Owner/Build Completed - MasterTemp 400 won't come on

[an1vrsy]

Currently at the 5 week mark after fill. Intellicenter i8ps, I think configured, must have missed something regarding heater.

Gas company came yesterday to finally swap out meter and connect gas line. After gas connections made, Gas Company tech walked out to equipment pad and turned the shutoff valve from off to on. I cycled on the pump for water flow and as he touched the MasterTemp 400k BTU panel, nothing happened. He then said, "its connected that automation, I can't test your heater". So, I turned Intellicenter to "service mode" and then turned on the pump and still nothing when pressing the buttons on the heater's panel. The technician turned off the gas shutoff valve and said "good luck, speak with your pool builder".

I am the pool builder, so today, I turned off the schedule pump run. Turned off all circuit breakers at the Intellicenter. Then opened the side panel on the heater to confirm the "Gas Control Valve" is flipped "ON". It was "ON". Put the side panel back on. Flipped all breakers back on and turned on the pump.

Within Intellicenter > went to Pool, Heat Mode: Heater. Tapped the + button to make sure the set point was above current water temp. When that was done the heater panel flashed on but didn't stay on, the screen displayed some numbers but not long enough to actually read it. Then nothing. Any advice would be appreciated.

 

[ajw22]

Brad, let's first check that the heater runs in local mode. Is the MasterTemp connected with teh 2-wire control or 3-wire control?

Does the heater display panel light or the blower fan begin running?

 

[kevinskii]

The first time I started my Master Temp it rapidly cycled on and off. Checking the status lights on the heater itself indicated a low-flow error, and the little chart next to it indicated that this heater needs at least 40gpm to run. Oops. Bumping up the flow rate solved the problem. Hopefully your issue turns out to be as simple.

 

[an1vrsy]

Allen, I knew someone would ask me that. As owner/builder/project manager, I should say I scheduled the subs and paid them when they were completed. I didn't look over the shoulder and ask questions. Now I realized since they worked for me, I should have asked questions. So honestly, I don't know the answer to your question, 2-wire or 3-wire control.

When I had the heater side panel off I took pictures. Hopefully, that can help.

Kevin, the pump is running at 1800 rpms and the pump page displays 49 gpm.

 

[ajw22]

Allen, I knew someone would ask me that. As owner/builder/project manager, I should say I scheduled the subs and paid them when they were completed. I didn't look over the shoulder and ask questions. Now I realized since they worked for me, I should have asked questions. So honestly, I don't know the answer to your question, 2-wire or 3-wire control.

When I had the heater side panel off I took pictures. Hopefully, that can help.

See page 36 in https://www.pentair.com/content/dam...stertemp/Manual-MasterTemp-472592-English.pdf

 

[kevinskii]

49gpm at 1800 rpms? That doesn't sound right. I have the same Pentair Intelliflo VSF that you do. I have it set to 30gpm during normal operation, which is usually around 1700rpm. There will be some variation between our pools, but I'd be really surprised if it's that that much. The rpm vs gpm curve is non-linear. meaning that raising the gpm even a little bit will result in a substantially higher rpm.

Maybe you're misinterpreting the little Intellicenter display? I've done it myself. Perhaps you changed it to 49gpm but didn't press a button for it to actually take effect? I'd suggest temporarily bumping up your rpm to around 2500 and seeing if the issue goes away. That will most likely get you well above 40gpm.

 

[an1vrsy]

Allen, what I'm going to say is that the electricians knew it was all Pentair automation, and their experience I had to rely on. With that said, although, I saw that page as I was reading through the manual last night. I didn't think I needed to be concerned. I still don't have an idea. Electrical is my weakest, if I was a DIY'er skillset.

Kevin, I am going to make some system configuration changes and bump up the gpm via rpm. I requested 3" pvc pipe so our system are probably a little different. The plumbers reduced down then back up when necessary. Let me make Intellicenter pump change settings and get back to you after testing.

 

[an1vrsy]

Increasing pump speed to get the gpm to increase had no change for the heater. The pump fluctuated between 59 and 60 gpm after the change I made. The Intellicenter outdoor control panel "pool" had the flame icon/badge was on.
But I still did not notice the heater operating. I would assume the exhaust would make enough noise to let me know, it is on. I never heard the heater flame ignite.

Another question, even with Intellicenter, should I be able to put this in service mode, turn on pumps for water and test the heater and the heater control panel?

 

[ajw22]

No, with the remote cable connection the heater is only controlled by the IntelliCenter.

Open up the heater and look at the connection and post a pic.

Do you have a multimeter?

 

[an1vrsy]

Unfortunately, I have to go do grandpa stuff. I took pictures when I confirmed the gas valve switch was "ON". I will post them later tonight. Thank you for your help.

 

[kevinskii]

One other simple thing to check: Make sure you have only one external gas shutoff valve, and if you have more than one make sure that both are open, of course. I have two for my heater, one in the front yard next to the gas meter and the other in the backyard near the equipment pad. It's possible that you were having issues due to low flow when the gas tech was there, and now that you've resolved that you might just need to open one more valve. It probably happens to a lot of new pool owners. It happened to me.

 

[an1vrsy]

Brad, let's first check that the heater runs in local mode. Is the MasterTemp connected with teh 2-wire control or 3-wire control?

Does the heater display panel light or the blower fan begin running?

No, with the remote cable connection the heater is only controlled by the IntelliCenter.

Open up the heater and look at the connection and post a pic.

Do you have a multimeter?

Ok, sorry for the delay in providing photos. I do have a multimeter. Here are some photos.

Heater cover control box, intellicenter high voltage and low voltage compartments.

 

[ajw22]

In your heater you have wires connected with an orange wire nut and a blue wire nut. Disconnect those wires.

Then wire nut together the two wires on the heater that were separately connected to the wire nuts.

Once that wire is connected in the heater it should be under local control and see if the heater control panel comes alive.

 

[an1vrsy]

Thank you for the assistance. Before I begin, let me make sure I understand you. Wirenuts are used to connect multiple wires together. When I remove the wire nuts, would there be 4 wires? 2 connected to each of the wire nuts. So, I am connecting all 4 wires to one wire nut?

 

[ajw22]

Thank you for the assistance. Before I begin, let me make sure I understand you. Wirenuts are used to connect multiple wires together. When I remove the wire nuts, would there be 4 wires? 2 connected to each of the wire nuts. So, I am connecting all 4 wires to one wire nut?

First of all it looks like the installer used a white Cat5 cable with 8 wires from the heater to the IntelliCenter. Then because each wire is thin he used two wires for each connection. So you will find 3 wires under each wire nut. Two from the cable and one connected to the heater.

You want to separate the wires. Put the wires in the cable to the side but not touching anything.

You want to twist only the two wires connected to the heater together and put a wire nut on it.

 

[an1vrsy]

Allen, thank you for the explanation. Wish me luck. Here I go.

 

[an1vrsy]

Ok, I did as directed. Below is the photo. Unfortunately, after flipping the breakers back on and putting the system into service mode nothing displays on the heater display panel. Or am I not supposed to be in service mode. Hmmm

 

[mknauss]

Service mode will not matter as you have the heater isolated from the Intellicenter.

Check the power source for the heater.

 

[ajw22]

Was your pump running?

 

[an1vrsy]

@mknauss , yeah, I went back outside turned it back to Auto and nothing. The heater must have had power at one point. I say that because prior to all of this, the panel displayed some numbers quickly then would go dark.