Need to replace filter and have no clue what to buy after researching

[poolhelpplease.]

Hi, I don't know much about pool equipment and I feel like every salesman I talk to is just trying to get my money.

I currently have a 7 year old cartridge filter with 4 cartridges that needs a lot of repairs so I just want to replace it. The label is worn out and doesn't say the exact model that I have so its of no help to me. All that I know is that it is 320, 420, or 520 sq ft. and the res GPM is 120 or 150.


Every salesman I've talked to has pushed me towards sand filters for some reason but I want cartridge as it filters better.

Today I purchased a Hayward C225S single cartridge filter that I will pick up tomorrow but I don't know if I made the right choice. It was $700CAD and I can't find any information about it online. I read that for my 1.5HP pump I should use a 300-400 sq ft filter and the one I bought is only 200sqft. It is also much smaller than the one I have currently.

Was the one I had overkill or is the one I bought not good enough? They also had one with 4 cartridges but it was double the price.

 

[MITBeta]

The general advice is to buy the biggest filter you can afford.

 

[YippeeSkippy]

You purchased a fairly small filter which will require more frequent cleanings than if you'd picked a larger one.
How many cartridges does your current filter have? Did it work well for you (until it didn't)??
Sand filters are slower to clear but work perfectly well, I would say they're easier to clean. Maybe that's why they're pitching them?? Also perhaps that they're suggesting what they can get their hands on?...with the world's supply lines being in such flux.

Maddie

 

[ferretbone]

I'm going to save you months if not, years of anguish. Take that little thing back buddy. That's an above ground pool filter. Your pool is already green, and that thing will be a nightmare for you. If you want to down grade a little on your filter stop at a 420sqft.

I love love love sand filters, but for you I'm pushing a cartridge filter (with 4 cartridges). 320-420. Search Waterway, Pentair, Hayward, and Jandy, The filter you have now is as big as they get for cartridges, and it has four of them in there. It is made by Pentair I'm 95% sure of. You don't have to go that big on your replacement as your old one, but don't use that Phisher Price above ground filter.
If you have to because of the supply shortages with reguard to sand filters you can do a TR60 or TR100.

 

[Dirk]

What is actually wrong with the old filter? My Pentair filter is well over seven years old and it's fine. I replaced the cartridges once.

What about a new o-ring and four new cartridges? Maybe a new gauge and/or relief valve? Those parts should still be available for your filter. Your filter looks a lot like an older version of this one, with a Trevi label slapped over the original Pentair label (or maybe Trevi worked out some sort of distribution deal with Pentair). Note how the bottom half of the label looks a lot like the one on this model. That's a $1600 filter you're about to toss, maybe more up your way, that maybe could be made "like-new" for a few hundred bucks. It'll be a lot easier to replace some parts than to plumb in a completely different model.

Pentair EC-160332 Clean & Clear Plus 520 sq. ft. Cartridge Pool Filter - Limited Warranty | Leslie's Pool Supplies

Pentair Clean & Clear Plus Cartridge Filter CCP520 is a corrosion resistant 4-cartridge filtration system that combines top-end performance with low maintenance

lesliespool.com

I just grabbed this quick, just to show you how these parts can be replaced. There are probably lots of other online places to buy them.

Pentair Clean & Clear® Plus Filter Parts For Fiberglass Reinforced Polypropylene Tank

Pentair Clean & Clear® Plus Filter Replacement Parts For Fiberglass Reinforced Polypropylene Tank

www.getpoolparts.com

I don't know how hard it is to get parts shipped to Canada, or if it's even possible. Just pointing out an alternate option...

 

[Dirk]

 

[Dirk]

I can't say for sure what you actually need, but here's a reference point:

https://www.amazon.com/Pleatco-PCC130-PAK4-Replacement-Cartridge-Cartridges/dp/B002869V2M/ref=asc_df_B002869V2M/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=167126215582&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=11769889237233689251&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9031727&hvtargid=pla-305102190609&psc=1

 

[poolhelpplease.]

What is actually wrong with the old filter? My Pentair filter is well over seven years old and it's fine. I replaced the cartridges once.

What about a new o-ring and four new cartridges? Maybe a new gauge and/or relief valve? Those parts should still be available for your filter. Your filter looks a lot like an older version of this one, with a Trevi label slapped over the original Pentair label (or maybe Trevi worked out some sort of distribution deal with Pentair). Note how the bottom half of the label looks a lot like the one on this model. That's a $1600 filter you're about to toss, maybe more up your way, that maybe could be made "like-new" for a few hundred bucks. It'll be a lot easier to replace some parts than to plumb in a completely different model.

Pentair EC-160332 Clean & Clear Plus 520 sq. ft. Cartridge Pool Filter - Limited Warranty | Leslie's Pool Supplies

Pentair Clean & Clear Plus Cartridge Filter CCP520 is a corrosion resistant 4-cartridge filtration system that combines top-end performance with low maintenance

lesliespool.com

I just grabbed this quick, just to show you how these parts can be replaced. There are probably lots of other online places to buy them.

Pentair Clean & Clear® Plus Filter Parts For Fiberglass Reinforced Polypropylene Tank

Pentair Clean & Clear® Plus Filter Replacement Parts For Fiberglass Reinforced Polypropylene Tank

www.getpoolparts.com

I don't know how hard it is to get parts shipped to Canada, or if it's even possible. Just pointing out an alternate option...

Yeah that’s exactly the one I think. Thank you so much. I thought it was just an outdated trevi filter.

The issue is that one of the valves is broken off. Last year I went to trevi and ordered a new one, waited for months and never got it. The metal belt also leaks water and I don’t know how to fix it, I would also need to replace the 4 cartridges since I haven’t done it since I built the pool

 

[poolhelpplease.]

I'm going to save you months if not, years of anguish. Take that little thing back buddy. That's an above ground pool filter. Your pool is already green, and that thing will be a nightmare for you. If you want to down grade a little on your filter stop at a 420sqft.

I love love love sand filters, but for you I'm pushing a cartridge filter (with 4 cartridges). 320-420. Search Waterway, Pentair, Hayward, and Jandy, The filter you have now is as big as they get for cartridges, and it has four of them in there. It is made by Pentair I'm 95% sure of. You don't have to go that big on your replacement as your old one, but don't use that Phisher Price above ground filter.
If you have to because of the supply shortages with reguard to sand filters you can do a TR60 or TR100.

The green pool is because it’s closed and because of the winter. I can turn it clear in a few hours by doing a shock treatment.

Why do you think I should get another one with 4 cartridges and 320+ sqft? I read on swim university that for a pool like mine I should only need between 100-200

 

[poolhelpplease.]

I can't say for sure what you actually need, but here's a reference point:

https://www.amazon.com/Pleatco-PCC130-PAK4-Replacement-Cartridge-Cartridges/dp/B002869V2M/ref=asc_df_B002869V2M/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=167126215582&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=11769889237233689251&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9031727&hvtargid=pla-305102190609&psc=1

I just looked at pentairs prices and its $250/cartridge*4 + $500 for the clamp + around $60 for the broken pipe. It would cost me the same as buying a new filter with 4 cartridges.

Trevi is selling this one for $1400 but do you think that it’s worth spending double at purchase from what I bought yesterday and then spending $1k on cartridges every few years for a 10.6k gallon pool with a 1.5hp pump? Would I have any noticeable benefits?

 

[poolhelpplease.]

You purchased a fairly small filter which will require more frequent cleanings than if you'd picked a larger one.
How many cartridges does your current filter have? Did it work well for you (until it didn't)??
Sand filters are slower to clear but work perfectly well, I would say they're easier to clean. Maybe that's why they're pitching them?? Also perhaps that they're suggesting what they can get their hands on?...with the world's supply lines being in such flux.

Maddie

my old one had 4 big cartridges and I cleaned it maybe once a summer but I don’t want to spend money on fixing it and $1k on cartridges

 

[1poolman1]

The green pool is because it’s closed and because of the winter. I can turn it clear in a few hours by doing a shock treatment.

Why do you think I should get another one with 4 cartridges and 320+ sqft? I read on swim university that for a pool like mine I should only need between 100-200

If you will think of your filtration system, for cleaning purposes, as you home vacuum system, you will see why a very large filter is so very nice. Even 300sq. ft., which we thought amazing when the first one came out (Hayward C-3000) in 1990 or so, is just the beginning size today on most pools (except Florida for some reason).
A vacuum literally "pumps" air through a filter that traps debris (bag, container, et.) and returns cleaner air to the home. You pool filtration does the same with water (we are not talking circulating chemicals at the moment). You may remember the "Dust Buster," a very small, hand-held vacuum for light duty. You could, if you wanted, vacuum an entire house with it, but imagine how often you would have to empty the container so it would continue to work. Just the wear and tear on opening the filter area would wear it out.
The larger the filter the more dirt it can hold and continue to allow for good circulation without frequent cleanings. If you were to talk with any cartridge-filter manufacturer they would tell you that it is the cleaning process that wears out cartridges, not the filtering itself (unless your chemistry is incredibly bad). I had a customer, many years ago who refused to replace his 25sq. ft. (yes 25, a StaRite TX25, you can still get cartridges for them) cartridge filter on a 20,000 gallon pool because he enjoyed cleaning the filter every other day. He had stacks of cartridges in a shed.
If you enjoy being that involved with your pool, get the 100-200 size. If you regularly allow your pool to turn green over the Winter, be prepared to have to replace your cartridge more frequently. Algae, dead or alive, will embed in the fabric and require deeper (harder) cleanings, wearing the cartridge faster.

 

[poolhelpplease.]

If you will think of your filtration system, for cleaning purposes, as you home vacuum system, you will see why a very large filter is so very nice. Even 300sq. ft., which we thought amazing when the first one came out (Hayward C-3000) in 1990 or so, is just the beginning size today on most pools (except Florida for some reason).
A vacuum literally "pumps" air through a filter that traps debris (bag, container, et.) and returns cleaner air to the home. You pool filtration does the same with water (we are not talking circulating chemicals at the moment). You may remember the "Dust Buster," a very small, hand-held vacuum for light duty. You could, if you wanted, vacuum an entire house with it, but imagine how often you would have to empty the container so it would continue to work. Just the wear and tear on opening the filter area would wear it out.
The larger the filter the more dirt it can hold and continue to allow for good circulation without frequent cleanings. If you were to talk with any cartridge-filter manufacturer they would tell you that it is the cleaning process that wears out cartridges, not the filtering itself (unless your chemistry is incredibly bad). I had a customer, many years ago who refused to replace his 25sq. ft. (yes 25, a StaRite TX25, you can still get cartridges for them) cartridge filter on a 20,000 gallon pool because he enjoyed cleaning the filter every other day. He had stacks of cartridges in a shed.
If you enjoy being that involved with your pool, get the 100-200 size. If you regularly allow your pool to turn green over the Winter, be prepared to have to replace your cartridge more frequently. Algae, dead or alive, will embed in the fabric and require deeper (harder) cleanings, wearing the cartridge faster.

This is what it looks like in the winter so I don’t really have a choice

Thanks for the explanation it’s more clear now. I had another question about square feet vs GPM. Are they both related in any way because I have a 2HP pump and I read that if the filter is too small for the pump, they will both wear out faster.

 

[magiteck]

This is what it looks like in the winter so I don’t really have a choice View attachment 402919

My pool looks like that in the winter too, but it never turns green. Your pool isn’t turning green when it’s frozen and snow covered, it’s turning green in the fall or spring.

Algae lies mostly dormant under 60 degrees (F). If you wait until your water temperature is below 60 degrees F to close, and open again before the temperature reaches 60, you can avoid the green opening.

Whichever filter you choose, not having to play algae clean up duty will help it last longer.

 

[pjt]

Get the largest filter you can find/afford. Barring an unusual event, I can go over a year between cleanings.

 

[poolhelpplease.]

I'm going to save you months if not, years of anguish. Take that little thing back buddy. That's an above ground pool filter. Your pool is already green, and that thing will be a nightmare for you. If you want to down grade a little on your filter stop at a 420sqft.

I love love love sand filters, but for you I'm pushing a cartridge filter (with 4 cartridges). 320-420. Search Waterway, Pentair, Hayward, and Jandy, The filter you have now is as big as they get for cartridges, and it has four of them in there. It is made by Pentair I'm 95% sure of. You don't have to go that big on your replacement as your old one, but don't use that Phisher Price above ground filter.
If you have to because of the supply shortages with reguard to sand filters you can do a TR60 or TR100.

I called a company that is more focused on installing vs selling and they told me that my 2HP pump would would either blow up the cartridge of the filter that I bought or it would swell. They said I should go with a 300lbs 24in sand filter. Do you think that would be good enough?

 

[poolhelpplease.]

My pool looks like that in the winter too, but it never turns green. Your pool isn’t turning green when it’s frozen and snow covered, it’s turning green in the fall or spring.

Algae lies mostly dormant under 60 degrees (F). If you wait until your water temperature is below 60 degrees F to close, and open again before the temperature reaches 60, you can avoid the green opening.

Whichever filter you choose, not having to play algae clean up duty will help it last longer.

I can't really do that with the weather here. I can close it one day because its about to start snowing and the next week it'll be sunny. It was the same thing this month, towards the beginning of the month it was 20-30C and now it snowed again and its 5C

 

[Dirk]

If you were to talk with any cartridge-filter manufacturer they would tell you that it is the cleaning process that wears out cartridges, not the filtering itself

Thanks for all the great info @1poolman1. I don't know why this little gem didn't occur to me before. Well, it kinda did, when I was last cleaning my filter. I wondered if the force of the stream I use was too much for the fabric. This is a bit of a hijack, but I think maybe the OP could benefit from this post.

Based on my pool's general cleanliness, I had decided that cleaning my filter once a year was enough. But last year got away from me so I skipped a year. This Spring's cleaning was a two year stretch. The filter gauge had barely risen at all, and while my cartridges were dirty, I wouldn't describe them as full, not even close. Darker, yes, with a concentration of the larger stuff kind'a centered where the cartridges almost touch. The majority of the cartridge material was free of big stuff and generally lighter than the smaller darker areas. So three questions, in terms of cartridge longevity:

1. The general rule (I think?) is to clean the filter when its gauge rises to 20% over its clean state. Should I stick to that, no matter what, even if it's two years? Or three?!

2. I tend to spend a lot of time on cleaning, and try to get the cartridge material as white as possible. I only use the force of the water, no chemicals. But I have a pointed nozzle and I run it into every pleat. And then a once-over of the entire surface to get rid of anything I missed. They get pretty white, and are free of even the smallest bits of leaves. Is it better for the longevity of the filter to do a less "compulsive" clean, just get the big crud off and whatever of the finer dirt that a less invasive general spraying would loosen? Can one "over clean" a cartridge?

3. If I leave more of the finer dirt in the filter, to help with longevity, is that compromising the water chemistry? I expect I'd be using a bit more chlorine, as the FC would be "chewing" on the filter crud to some extent. But my water clarity, during this recent "year two" of filter cleaning, didn't appear to me to be any worse.

And while I was expecting to be able to lower my RPM after this deep clean, to satisfy my SWG flow rate requirement, I wasn't able to. So I don't think this two-year stretch significantly impacted flow. I have a FlowVis, and that didn't register any big improvement either.

This is what I've been using:

 

[Dirk]

I just looked at pentairs prices and its $250/cartridge*4 + $500 for the clamp + around $60 for the broken pipe. It would cost me the same as buying a new filter with 4 cartridges.

Trevi is selling this one for $1400 but do you think that it’s worth spending double at purchase from what I bought yesterday and then spending $1k on cartridges every few years for a 10.6k gallon pool with a 1.5hp pump? Would I have any noticeable benefits?

I don't know enough about filters to advise you on all that. I expected the Pentair cartridge price to be high, but not that high. I had given you that link showing four third-party cartridges were less than one Pentair. I replaced mine with Pentair, so I can't speak to how well any third-party cartridge might fare (I think I paid about $100 each). But if any third-party pool part could be substituted, I expect a filter cartridge might be one. Maybe @1poolman1 could weigh in on that.

But you got the gist of my posts. If you've satisfied yourself that repairing the old one costs near as much as new, then I guess that's that.

I think it's smart to also consider future cartridge replacement costs, but they should last longer than "a few years." My second set are about four years old now, and they look almost good-as-new. I replaced the first set, inherited from the previous home owner, but I expect they were abused by their pool maintenance company, who were an ever-revolving team of nincompoops. I used them for a while and then fired them. They were cleaning the filter four times a year (at $150 a pop), no doubt for the revenue stream (both the cleaning and the replacing). Since taking over myself, I only clean once a year. And after reading 1poolman1's posts I now realize that not only is that OK, but maybe even still too often.

I've never used a sand filter, but perhaps that's the more economical way to go, based on filter cartridge replacement costs in Canada?

 

[ferretbone]

I called a company that is more focused on installing vs selling and they told me that my 2HP pump would would either blow up the cartridge of the filter that I bought or it would swell. They said I should go with a 300lbs 24in sand filter. Do you think that would be good enough?

Pentair TR60 Tritton ll 24 inch Side Mount In Ground Sand Filter ** NEW in Box * 788379666125 | eBay

That first link is a TR60 its a side mounted backwash valve. And prolly the one they are going to install.
Its easy to do a deep clean, easy to change the sand, just know it is a smaller filter than what you have. Skill level 3 out of 10

Pentair SD60 Sand Dollar Pool Filter EC-145322 | Pool Supply 4 Less
This is the same filter size only the back wash valve is on top. Skill level 5 to clean, or change the sand. Its a little harder to clean and do sand changes. Dont compare prices from my links. I'm lazy and just looked up the first two I saw. Both should be good enough.

The next size up is a TR100, thats more than enough filter and you wont have to open it to cleaning for years. And when you do it will be far easier to clean or change out the sand.