Today the display on the controller (installed 2007) was "jittery" and displayed every character on the screen (more than typical). I turned off/on the breaker and then OK as far as the display was concerned. I checked the fuse and confirmed and tightened the wiring. I still have the problem with buzzing and failing to start. I had replaced both capacitors without success. How can I bypass the controller to see if that can possibly cause the buzzing? 2HP, 2 speed, 230VAC Century motor only two year old. Ideas?
Intermatic P1353 fail?
- Thread starter kotpool
- Start date
- Jul 21, 2013
- 54,440
- Pool Size
- 35000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
Post pics of the wiring into the Intermatic P1353 and we will see what looks best.
Turn off the CBs and wire nut together the LINE and LOAD wires to bypass the timer. You have to identify the high speed wire or low speed wire and you only wire nut one of them to the LINE wire. Got that?
You comfortable working with electrical wiring?
Turn off the CBs and wire nut together the LINE and LOAD wires to bypass the timer. You have to identify the high speed wire or low speed wire and you only wire nut one of them to the LINE wire. Got that?
You comfortable working with electrical wiring?
Kot,
Use a Voltmeter and measure between Line (input) L1 and L2.. You should measure about 240 volts. Do not measure between L1 and ground and L2 and ground. You must measure between L1 and L2.
Assuming you have 240 volts on the input to the timer, then measure between the load (output) L1 and L2 . When the timer is on, do you get 240 volts?
Thanks,
Jim R.
Use a Voltmeter and measure between Line (input) L1 and L2.. You should measure about 240 volts. Do not measure between L1 and ground and L2 and ground. You must measure between L1 and L2.
Assuming you have 240 volts on the input to the timer, then measure between the load (output) L1 and L2 . When the timer is on, do you get 240 volts?
Thanks,
Jim R.
I bypassed the controller for hi-speed and got the same motor response (loud buzz with no start). I measured 240V across L1 and L2. I then did the same for the low speed (but 240V across A and L2.) So I believe the problem is the motor. BTW, the Intermatic support tech was very quick and helpful as I asked him questions via email. (Century Regal Rexnord will not respond to end residential user. They say contact the vendor. But vendor has no tech support.) I'm stumped so I am awaiting a local pool tech in case he or she has a magic bullet. In the mean time I'm circulating with a 1/4HP sump pump in the deep end with a hose discharging in the spa and retuning water through the spa overflow. Good flow rate. So no filtering but at least I got circulation. I can't imagine motor fail at just two years. And I tested old and new capacitors and all test to spec. Centrifugal switch and governor are good. I can get a new Century motor for $500 but this short life is not a good sign. Recommend a more reliable motor manufacturer?
I will update as I learn more. Thanks for you help.
I will update as I learn more. Thanks for you help.
- Jul 21, 2013
- 54,440
- Pool Size
- 35000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
Yes. There are two. I replaced them both. I tested the old ones and the new ones and they all test to spec.
If the motor is also 16 years old, that's a respectable life for a two-speed motor.
Sorry, missed that. Was your SVL originally a 2hp single-speed pump? If so the total horsepower of the original motor was 2.6.
You don't say the motor model number of your motor now, but it may have been an up-rated motor that would have had a total horsepower 2.2. Won't last on that impeller. Just something to check.
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Original installed on this pump was Century B984, HP: 2.0-.33, Amps: 11.0/4.0. (I still have it in my garage!)
The pump I replaced that with is Century B2984, HP: 2.0/.25, Amps 11.0/1.8.
I run on low speed 99% of the time. High speed only to vacuum and I do that less now that I bought the Pool Blaster.
I noticed great electric savings with the B2984. But do you suspect the B2984 burned out in two years because it needs .33HP and not just .25HP?
The pump I replaced that with is Century B2984, HP: 2.0/.25, Amps 11.0/1.8.
I run on low speed 99% of the time. High speed only to vacuum and I do that less now that I bought the Pool Blaster.
I noticed great electric savings with the B2984. But do you suspect the B2984 burned out in two years because it needs .33HP and not just .25HP?
I looked at my records and I see that I had recorded actual in-process amp readings of the old pump and the new pump:
Old pump B984: 8.4 amps at hi speed. 3.4 amps at low speed. Nameplate shows 11.0/4.0
New pump B2984: 8.7 amps at high speed. 1.3 amps at low speed. Nameplate shows 11.0/1.8
I think the motor draws only what it needs in order to maintain speed. So I don't think that I have been overworking the pump causing it to fail prematurely.
You can hear the loud buzzing here:
Old pump B984: 8.4 amps at hi speed. 3.4 amps at low speed. Nameplate shows 11.0/4.0
New pump B2984: 8.7 amps at high speed. 1.3 amps at low speed. Nameplate shows 11.0/1.8
I think the motor draws only what it needs in order to maintain speed. So I don't think that I have been overworking the pump causing it to fail prematurely.
You can hear the loud buzzing here:
I suspect that the timer is sending power to both windings at the same time.
Disconnect the low speed wire and tape it off or wire nut to see if the pump starts with only the high speed wires connected.
Are you trying to start the pump in high speed or low speed?
You said that the timer was acting up and maybe it is turning on both speeds at the same time.
Can you show the back of the pump where the wiring and start capacitor are?
Motor type CXCP has a start capacitor and a run capacitor for the low speed and a run capacitor for the high speed (permanent split capacitor (PSC)).
As you can see, it is a complicated motor.
Are you sure that the wires all got put back correctly?
Are the centrifugal switch contacts clean?
www.troublefreepool.com
Motor type CXCP has a start capacitor and a run capacitor for the low speed and a run capacitor for the high speed (permanent split capacitor (PSC)).
As you can see, it is a complicated motor.
Are you sure that the wires all got put back correctly?
Are the centrifugal switch contacts clean?
Three capacitors on one pump motor?
Century 2HP 2-speed motor CAT B2984 230VAC. The capacitor under the top cover is 35+10 uF (it has three terminals). I believe that is the run capacitor. The capacitor under the end cover is 189-227 uF (it has two terminals). I believe that is the start capacitor. I learned that the 35+10...
www.troublefreepool.com
Thank you very much JamesW for taking the time! L2 is common. When running: A to L2 has 240VAC at lo-speed. L2 to L1 has 240VAC at hi-speed. No power between L1 and A. I tried your suggestion without success. I had taken careful pictures of the cap wiring before I disconnected and I confirmed that I had reconnected correctly. Switch contacts look good but I cleaned them anyway. I confirmed the governor works fine. No change before and after new caps. I had tested them all (old and new) prior to replace and they all meet spec (I bought a capacitor tester to read uf.) Local pool tech is too busy to come out. I don't blame him at all for taking care of regular customers first. I would do the same thing. I've done my own pool maintenance for thirty years with the help of TFP. Nearby motor shop shut down due to lack of business. Another one is too busy to get back to me. Anyway, this project is now moot. I have just ordered (for Thursday delivery) a Black & Decker 2HP VS complete pump from Walmart for $989 inc shipping, plus tax. I am temporarily using a 1/4HP sump pump drawing from deep end and discharging in the spa and returning through the spa waterfall. No filtering but at least I get circulation. Thanks again to all for your help!
This suggests that they might be both powered.
For High speed, there should only be 240 between L1 and L2.
For Low Speed, there should only be 240 between L2 and A.
Did you try it with only wires on L1 and L2 (No wire on A) and then with wires only on L2 and A (No wire on L1)?
No I did not try that. I'll try that on Friday before replacing the pump. Thanks again.
I had some time so I tried your suggestion (but in the controller not the motor.) I pulled out circuit 2 load wire (lo-speed) and pressed circuit 1 button (hi-speed) on and the motor started and ran good! Then I pressed circuit one button off. Then I put back circuit 2 load wire and pulled out circuit 1 load wire and pushed circuit 2 button but just buzz with no start. Then I repeated all but no success this time (just buzz). So maybe you're right that it's the controller. But I had previously bypassed the controller by pulling the wires from terminal 5 and 6 and then with CB off I wire nutted them together. Turned on CB but just buzz. The wiring shown here has been like this for many years operating well.
Circuit 2, terminal 5 is burned. It could be that the relay that powers terminal 6 has had the contacts welded from some sort of overload condition.
Swap wires on 4 and 6 and see what happens.
The 2-speed motor has two sets of windings.
The windings are connected together at L2.
When powering High speed, L1 to L2 should read 240 volts, L1 to A should also read 240 volts because you are reading the voltage from L2 through the windings and L2 to A should be 0 volts.
When powering Low speed, L2 to A should read 240 volts, L1 to A should also read 240 volts because you are reading the voltage from L2 through the windings and L2 to L1 should be 0 volts.
If you got 0 volts from L1 to A, that indicates that L1 and A were both being powered at the same time.
Your model of timer has to be configured as a two speed timer in the settings to prevent it from powering the high speed and the low speed at the same time.
Most likely, the configuration was lost or the timer is otherwise malfunctioning.
The motor might have been damaged from powering the high and low speed windings at the same time.
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