How to turn off solar heater?

[ajw22]

Thanks Dirk, do you have a link to those bundles that I can take a look?

IntelliCenter Complete Systems

 

[Dirk]

They're all over. Here's one. Shop around.

Pentair EasyTouch | Pool and Spa System | IC40 IntelliChlor System | Filter + 3 Circuits | 520543

Pool Supply Unlimited has some of the best prices when shopping for Pentair EasyTouch | Pool and Spa System | IC40 IntelliChlor System | Filter + 3 Circuits | 520543

www.poolsupplyunlimited.com

What I would encourage you to do first, though, is to completely plan out the system you want to end up with, starting with what you want it to be able to do. Make decisions now about several things:
- Remote control (with app, while away), or just local control?
- How many things to automate, just the pool, or other things (garden lights, bug zappers, fountain, etc)?
- Automated spa control?
- Automated solar control?
- Automated heater control?
- Variable speed pump control?

To name a few. Wander around here at TFP to discover what is possible, then decide what you want for your own system. Armed with that, you next pick an automation controller that can do all those things (brand, model, number of relay circuits, etc). Then what components to be controlled are needed. Then see if you can get some of those in a bundle to save some money, and/or installed such that you get a nice, fat warranty.

A complete plan, before you buy anything.

One plan might include that pump you bought. Another plan might not. That $200 (with the cable you're about to buy) might have been put to better use. The filter was a good purchase. It fits with just about any future plan. You don't necessarily have to buy everything at once. But going forward you can piece things together, that both fit your budget and your plan. Eventually you'll have your dream system, without buying anything you won't eventually use.

This MO would also affect your pending replumb. That becomes part of the plan, too. So whatever plumbing improvements you make now will accommodate and fit with the future expansion plan, including what valves and actuators you might need. Another example: why by an actuator now that might come with a bundle you'll get later.

Just encouraging you to thing farther ahead...

 

[caycarem]

Thanks Dirk, I've decided to skip Pentair automation altogether not just $$$ (and no warranty unless pro-installed) but not sure if it's really needed. Will get a cheap SWG and get away with frankenstein solar automation and a timer, and maybe when it dies I'll have figured out if I wanted full automation.

 

[Dirk]

Gotcha. Your plan keeps morphing so I'm not always up to speed! The advice is still sound: make a master plan and then make purchases to support that plan (which you might already be doing).

Plus, I'm projecting (which I might have already mentioned). I can't wrap my head around a pool that isn't automated, even though it's perfectly fine, and common, to not automate. I'm just into automation...

 

[caycarem]

Yes, you really ARE into automation! but that's great! I trust the full automation that you suggested is the best way to go.
That said, I've been doing a lot of readings and considering all options (and changing mind along the way, sorry! ), but couldn't get myself to commit to that level of automation at this time. another swim season or 2 and I'll know for sure lol.
In the mean time, I'll try to replumb in a way that doesn't make it too difficult to switch to Pentair automation in the future.
Happy Thanksgiving!

 

[caycarem]

Dirk,

That's not quite correct. I used the digital inputs to accomplish these functions. For V-Green speeds are called Steps that are easily configurable. I configured mine as follows:

Step one is lowest speed and set with the internal timer to run 24 hrs per day. Digital inputs override the internal timer and when there's no digital input the motor reverts to the internal timer. All you have to do is run a signal wire to one of the 4 digital inputs that can be independently set to any speed. This triggers that speed as long as the signal exists. When solar valve is opened I use digital input powered from the solar 3-way valve signal to speed up to a higher speed. I do the same for the gas heater but take the signal from the gas valve solenoid to kick up to higher speed. There are a total of 4 digital inputs that can be configured this way. Digital input signals are very flexible, can be any signal from 9-30 volts AC or DC. You can do this with any automation system in place to control other components. For example I use the Intellicenter to control on-off of swg and make sure it can't run when the pump is off. So I can adjust run-time of swg to be less than pump run time if needed. Also use it for temp control of solar and gas heater which is all done using remote apps.

Chris

what kind of digital input cable works with the Vgreen? I'm eyeing a $200 OBO used (4 years) waterway V165 pump but it doesn't come with any input cable.

 

[setsailsoon]

If you're using digital inputs you don't need any special cable. I used multi-conductor cable you can buy at HD. 22 ga is fine. What all do you want to control? Assuming solar bypass valve and Heater? Do you have or plan to add swg?

Chris

 

[caycarem]

If you're using digital inputs you don't need any special cable. I used multi-conductor cable you can buy at HD. 22 ga is fine. What all do you want to control? Assuming solar bypass valve and Heater? Do you have or plan to add swg?

Chris

I am thinking it would be nice to use the digital input to ramp up the pump when solar valve is open so I can run the pump at low speed 24/7. Yes on the SWG, I already purchased a new blue works SWG BLH40 that came with 2 generic T-15 cells.
I have a used superflo vs but thinking there're more options with Vgreen which I could trade for it. I may add a heater like Mastertemp later if I can find a good used one. obviously I'm on a tight budget this year

 

[setsailsoon]

That's great, and I ended up with the V-green due to budget woes as well after a big lightning strike took $5000+ by surprise. So here's how I would set it up if I were you:

• I would set the pump to run at low speed 24 hrs per day. This doesn't mean you have to run it 24 hrs per day, just that when you have it running (for example from a timer) it will run at low speed unless you have something running that requires a higher speed.
• If you have a bypass valve that closes to control the solar you can just split the 24 vac signal off the actuator that closes the valve and run that to "Step 1" and then set Step 1 to the desired speed (I run 3000 rpm).
• For the gas heater you can run a wire from the gas valve relay to "Step 2" and set that speed to whatever you want.
• You can do the same for the swg or just make sure the minimum speed is adequate for the swg.

You can set these up to run anything with that has a 12-24 v ac or dc when it runs. Not sure what kind of automation you plan to use for your system but any of them generate the signals you need to trigger speed changes without needing to use the RS 485, Of course you can do this if you want to using a protocol adapter.

I hope this is helpful.

Chris

 

[caycarem]

That's great, and I ended up with the V-green due to budget woes as well after a big lightning strike took $5000+ by surprise. So here's how I would set it up if I were you:

• I would set the pump to run at low speed 24 hrs per day. This doesn't mean you have to run it 24 hrs per day, just that when you have it running (for example from a timer) it will run at low speed unless you have something running that requires a higher speed.
• If you have a bypass valve that closes to control the solar you can just split the 24 vac signal off the actuator that closes the valve and run that to "Step 1" and then set Step 1 to the desired speed (I run 3000 rpm).
• For the gas heater you can run a wire from the gas valve relay to "Step 2" and set that speed to whatever you want.
• You can do the same for the swg or just make sure the minimum speed is adequate for the swg.

You can set these up to run anything with that has a 12-24 v ac or dc when it runs. Not sure what kind of automation you plan to use for your system but any of them generate the signals you need to trigger speed changes without needing to use the RS 485, Of course you can do this if you want to using a protocol adapter.

I hope this is helpful.

Chris

great, at the moment no fancy automation needed but only ramping pump speeds for solar, SWG and later on a heater. V-green sounds like a winner then, any 22 AWG copper will wire will work? like this one ?

 

[setsailsoon]

great, at the moment no fancy automation needed but only ramping pump speeds for solar, SWG and later on a heater. V-green sounds like a winner then, any 22 AWG copper will wire will work? like this one ?

That's exactly what I used on my first installation 6 years ago. When I did my "lightning recovery" project last year I used exterior cat 6 cable. I was concerned the cover on the cheaper conductor was getting a little stiff and thought the exterior rating on the cat 6 might be more resistant to the brutal Florida sun. So far both are working fine though.

With no automation initially you can just set the minimum speed for the pump on the internal timer to be the speed required for swg. This is usually 1500-1700 rpm but depends on your specific pump. You'll need to wire the swg so it can't run without the pump running. Don't rely on the included flow switch alone. This is fairly easy to do with timer control on the pump or any automation system. Let me know if you need more details on this.

The solar control you are using is identical to the one I used for several years even after I installed automation. Just find the two conductors that power 24 vac at the controller or at the valve actuator and splice into this signal to carry it to the digital input. I used 3m Scotchlock for the splice. Simple to use just push the wires all the way in and press the red button with pliers. This connects the conductors with no need to remove insulation and pushes silicone grease out the wire end. Perfect water-tight seal every time.


Please keep us posted. Photo's of your work would be most helpful.

Chris

 

[caycarem]

thanks Chris! I got the Vgreen pump (about 4 years old) on the cheap, but couple screws on the motor housing looked like they started to rust hope it isn't too bad. seems a bit lower build quality than a Pentair superflo. it's got 1.5" pipes hooked up to the swivel unions, i suppose it would reduce the flow a lot. any suggestions on where/what replacement unions to buy so i can use 2" pipes?
for SWG just put on a timer right? not so much automation i think...i'll hook it up to a kasa plug.
thanks for the splice idea for connecting the solar valve actuator to the pump digital input. i will definitely try this out.

 

[caycarem]

Chris - I just got a good condition 4 year old intelliflo 2-VST pump while I was looking for a gas heater. Already got Vgreen/superflo but it was so cheap I couldn't resist I think I will use it, and keep the Vgreen (or superflo as backup.)
I guess I'm back to Pentair after all. Will buy the RS-485 cable and hook to the 2013 Solartouch I have, hopefully the old solartouch firmware can recognize the pump.
$300 worth of pipes, fittings, glue, and solders stuff on the way from Lowes. Plan to re-plumb everything in a couple of weeks.

 

[setsailsoon]

Cay,

Pentair make great pumps that usually last a long time so that's a great deal if it's not damaged. I don't have any direct experience with the Solar Touch or the VST pump but I'd guess if they both use the Pentair RS-485 pump protocol it should work. @Jimrahbe has a lot more experience with Pentair VS pumps and Pentair automation - Jim, what do you think?

Chris

 

[Jimrahbe]

Cay,

Did you see the IntelliFlo VST working before you bought it???

The SolarTouch should be able to control it using the RS-485 port.

Good luck with your upgrade,

Jim R.

 

[caycarem]

Cay,

Did you see the IntelliFlo VST working before you bought it???

The SolarTouch should be able to control it using the RS-485 port.

Good luck with your upgrade,

Jim R.

Jim - I didnt see it working but looked very good and supposedly working before removal (guy showed me picture of his pool being filled. ) Do these 2-VST have high failure rate? What’s the best way to test those pumps before install? I bought these unions and plan to just do hand tight them in case pump doesnt work.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Cay,

They don't have a high failure rate, but there is much more that can go wrong with a VS pump than a single speed pump.

The pump could be perfect...
It could have a bad controller
It could have a bad RS-485 port
It could have a bad motor..

If I had a pump with an unknown status, I would test it out by temporarily putting it next to the pool and run a threaded PCV pipe in the input and output connections to suck water from the pool and then back to the pool.. You could then check all the functions except for the RS-485.. If you have the RS-485 cable you could also connect it to your SolarTouch.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[caycarem]

Cay,

They don't have a high failure rate, but there is much more that can go wrong with a VS pump than a single speed pump.

The pump could be perfect...
It could have a bad controller
It could have a bad RS-485 port
It could have a bad motor..

If I had a pump with an unknown status, I would test it out by temporarily putting it next to the pool and run a threaded PCV pipe in the input and output connections to suck water from the pool and then back to the pool.. You could then check all the functions except for the RS-485.. If you have the RS-485 cable you could also connect it to your SolarTouch.

Thanks,

Jim R.

Thanks Jim! RS-485 is on order $24 from ebay.

 

[caycarem]

Finally got the pad redone so here’s the update. Ran into a bunch of problems but that’s expected with the used stuff I bought. Fixed some, still trying to figure out others (pump air leak, heater not igniting, solartouch display no power). Total around $3k. I’m on a tight budget as you can see.

-($1k) pool guys whole day of work. Pretty crappy job I had to redo some parts afterwards. Hired them because they had a “working” used heater and could install all...obv not the best idea.
-($80 +$60 new oring, unions, Psi gauge) CCP420 filter now works fine
- ($75) intelliflo pump. basket has air bubbles sitting on top but pump runs fine 1000-2500rpm (~20-70 gpm @2-11 filter psi). Unable to tell where the air leak was from. Tempted to switch in the used Vgreen or superflo but not sure if I should.
-($700) new pentair warrior (S200) robot working great.
-($12) a cheap pvc amazon poolside water fountain in the old P280 pressure port. Though Without a booster, water spray only goes 2-3 feet out.
-($860) blueworks 40k SWG (+extra cell) on a KASA smartplug but using bypass for now as too cold, trying to work on TA (90)/CYA (45)before adding salt. Brought TA to 90 thanks to the raining days and some acid. PH seems to stay at 7.3 and not moving up at all.
- ($0) raypak P R336A (2008) heater that isn’t working, it keeps trying to ignite then displays call for service. didnt pay as it didnt work.
-my solartouch (bought new 6 years ago) powered up fine (green led “ready”) but main display has no power. I took it out and put back the old hayward GL235 while I look for something else.
- someone is selling a unused aqualink RS8 box for $450 but not sure how these work or if it’s worth it? See pic.
“I have a control center that has never been used with 4 relays. Still in box. I also put in the actual digital 8 option control center that works fine.”