this great advice.

Just ordered those products .

My pool guy did treat for algae 2 weeks ago, so hopefully I don’t have any more currently. If I can’t see it does that mean I don’t have it?

 

[Colbuster]

Sorry. One more big question. Is it worth spending so much money for an automatic acid system? My pH is almost always too high. I feel like I’m dumping a lot of muriatic acid regularly - I’m afraid people are going to think I’m like Walter White from breaking bad.

 

[DrewLG]

My pool guy did treat for algae 2 weeks ago, so hopefully I don’t have any more currently. If I can’t see it does that mean I don’t have it?

Unfortunately, algae doesn't always present as green and slimy, and it often starts growing in hidden places -- inside ladder tubes, behind lights, etc. -- because those are the spots that don't get brushed and don't get good chlorinated water circulation. You might see it as a brown or grey powder on the bottom of the pool that poofs into a cloud of dust whenever you get close to it with a brush -- but the absence of that powder doesn't mean your pool is algae-free.

You'll use that test kit you ordered to determine whether there's algae, by performing an Overnight Chlorine Loss Test (OCLT) -- you do it overnight so your test results won't be affected by chlorine oxidation due to UV light from the sun. If you measure a significant Free Chlorine loss between sunset and sunrise, it'll be because your FC is combining with organic contaminants like algae.

There's a process called SLAM (Shock Level And Maintain) to eliminate algae without using algaecides that can cause other problems... But one thing at a time. Read up on the OCLT while you're waiting for the test kit to arrive, and also buy some liquid chlorine; you'll need about 2 gallons of 10% LC to raise your FC level to something easily measurable for the OCLT.

 

[DrewLG]

Is it worth spending so much money for an automatic acid system? My pH is almost always too high. I feel like I’m dumping a lot of muriatic acid regularly

Only you can say what's worth spending your money on.

But your TA level tends to determine your pool's natural pH level -- high TA pulls the pH higher, low TA keeps it lower -- so if you lower TA, you won't need to add acid so frequently.

Here's how to lower TA fairly quickly: Wait for your pH to reach 8.0, then add enough muriatic acid to lower the pH to 7.2. The first time, do it in two steps -- to 7.6 and then to 7.2, with a few hours' mixing time and a measurement in between -- to be sure you don't accidentally lower the pH too far.

Then just wait for pH to naturally rise back to 8, and do it again. Each time you cut the pH all the way down to 7.2 from 8.0, TA will drop a bit. And when it gets down into the 50-80 range, you'll find that pH will stay in the mid-7s for much longer, so you won't need to add MA very often.

 

[Britali]

If I remember correctly from what the wonderful people here have said IC40 SWG is for 40k gallons so is undersized for the 39k size of your pool. You want a SWG twice the capacity of your pool. That would explain why your FC is low despite running it 100%. You can supplement with liquid chlorine to get to desired FC.

BTW you have a beautiful pool!

 

[Colbuster]

Thanks for all this help so far.

I read about the SWG on the pentair site, and it said it should work for up to 40,000 gallons. Is that under best case scenario? I am going to run my pump 24 hrs a day and see if I can get my chlorine up to low 2's. I just checked again today and it was around 1.9 running 18 hours a day. But that is with those tabs in my floater thing. I am going to increase the pump to 24 hours and see where my level gets. I calculated my pump and it costs me ~ $.20/hr to run or $4.70 a day at 24 hrs (it's a single speed as my installer went cheap on that and I didn't know better at the time).

What is a recommended amount to run the pump just to circulate the water? Also, if I were to change out my main pump to variable speed pump, would that still produce as much chlorine as a single speed while saving me money on electricity or would the decreased flow just decrease the chlorine generation? I read that the Black and Decker 3HP VSP is a good option? Anyone use that? My goal is to get this pool to as low maintenance upkeep as possible. Hence, I'm also considering that automatic acid delivery system too. I hate spending more money on this, but I also hate not having it be chemically balanced.

 

[dfwnoob]

You always want to oversize your SWCG. The IC40 is, IMO, undersized for a 39k gallon pool.

The B&D pumps are sold under various names, such as Blue Torrent, and other random marques you'll find on Amazon, eBay, etc. I find them a bit dubious given the price, but admittedly I haven't any overwhelmingly bad feedback. That being said, since you have Pentair automation, you should really stick with a Pentair pump so that the automation system can ramp the RPMs up and down as necessary. If you don't go with a Pentair pump, you lose that control.

 

[Britali]

I would not skirt your minimum FC, especially if you want to minimize the work. Unless you are monitoring that minimum constantly, it can easily fall below & give algae a chance to bloom. If a 24 hr full run at 100% still does not maintain your FC you can supplement with liquid chlorine. I would set your minimum FC a couple ppm‘a above actual minimum so you do not have to babysit the FC as much. If you would rather not supplement with liquid chlorine, you could look into a bigger SWG.

 

[guinness]

That being said, since you have Pentair automation, you should really stick with a Pentair pump so that the automation system can ramp the RPMs up and down as necessary. If you don't go with a Pentair pump, you lose that control.

Since you have EasyTouch automation, a Pentair VS pump would be best suited to replace your current single speed. You just need to ensure it supports RS-485 communication which the pumps mentioned in the video below should.

 

[Colbuster]

Is there any sort of market for used equipment? Could I get credit somewhere for my IC40 and/or my single speed pump? They are barely used so I’d hate to lose all that money.

 

[mknauss]

You can use the IC40. Just will need to run it 24 hours per day most of swim season. The single speed pump, not worth much.

 

[Colbuster]

Would switching to a variable speed pump still produce as much chlorine? Wouldn’t it actually decrease the amount of water flowing through the chlorinator?

 

[mknauss]

Would switching to a variable speed pump still produce as much chlorine? Wouldn’t it actually decrease the amount of water flowing through the chlorinator?

A VS pump is a great idea. The flow through the SWCG, as long as it closes the flow switch, does not vary the amount of chlorine generated. Most SWCG's need 20 gpm or so to close the flow switch. I run my VS pump at 1500 rpm, about 200 watts, to run my SWCG. Your 3 hp SS pump is using in excess of 3000 watts. Over 15 times as much as my pump.

You can get a Whisperflo VS pump from Polytec Pools in Las Vegas. It will be a direct swap with your pump, no plumbing changes. It can be controlled by your Easytouch.