Spa Suction Side Issue to Pump

[jeremysm1]

I believe there is a problem between the spa drain to the pool pump. What are the steps to determine if something is blocking this drain? All the pipes are underground and there doesn't seem to be a check valve on the spa side pipe. Suggestions for next steps of troubleshooting / fixing this? Thanks!!!

Further info on my troubleshooting: new variable speed pump from last year; all pool modes work perfectly; spillover to spa works; the only thing that doesn't work is the spa drain (whether it's in spa mode or spa empty mode). When in one of those spa modes it looks like a very small flow of water and a lot of air in the filter pump.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Jeremy,

The spa drain line does not normally have a check valve.

Basically, when you are in the spa mode, all the water entering the pump should be from the spa drain and should not be coming from anywhere else. If this were my pool, I would use a Drain King and force water from the pump basket, through the Intake valve (in the spa mode position) and into the spa through the floor drains.. If the line is clogged, this may free it up.. If not, you should be able to tell if the line is OK by the amount of water flowing..

Show us some pics.. Are you sure you know what positions your valves need to be in for the Spa mode? Did we talk about this last year? Do you have some unusual plumbing??? Sounds familiar???


Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[jeremysm1]

Thanks, Jim! It was a different issue last year. I think my plumbing is normal but we have a lot of stuff (for instance to the spa we have blowers, jets, heater, drain). Yesterday, I grabbed a bladder and blew water into the spa return from the pump side to no avail. I didn't even see water moving in the spa while blowing from the hose--maybe that indicates a clog?

I did take off the Jandy valve before the pump and check to make sure nothing was clogging the 90-degree there. FWIW, I also put the bladder in there.

Here are some pictures. Let me know what else I can do myself.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Jeremy,

Just to make sure we are both on the same page.. In your pic showing the IntelliFlo pump (4808), the valve as shown is in the Pool Mode.. True??

When in the Spa mode, the Spa pipe would be open and the IntelliFlo would gets all of its water input from the Spa drains. If the line was blocked so badly that your Drain King did not cause any ripples, I would have to think that the IntelliFlo would run out of water in just a few seconds.

Where does your spa jet pump get its water input from??

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[jeremysm1]

When I run the Spa mode, the valve is moved to close the pool intake. I think the picture provided here shows the valve in the pool mode. When in spa mode, the water comes in very slowly then stops coming in altogether. The spa loses a couple inches from the water level. The jet and bubbler have their own pumps and lines.

 

[Jimrahbe]

When in the spa mode, water should be coming out of the spa returns.. You can't suck water out of the spa unless you can replace it..

I see two drain grates your spa, are there two more we can't see?

If water stops coming in, the spa should empty in a couple of minutes..

Let's see if we can get some other opinions.. calling @jimmythegreek and @bdavis466

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[jeremysm1]

I have several settings on the pool. One of the settings is Spa mode which circulates the water from the spa and back to the spa. This doesn't currently work. Another setting is Spa drain mode which removes water from the spa and pumps it back into the pool. This doesn't work either. All of the modes that don't include the spa work perfectly.

 

[RDspaguy]

Is the automated valve functioning properly?

 

[bdavis466]

Is the automated valve functioning properly?

This is more than likely the issue

 

[jeremysm1]

Yes, it is functioning properly. Assuming that you mean the Jandy valve right before the pump? Besides, just to make sure, I took off the automated valve during one of my tests and manually moved it so the spa was the source of water coming into the pump. Any other thoughts?

 

[jeremysm1]

Another idea that I had was to drain the spa and then remove the drain cover and put the hose and bladder in there to see if it could send water to the pump (or force the blockage out that way). Thoughts on that idea or is that a waste of time?

 

[RDspaguy]

Try it out. It should reveal if there is a blockage. Are you losing any water?

 

[jeremysm1]

I'll give it a try right now. First, I'll have to empty the spa. No, we're not losing water from the spa that I can tell.

 

[RDspaguy]

Yes, it is functioning properly. Assuming that you mean the Jandy valve right before the pump? Besides, just to make sure, I took off the automated valve during one of my tests and manually moved it so the spa was the source of water coming into the pump. Any other thoughts?

Just to be clear. The valve turns 180 degrees from pool mode to spa mode?

 

[Jimrahbe]

Jeremy,

Do you understand that for the spa mode to work, both the Intake and Return valves have to move... Usually, they both move 180 degrees from where they are in the pool mode...?

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[RDspaguy]

In this case you can see the valve in the picture is plumbed that way. I have plumbed them at 90 degrees as well. All depends on what the build crew left me to work with.

 

[jeremysm1]

I was able to remove the spa water and we put the bladder on the hose, turned the system to spa mode, took off the pump lid, and turned on the hose water. After about 3-4 minutes the pump started to fill with water and overflow. Did this twice. Filled the spa with some water and then tried the pump again. Unfortunately, it just doesn't pull water from the spa and just then the pump turns off after some time.

FWIW: I have the valve before the pump fully open to the spa (not the pool). I know for sure that this is correct.

 

[RDspaguy]

The pump turns itself off, or the control system turns it off? What does the display show when it turns off?
It would seem that you have a suction restriction. Not a common issue. Not much should be able to clog up a pipe. Did this start suddenly or were there some gradual issues that alerted you to the problem? How old is the pool? Is there any sign of shifting or settling in the deck or ground?

 

[jeremysm1]

The pump shuts itself off and gives an error message (which has to do with no water coming into the pump).I am running the variable speed pump at 2400 rpm--could that be part of the issue? I replaced a 3HP pump about 15 months ago and don't believe we tried the spa since then. The pool is 13-years old, no issues, no shifting or settling.

 

[wireform]

Why can't you check if you can do a pressure test between these 2 points, the spa drain and the suction opening in the pump. This may be your definitive answer before looking into the pump or control. As you said earlier in pool mode the pump works ok that ought to rule out a pump issue.