New Hot Tub Owner. Lot to Learn

[phonedave]

So, let me ask you this, since you seem to have a ton of experience in this area. Would you leave the tub chlorine, or would you convert to salt, if the money weren’t a consideration?

The chlorine isn’t really bothering my skin. I truly feel like the non chlorine shock was what made me break out. The day after I put that in, my back was a bumpy, itching mess. Since purging with Ahhsome and starting over, I’ve been fine. But I’m having to add chlorine after every single use. And what do I do to eliminate the CC’s and to replace the weekly shock, if I want to continue using the tub every day and not taking days off?

Salt is chlorine, so if chlorine bothers you so will salt. The sodium chloride that is salt gets changed into chlorine.

MPS aka Non Chlorine Shock can cause allergic reactions in some people.

I have a salt system in my pool and would put one in my tub in an instant. As I said, the only thing that stops me is the extension cord and non-integrated aspects of a drape over system.

You should be adding chlorine after every use, that is just part and parcel of running a hot tub. You are soaking your sweaty body in a small pool of water, you are going to have to add chlorine after using it.

Leave the top open for a while to let CC's vent. Even if you shock, you can still use the tub the same day

 

[mayberry32]

Salt is chlorine, so if chlorine bothers you so will salt. The sodium chloride that is salt gets changed into chlorine.

MPS aka Non Chlorine Shock can cause allergic reactions in some people.

I have a salt system in my pool and would put one in my tub in an instant. As I said, the only thing that stops me is the extension cord and non-integrated aspects of a drape over system.

You should be adding chlorine after every use, that is just part and parcel of running a hot tub. You are soaking your sweaty body in a small pool of water, you are going to have to add chlorine after using it.

Leave the top open for a while to let CC's vent. Even if you shock, you can still use the tub the same day

So, If it is the MPS that is bothering my skin, and I skip it, is it okay just adding chlorine after every use, or do I need to add another type of shock, in addition to the chlorine?

Having the saltwater generator regulating chlorine without having the add after every soak would be great. But I’ve also read where people still have to manually add chlorine with a salt system.

If that is the case, then the primary benefit would be only having to change the water and purge once a year instead of once every three months. Definitely easier, but not a huge deal, considering the cost to convert.

 

[Mdragger88]

So, If it is the MPS that is bothering my skin, and I skip it, is it okay just adding chlorine after every use, or do I need to add another type of shock, in addition to the chlorine?

Having the saltwater generator regulating chlorine without having the add after every soak would be great. But I’ve also read where people still have to manually add chlorine with a salt system.

If that is the case, then the primary benefit would be only having to change the water and purge once a year instead of once every three months. Definitely easier, but not a huge deal, considering the cost to convert.

Lets clear a couple things up-
* going salt doesn’t effect how often you need to purge/refill
- accumulation of biofilms
- how frequently you use the tub/bather load
- always maintaining adequate fc according to the FC/CYA Levels or not
&
- the presence of persistent cc’s (despite raising to shock level) determine this interval.

* Compensating for fc loss due to bather waste & standby loss whilst always remaining above min for your cya is a must in a chlorine tub - whether the swg produces most/all of the fc or you manually dose in some other fashion.
Some people keep their swg settings higher or have light bather loads that allow them to not need to manually dose usually.
If I wanted, I could push the button & turn on my swg instead of dosing with liquid chlorine most of the time. Sometimes I do, it just depends on the situation. The cells only have a finite amount of fc they will produce in their lifetime, also it’s not instant fc like a shot of lc after long sweaty soak.
If you notice,
there is no recommendation for min/target fc for a cya of 30 with a swg on the FC/CYA Levels so use the liquid chlorine side.
Your previous irritation was likely either caused by mps, your fc being harsh due to no cya in the water, possibly biofilms, Or it could have been the version of dichlor that’s in the frog - it is acidic remember.
You can have non irritating or “not harsh water” with a manually dosed chlorine tub just like a swg tub so long as it’s sanitary & balanced as we recommend. When people claim it’s a night & day difference they are often experiencing-
A: the softness of the water from the salt addition (which you can do without buying a swg if you wish)
Or
B: the fact that now their tub is properly chlorinated most all the time unlike before so they aren’t experiencing the negative things that come along with an under sanitized tub (rashes, cloudiness etc.)

There is less of a roller coaster with a swg because it’s giving you a little fc around the clock if it is built in or at designated intervals if on a timer like mine. Since it’s, at the very least, handling standby fc theres less need to raise fc as high if you do need to manually dose.
Mps is really not necessary, I have never used it for various reasons-
It is only an oxidizer not a sanitizer - chlorine is effective at both
It shows up as cc’s on the test unless an interference reagent is used.
which is funny because the very reason most people use it is to get rid of cc’s
it is not listed in PoolMath
it’s a known irritant
Hope this helps

 

[mayberry32]

Lets clear a couple things up-
* going salt doesn’t effect how often you need to purge/refill
- accumulation of biofilms
- how frequently you use the tub/bather load
- always maintaining adequate fc according to the FC/CYA Levels or not
&
- the presence of persistent cc’s (despite raising to shock level) determine this interval.

* Compensating for fc loss due to bather waste & standby loss whilst always remaining above min for your cya is a must in a chlorine tub - whether the swg produces most/all of the fc or you manually dose in some other fashion.
Some people keep their swg settings higher or have light bather loads that allow them to not need to manually dose usually.
If I wanted, I could push the button & turn on my swg instead of dosing with liquid chlorine most of the time. Sometimes I do, it just depends on the situation. The cells only have a finite amount of fc they will produce in their lifetime, also it’s not instant fc like a shot of lc after long sweaty soak.
If you notice,
there is no recommendation for min/target fc for a cya of 30 with a swg on the FC/CYA Levels so use the liquid chlorine side.
Your previous irritation was likely either caused by mps, your fc being harsh due to no cya in the water, possibly biofilms, Or it could have been the version of dichlor that’s in the frog - it is acidic remember.
You can have non irritating or “not harsh water” with a manually dosed chlorine tub just like a swg tub so long as it’s sanitary & balanced as we recommend. When people claim it’s a night & day difference they are often experiencing-
A: the softness of the water from the salt addition (which you can do without buying a swg if you wish)
Or
B: the fact that now their tub is properly chlorinated most all the time unlike before so they aren’t experiencing the negative things that come along with an under sanitized tub (rashes, cloudiness etc.)

There is less of a roller coaster with a swg because it’s giving you a little fc around the clock if it is built in or at designated intervals if on a timer like mine. Since it’s, at the very least, handling standby fc theres less need to raise fc as high if you do need to manually dose.
Mps is really not necessary, I have never used it for various reasons-
It is only an oxidizer not a sanitizer - chlorine is effective at both
It shows up as cc’s on the test unless an interference reagent is used.
which is funny because the very reason most people use it is to get rid of cc’s
it is not listed in PoolMath
it’s a known irritant
Hope this helps

This helps a lot. I’m leaning more and more toward converting to salt, since the tub OD made for it and it’s a simple switch. I really do like the idea of constant chlorine being added via the salt cell. I also don’t like worrying about the FC level dropping too low every single time I use the tub.

And the irritation could have been from any of the things you mentioned. But the frog system was in there from day 1. And the irritation happened the very day I added the non chlorine shock. But it could have been the biofilm that the purge got rid of. It just didn’t affect me the first 5 days of using the tub. Who knows. But I would prefer not to test it and use the non chlorine shock again. That itching was miserable.

Thank you for the lengthy response.

 

[mayberry32]

Lets clear a couple things up-
* going salt doesn’t effect how often you need to purge/refill

Okay, I do need some clarification on this. For chlorine tubs, I'm seeing that you need to change the water every 3 months. The Freshwater Saltwater system from Hot Springs says you don't need to purge/refill more than once a year. You just have to change the salt cell every 4 months.

 

[Mdragger88]

That is not the recommendation here-
Some people are able to do this based on the factors I mentioned above but the swg has nothing to do with it. You can do the same in a manually dosed tub as well.
Bare minimum is once a year, every 4-6 months is recommended in heavy/normal use situations. I recently went 8 month’s instead of my normal 6 months & attribute being able to do so to:
Purging with Ahhsome 1st to ensure a clean slate,
maintaining adequate fc levels all the time,
using Aqua Clarity weekly (as it acts like a mini purge).
I suspect that is a claim to get you to buy their expensive proprietary swg system.
The set it & forget it nature of the Frog system they recommend for a chlorine tub or soley using dichlor to chlorinate as is often recommended by manufacturers generally leads to poor water quality in short order necessitating frequent drains/refills but that doesn’t have to be the case with the dichlor then bleach method.

 

[JoeSelf]

I'm changing out my water soon, probably end of month, filled end of June. My water is fine, no persistant CCs, funky smell. Going to try for 6 months to get me thru winter. The use of AquaClarity will allow me to run this long. Don't want to have a "necessary" water change in the middle of winter. I wouldn't want to try to go any further than 6 months.

P.S. - The AquaClarity has really helped with PH creep. That and a half ounce of dichlor every other week.

 

[phonedave]

Okay, I do need some clarification on this. For chlorine tubs, I'm seeing that you need to change the water every 3 months. The Freshwater Saltwater system from Hot Springs says you don't need to purge/refill more than once a year. You just have to change the salt cell every 4 months.

Picture a salt system this way. A jug of bleach sitting on the side of your tub with a pinhole in it that slowly but constantly adds a stream of chlorine to your hot tub. That is all it is.

You can get that stream dialed into your tubs average chlorine consumption and be good to go. But if something makes that consumption spike, you are going to want to add a single big dose of bleach manually.

That is all a salt system is doing, adding a (fairly) constant, small, amount of chlorine to your tub. You still have to manually dose to cover the big things, like long soaks or dirty people.

As for water changes, it is still the same analogy. Adding a constant amount of chlorine is not going to change how often you need to do a water change. The idea of only having to change your tub once a year because of salt is pure nonsense.

How often you change your water depends on use rate, and what contamination you introduce. There are certain Chloramines that do not off gas (persistent chloramines) they are going to stay in your water no matter what. They are in pools to, but are more pronounced in hot tubs because of the small volume. In addition there are particulates that your filters will not get. When your water gets hazy, smelly, CC wont go away, or excessive foaming, then it is time to change.

I change mine every 3-4 months. Right now I am pushing it, because I want to change it as late as possible in the fall, hoping that I can then make it to spring - avoiding a cold winter change.

 

[mayberry32]

So, hopefully someone can help with this. When I got home tonight from Coaching a little league baseball game, the green light was off on my tub, staying the temp wasn’t working within 2°of where it was set. The setting on the tub was 100 °. When I took off the cover, the control panel read 88°. It was clearly warmer than that. I turned on the Jets and climbing immediately, all the way up to 100°, within a minute. I have noticed this once or twice. What could cause this?

Well, figured it out…finally. Apparently, one of the kids played with the control remote and turned on the Summer Mode. I turned that off and it stopped. I still don’t completely understand the complete purpose and function of Summer mode, since there is no cooler in the tub.

 

[BravoRomeo]

Well, figured it out…finally. Apparently, one of the kids played with the control remote and turned on the Summer Mode. I turned that off and it stopped. I still don’t completely understand the complete purpose and function of Summer mode, since there is no cooler in the tub.

My old Hot Springs tub had a summer mode. As I recall it turned off the 24/7 circulating pump and allowed the water temp to drop below the set point. The circ pump used 70 watts, and the waste heat from that ultimately ends up in the water. Running the jets also adds a lot of energy to the water, heating it slowly, especially under an insulated cover. Summer mode is supposed to help prevent your tub water from overheating on hot summer days. My info is old and fuzzy, so check your manual.

 

[Ahhsomeguy]

Good Morning JoeSelf: Since you have been using the Aqua Clarity now for awhile there may be very little
bio-gunk in your plumbing lines and jets. To make sure though, since you have the Aqua Clarity all mixed, add 3 ounces of it for each 100 gallons of water capacity and purge the tub before you dump the water. Just run the purge for 10 minutes. You will be able to go the 6 months without issue for most hot tubs with regular use. It is always a good idea to purge, drain and refill periodically. You may find that the 6 month interval for your tub is all you need. Many other hot tub or swim spa owners can go longer. Small gallonage hot tubs, 250 gallons or less, need to do this every 3-4 months. So glad you appreciate what the Aqua Clarity is doing for your water.

 

[mayberry32]

Good Morning JoeSelf: Since you have been using the Aqua Clarity now for awhile there may be very little
bio-gunk in your plumbing lines and jets. To make sure though, since you have the Aqua Clarity all mixed, add 3 ounces of it for each 100 gallons of water capacity and purge the tub before you dump the water. Just run the purge for 10 minutes. You will be able to go the 6 months without issue for most hot tubs with regular use. It is always a good idea to purge, drain and refill periodically. You may find that the 6 month interval for your tub is all you need. Many other hot tub or swim spa owners can go longer. Small gallonage hot tubs, 250 gallons or less, need to do this every 3-4 months. So glad you appreciate what the Aqua Clarity is doing for your water.

I see that people are using the Aqua Clarity for regular maintenance. If it is constantly cleaning bio films and other things out of your jets and making the water clearer, is there any residue or chemicals that would cause skin irritation by using the hot tub , since the aqua clarity will accumulate in the water until you purge?

 

[Ahhsomeguy]

Hi Mayberry32: One of the reasons why people are using the Aqua Clarity program is to make sure that bio contaminants that are one of the major causes of rashes and itching are eliminated as they try to colonize. Using Aqua Clarity will perform a myriad of functions that will create a hot tub that is healthier, more inviting and much easier to maintain. That little 6 ounce bottle of concentrated Aqua Clarity makes 128 ounces of finished,product.
We have marketed this program as a "save on plastic and shipping cost" program. You supply the gallon container and the water. Why do we need to ship truck loads of water around the country? Even today, many people buy frozen concentrated orange juice at their supermarket and mix it in a container with water. We mimic that same program. We can offer the product at a much lower rate and we save on the environment as well.
You mention that Aqua Clarity builds up in the water And accumulates until yiu purge. Not sure where you picked that up but it is an incorrect statement. If that was the case just one dose would be all you would need. Aqua Clarity is constantly on-guard sweeping accumulating nasties from hot tub plumbing and surfaces. Filtration is better. Salt Water Cells are kep't cleaner. Water is much clearer. pH and TA are buffered to a great extent so there is very little fluctuation. (see previous comments in postings). Many thousands of hot tubs are using this program with great success and much lower maintenance costs. You simply need the Aqua Clarity and a sanitizer. No need for mineral sticks, enzymes or other items that cost you money. My 720 gallon hot tub has been on the program for years. I have never had an issue with itching or water clarity. You won't either. Just add it weekly and maintain adequate sanitizer. My preference is chlorine but it doesn't matter. This work well with chlorine, bromine or poly biquanides. So simple to maintain. Using less stuff is really better. The hot tub store may not like this but you certainly will.

 

[Taylor1584]

Lets clear a couple things up-
* going salt doesn’t effect how often you need to purge/refill
- accumulation of biofilms
- how frequently you use the tub/bather load
- always maintaining adequate fc according to the FC/CYA Levels or not
&
- the presence of persistent cc’s (despite raising to shock level) determine this interval.

* Compensating for fc loss due to bather waste & standby loss whilst always remaining above min for your cya is a must in a chlorine tub - whether the swg produces most/all of the fc or you manually dose in some other fashion.
Some people keep their swg settings higher or have light bather loads that allow them to not need to manually dose usually.
If I wanted, I could push the button & turn on my swg instead of dosing with liquid chlorine most of the time. Sometimes I do, it just depends on the situation. The cells only have a finite amount of fc they will produce in their lifetime, also it’s not instant fc like a shot of lc after long sweaty soak.
If you notice,
there is no recommendation for min/target fc for a cya of 30 with a swg on the FC/CYA Levels so use the liquid chlorine side.
Your previous irritation was likely either caused by mps, your fc being harsh due to no cya in the water, possibly biofilms, Or it could have been the version of dichlor that’s in the frog - it is acidic remember.
You can have non irritating or “not harsh water” with a manually dosed chlorine tub just like a swg tub so long as it’s sanitary & balanced as we recommend. When people claim it’s a night & day difference they are often experiencing-
A: the softness of the water from the salt addition (which you can do without buying a swg if you wish)
Or
B: the fact that now their tub is properly chlorinated most all the time unlike before so they aren’t experiencing the negative things that come along with an under sanitized tub (rashes, cloudiness etc.)

There is less of a roller coaster with a swg because it’s giving you a little fc around the clock if it is built in or at designated intervals if on a timer like mine. Since it’s, at the very least, handling standby fc theres less need to raise fc as high if you do need to manually dose.
Mps is really not necessary, I have never used it for various reasons-
It is only an oxidizer not a sanitizer - chlorine is effective at both
It shows up as cc’s on the test unless an interference reagent is used.
which is funny because the very reason most people use it is to get rid of cc’s
it is not listed in PoolMath
it’s a known irritant
Hope this helps

"There is less of a roller coaster with a swg because it’s giving you a little fc around the clock if it is built in or at designated intervals if on a timer like mine."

I ordered the Salton Mini based on your and others use. It arrives Monday. Is the timer built in or something you added? Electricians coming Monday to power up the new hot tub. The tub does have a dedicated circulation pump so I think a timer would come in handy. Any suggestions.

Christine

 

[mayberry32]

So, I keep reading about foam and I have a question. Water is perfectly balanced. Perfectly clear. No sediments or film on top when it’s still and the tub is off. But when I turn it on, I have these white bubbles around the tub. Is this foam, or are bubbles like this normal while the jets are running?

 

[Ahhsomeguy]

Good Morning: When the jets are engaged and the air venturis are open you will see bubbles That may appear as foam. This is fairly typical. The key though is to see how long it takes for the small bubbles to dissipate. If it takes more than 15-20 seconds you may be adding a little too much Aqua Clarity. If so, cut it back a trifle until you see what weekly dosage is optimum for your size tub based on usage.

 

[PoolBrews]

"There is less of a roller coaster with a swg because it’s giving you a little fc around the clock if it is built in or at designated intervals if on a timer like mine."

I ordered the Salton Mini based on your and others use. It arrives Monday. Is the timer built in or something you added? Electricians coming Monday to power up the new hot tub. The tub does have a dedicated circulation pump so I think a timer would come in handy. Any suggestions.

Christine

The Saltron Mini has a built in timer. You set it for the # of hours to run over a 24 hr period, and it turns on off for intervals of time over each 24 hours. I have a 250 gallon hot tub, and run it 2 hours/24.

 

[mayberry32]

Good Morning: When the jets are engaged and the air venturis are open you will see bubbles That may appear as foam. This is fairly typical. The key though is to see how long it takes for the small bubbles to dissipate. If it takes more than 15-20 seconds you may be adding a little too much Aqua Clarity. If so, cut it back a trifle until you see what weekly dosage is optimum for your size tub based on usage.

I haven’t added aqua clarity at all yet. But the bubbles dissipate within 10-15 seconds after turning off the jets.

 

[whiter0se]

Over the weekend, I went ahead and cleaned out the tub, tried to remove any calcium waterlines and now the tub looks pristine. The filter is the only thing that needs attention, I went ahead and brought this however the warning labels scare me.
HTH Spa Care Filter Cleaner for Spas & Hot Tubs, 16oz (Pool Chemicals)
Robot or human?

It states it is very corrosive and must not be contact with skin, etc. I’m not sure if I should use this just because of the corrosive nature and the strong acids inside.

Should I return this and buy something that is less harsh or would it be okay to use?

 

[Mdragger88]

"There is less of a roller coaster with a swg because it’s giving you a little fc around the clock if it is built in or at designated intervals if on a timer like mine."

I ordered the Salton Mini based on your and others use. It arrives Monday. Is the timer built in or something you added? Electricians coming Monday to power up the new hot tub. The tub does have a dedicated circulation pump so I think a timer would come in handy. Any suggestions.

Christine

The saltron mini has a built in timer - example : if you set it to 2, it runs for 2 hours then turns off & 24 hours later it runs for 2 hours again & so on
If the unit loses power, when power is restored it will immediately come on for the previously designated time & continue on as mentioned above.
My tub is small (200 gal) so 2 or 3 hours is alot of fc all at once but possibly not enough to last me for 24hrs. To circumvent this I have it plugged into an external timer & it is set to remove the power for 30 minutes & then restore it multiple times per day (currently twice but during high use times I change it to 3 times) so I just keep my saltron setting at 1 hour & when power is restored it comes on, runs for it’s 1 hour cycle then turns itself off.

This also allows me to press the button on the unit & run on demand as needed for an hour without messing up my settings.
For larger tubs this may not be necessary- alot of people can just set it for 3 or 4 hours & be good.