How to get rid of super-fine silt

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waterfall_hunter

Member
Sep 20, 2019
6
Portland/Oregon
Hi!

This is my first season with a pool, although I've kept a hot tub for 20 years. I have an in-ground 20x40 pool, vinyl liner, glass media filter, but I mostly use a manual PoolBlaster Max Li for vacuuming. I have both the regular bag (I think they call it a "fine filtration bag") and a silt & sediment (picture thin support hose material) bag. I've found that even running these two bags together, I'll still get blow-out from the exhaust while vacuuming, so I end up vacuuming the same stuff over and over, which is frustrating. As best as I can tell this is a super-fine algae debris. I was wondering if I can use flocculant with this vacuum, leaving my whole filter system out of it, aside from doing the recirculation (no filtering) prior to vacuuming. I wouldn't want to ruin the vacuum. I would prefer to not ruin the main bag, but am ok with having to discard one of the silt & sediment bags. I'm on a well, and it wouldn't be able to keep up with me using a hose vacuum through the pump going to waste. Thanks for any insight/advice that you can provide!
 
I assume you have a sand filter with glass media. Around here glass media is not recommended. If you can change it to regular sand this will help a lot and you can even add DE to the sand filter to make it filter finer stuff. Having said that, most of the problems with a dirty pool is always algae. How are you testing? Do you have a proper test kit? Test Kits Compared. Are you keeping FC levels according to FC/CYA Levels. You can also read up on ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry so you can understand how TFP manages your pool water. Also fill in your signature with your pool specs and equipment, similar to mine.
 
Welcome to the forum:wave:

To add to Oly's post.....filters work. Can you actually see this stuff coming back into the pool via returns? If so, your filters are plugged and need to be cleaned.

More often than not, what you may have is a chemistry issue and not filtration problems. In other words, you have active algae in your pool, the chlorine kills SOME of it, and it settles to the pool floor. That situation is VERY VERY common and the solution is a SLAM of your pool.
 
Flying Tivo said:
I assume you have a sand filter with glass media. Around here glass media is not recommended. If you can change it to regular sand this will help a lot and you can even add DE to the sand filter to make it filter finer stuff. Having said that, most of the problems with a dirty pool is always algae. How are you testing? Do you have a proper test kit? Test Kits Compared. Are you keeping FC levels according to FC/CYA Levels. You can also read up on ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry so you can understand how TFP manages your pool water. Also fill in your signature with your pool specs and equipment, similar to mine.
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Hi Flying Tivo... the filter originally had sand in it. The local pool store recommended glass (2 different sizes), and replaced the sand when they were replacing the laterals. I'm using test strips, and originally had to do a number of shocks to kill off the algae I inherited when I moved in. I generally use liquid chlorine to keep the chlorine level in the "ideal" area on the strip, and so far the pH and alkalinity are staying stable (no rainwater helps, I'm sure). As I think I mentioned originally, when I put the vacuum over some areas, I see cloudiness flying out of the exhaust of the vacuum. I don't see this everywhere, just on the finest stuff. It doesn't seem to get sucked up by the pool filter (I think the previous owner blocked off the bottom drain). So, I'm really trying to figure out how to get it out of the pool. Thus my question as to whether flocculant would make the silt clump up, and if it'd be a problem for my vacuum.
 
duraleigh said:
Welcome to the forum:wave:

To add to Oly's post.....filters work. Can you actually see this stuff coming back into the pool via returns? If so, your filters are plugged and need to be cleaned.

More often than not, what you may have is a chemistry issue and not filtration problems. In other words, you have active algae in your pool, the chlorine kills SOME of it, and it settles to the pool floor. That situation is VERY VERY common and the solution is a SLAM of your pool.
Click to expand...
Hi Duraleigh,

I'm actually seeing the cloudiness poof right out of the vacuum's exhaust - the PoolBlaster is like a waterproof dustbuster, so it doesn't hook into the skimmer etc. When I did use the hose and vacuum on the skimmer, even after backwashing a few minutes after vacuuming, I'd later see a "path" of the silt beyond the 2 return lines. That's what made me think "hey, how about a Poolblaster, and just avoid the whole filter". And don't get me wrong - the Poolblaster is great on the larger particles.
 
So, if you are blowing dirt back into the pool, your filter needs to be cleaned. Same issue with the poolblaster. Both pieces of equipment are capable of catching and holding visible debris, so it would seem they both must be filled to overflowing or have some damage that is letting dirt through.

Flocculant sometimes helps but often hurts. Your real issue is why the poolblaster and your pool filter are returning visible debris to the pool and a flocculant, even if it works this time, doesn't solve your problem.
 
duraleigh said:
So, if you are blowing dirt back into the pool, your filter needs to be cleaned. Same issue with the poolblaster. Both pieces of equipment are capable of catching and holding visible debris, so it would seem they both must be filled to overflowing or have some damage that is letting dirt through.

Flocculant sometimes helps but often hurts. Your real issue is why the poolblaster and your pool filter are returning visible debris to the pool and a flocculant, even if it works this time, doesn't solve your problem.
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Thanks for such a fast response, Duraleigh. I'm starting with a clean bag (actually 2, layered - 1 regular, 1 silt) on the PoolBlaster, which is why I think that the debris is just too fine. And I agree with you, flocculant is nor something that I'd normally want to mess with, because of the possibility of it getting into the filter and messing it up. Last evening, for a test, I decided to put a silt bag onto each of the return lines. They are clean, but there's the pattern of debris along the bottom still, mostly along the wrinkles or seams of the liner, plus the "spray pattern" from the return lines. Would it make sense to try another round of clarifier in a few days, and then vacuum and backwash? The water appears quite clear - it's very easy to see the lines of sediment on the bottom, or the "poofing" of the sediment out of the exhaust, so I don't know if the clarifier would help get the current silt to coagulate, or if it only particulates it out of cloudy water.
 
so I don't know if the clarifier would help get the current silt to coagulate, or if it only particulates it out of cloudy water
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But then what will you do next time? I hear you about the debris coming from the poolblaster and returns but what you are describing sounds exactly like dead algae that is settling on your floor and has almost nothing to do with filtration. Why don't you try an OCLT and decide once and for all there is no live algae in your pool. you could do the first half of that test tonight. Do you have an FAS/DPD chlorine test? (it's in the K-2006 or TF-100 kit.)
 

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duraleigh said:
But then what will you do next time? I hear you about the debris coming from the poolblaster and returns but what you are describing sounds exactly like dead algae that is settling on your floor and has almost nothing to do with filtration. Why don't you try an OCLT and decide once and for all there is no live algae in your pool. you could do the first half of that test tonight. Do you have an FAS/DPD chlorine test? (it's in the K-2006 or TF-100 kit.)
Click to expand...
I've been using test strips; guess I'll need to order one of the kits you're talking about. But let's say that either I only have dead algae now, or as a result of SLAM I end up with dead algae - I'm still left with the question of how to get it out of the pool. And I do appreciate all of this help and knowledge, I hope I'm not coming off as argumentative. Just trying to find the way to a healthy, easily-maintained pool. I did just run a test strip, and free chlorine color is between 2 and 3. What I've been trying to do since I first got the pool clear is to keep the chlorine between 2 and 4 as well as the other measurements being in the "ideal" zone, which I think is the LAM of SLAM (but perhaps I didn't send the FC up high enough initially during the S of SLAM, I was using the bag recommendations and going off of test strips instead of the fancier kit). Is having the FC up so high (target of 10-12 for my circumstances) in a vinyl lined pool likely to bleach it out or cause other problems? I also worry that it'd take a long time for the FC to come down in an indoor pool. Thanks again, Duraleigh.
 
You said it clearly, its not a SLAM what you did. Remember that live algae cant be filter by any filter. You need a proper slam and for that you need the proper test kit. After the algae is dead then it can be filtered.
 
I'm still left with the question of how to get it out of the pool.
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What I think may be happening is you are getting it out of the pool but it reoccurs daily as SOME algae dies but not all of it. I know you are saying the source is your filter but I believe the source may be the live algae still in your pool (as does flying Tivo.)

For us to help fix your pool, we are going to need test results from a TF-100 or K-2006C (most prefer the TF-100). Please read "The "ABC's of Pool Water Chemistry" up in Pool School and decide if you want to follow what we teach.

Please put "indoor pool" in your sig.
 
Hunter, what you're experiencing now I've seen a short while ago by one of my pools. The guy swore the OCLT was complete and that's a filter issue. The proof was in the water exactly what you have going on now. If you don't eradicate it to the end it will revisit the pool in short order. Anxious to call the slam complete does people like you in. The advice here in previous posts is spot on.
 
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