Help!!! Yikes!

tessv

Gold Supporter
Bronze Supporter
Jul 3, 2015
161
Auburn, KS
You have an autocover. So, the water should not have been that low in the first place.

With a solid cover, the water should be clean and clear when you open if it was closed correctly.
Yeah, we’re all scratching our heads because to the best of our knowledge we DID follow TFP protocols... water at shock level for 3 days ahead of close with FC holding... CYA was between 40-50... We fought high TA all season, but I believe it was 90ish at close... (again, unless something was put in that we didn’t see)... we closed late... opening early is the one we may not have gotten right because of all the rain and cool weather this spring... I would be surprised if our water is much above 60... yet clearly something went terribly wrong...

Autocover is great, but slightly bows at the lip...creating that little gap... we keep two sump pumps on it during winter and rains to try to limit bowing from water weight...

As for the autocover and water depth at close—pool is drained just below the returns... you’re saying that is not necessary for winter?
 

tessv

Gold Supporter
Bronze Supporter
Jul 3, 2015
161
Auburn, KS
My understanding is pool plaster needs to be hydrated to cure properly. I would not want to let new plaster on the ledge sit exposed to freeze and thaw cycles over the winter. If you go down that path let's disucss it more and seek input from @onBalance
Significant other is saying she may have misunderstood that part... 😊
 

JamesW

TFP Expert
Mar 2, 2011
16,598
What autocover do you have?

If you check the installation and operations manual, it will probably say that the water level needs to be maintained at all times.

The cover needs the support of the water in the pool when there is any load from rain or snow.

The only reason to drop the water below the tile is if you get heavy ice on the water surface that can stress the tile.

If you feel that it's necessary to go below the tile for ice protection, just drop to the bottom of the tile and not lower.

Also, what plaster did you get? The ledge looks odd.
 

tessv

Gold Supporter
Bronze Supporter
Jul 3, 2015
161
Auburn, KS
Hi, everyone!!! Got the pump up and running and decided to try to break this Ammonia, knowing we’re in for a ride...

Started the process yesterday and am in the middle now...
*note: when the guys hooked everything up, they added 3gallons of MA before we could stop them... they had mixed up 3lbs of 78% cal-hypo, but we caught it just in time, so that didn’t go into the pool...

I’ll post progress pics next, if that’s interesting to anyone... pretty incredible to see the changes...

Our biggest concern is going to be this pH dropping... (testing that now with the pH009, since it’s gone so low)

Numbers thus far:
==========================================
The Mullett
------------------------------------------
Build Type: Plaster
Volume: 38500 gallons
------------------------------------------
Latest Test Result Summary:
FC: 1.0 (11 minutes ago)
CC: 3.0 (46 minutes ago)
pH: 5.4 (46 minutes ago)
TA: 150 (46 minutes ago)
CH: 500 (22 hours ago)
CYA: 0 (22 hours ago)
SALT: 4 (7 months ago)
TEMPERATURE: 68° (46 minutes ago)
CSI: -1.00 (11 minutes ago)
==========================================
------------------------------------------
Chemical Addition 05-23-2019 @ 01:06 PM
------------------------------------------
+ 4 Gallons of Bleach

------------------------------------------
Test Results 05-23-2019 @ 01:05 PM
------------------------------------------
Free Chlorine: 1.0
CSI: -1.00

------------------------------------------
Chemical Addition 05-23-2019 @ 12:37 PM
------------------------------------------
+ 4 Gallons of Bleach

------------------------------------------
Test Results 05-23-2019 @ 12:31 PM
------------------------------------------
Free Chlorine: 1.5
Combined Chlorine: 3.0
pH: 5.4
Total Alkalinity: 150
Temperature: 68°F
CSI: -1.00

------------------------------------------
Test Results 05-22-2019 @ 06:27 PM
------------------------------------------
Free Chlorine: 5.0
Combined Chlorine: 17.0
CSI: -0.34

------------------------------------------
Chemical Addition 05-22-2019 @ 06:04 PM
------------------------------------------
+ 5 Gallons of Bleach

------------------------------------------
Test Results 05-22-2019 @ 05:54 PM
------------------------------------------
Free Chlorine: 3.0
Combined Chlorine: 16.0
CSI: -0.34

------------------------------------------
Chemical Addition 05-22-2019 @ 05:28 PM
------------------------------------------
+ 4 Gallons of Bleach

------------------------------------------
Test Results 05-22-2019 @ 05:19 PM
------------------------------------------
Free Chlorine: 1.5
Combined Chlorine: 15.0
CSI: -0.34

------------------------------------------
Chemical Addition 05-22-2019 @ 04:58 PM
------------------------------------------
+ 4 Gallons of Bleach

------------------------------------------
Test Results 05-22-2019 @ 04:48 PM
------------------------------------------
Free Chlorine: 2.0
Combined Chlorine: 9.0
CSI: -0.34

------------------------------------------
Chemical Addition 05-22-2019 @ 04:24 PM
------------------------------------------
+ 6 Gallons of Bleach

------------------------------------------
Test Results 05-22-2019 @ 04:23 PM
------------------------------------------
Free Chlorine: 1.0
CSI: -0.34

------------------------------------------
Chemical Addition 05-22-2019 @ 04:11 PM
------------------------------------------
+ 6 Gallons of Bleach

------------------------------------------
Maintenance 05-22-2019 @ 02:46 PM
------------------------------------------
Backwashed, Brushed
Pressure: 22

------------------------------------------
Test Results 05-22-2019 @ 02:27 PM
------------------------------------------
Free Chlorine: 0.0
Combined Chlorine: 0.0
pH: 6.8
Total Alkalinity: 180
Calcium Hardness: 500
CYA: 0
Temperature: 64°F
CSI: -0.34
 

kimkats

Mod Squad
LifeTime Supporter
Jul 10, 2012
41,531
Tallahassee, FL
To help get the pH up you can turn your returns up so they roll the water real good. Turn on ALL of your water movers as well.

We LOVE pics of this kind of thing so please do share them!!!

Kim:kim:
 

JoyfulNoise

TFP Expert
Platinum Supporter
May 23, 2015
15,894
Tucson, AZ
If your pH is truly that low you need to correct it immediately. pH below 6 is very acidic and can damage your pool’s plaster. I would add enough borax to raise the pH by +0.4 units at a time and keep adding batches of borax until the pH gets above 7.0. You need to add the borax and then let the pumps mix it for 30mins, then retest pH. Borax will raise pH without increasing TA too much.

Oops, I see the pH has come up on its own. I was only reading the first result. The pH needs to be above 7.0 or else you risk plaster damage. Keep working on that.
 

tessv

Gold Supporter
Bronze Supporter
Jul 3, 2015
161
Auburn, KS
After the second 6 gallon add... lots of big chunks of really slimy bio something started floating around... color changed notably from black...9CF4064A-0917-4F30-AB3D-F0E62092A426.jpeg3C7B8159-B1D1-41A4-982C-B90BEB5C77D8.jpegE4940F8A-B5DB-4A8F-B65F-40A4FBEB8595.jpeg
 

tessv

Gold Supporter
Bronze Supporter
Jul 3, 2015
161
Auburn, KS
56C1EA19-4E4C-4F6C-9FDA-B6F9D29C4783.jpegThen we switched to 4 gallon adds... started to see some foaming... at this point, there was a strong scent of chlorine mixed with ammonia...
 

tessv

Gold Supporter
Bronze Supporter
Jul 3, 2015
161
Auburn, KS
If your pH is truly that low you need to correct it immediately. pH below 6 is very acidic and can damage your pool’s plaster. I would add enough borax to raise the pH by +0.4 units at a time and keep adding batches of borax until the pH gets above 7.0. You need to add the borax and then let the pumps mix it for 30mins, then retest pH. Borax will raise pH without increasing TA too much.

Oops, I see the pH has come up on its own. I was only reading the first result. The pH needs to be above 7.0 or else you risk plaster damage. Keep working on that.
No, you’re correct @JoyfulNoise!!! It IS that low—that was the most recent reading when I posted—5.4 by the pH pen... (right after calibration) just checked again and it’s reading 7.2, which I think is inaccurate based on the chemistry you guys explained...

We’re ready with Borax...

Can we continue the ammonia protocol while adjusting pH?
 

mknauss

Mod Squad
TFP Expert
Bronze Supporter
May 3, 2014
22,449
Laughlin, NV
The pen pH should not be effected by the FC. The ammonia elimination process increases your pH if I remember right -- Matt would know the chemistry better than I -----

I do not see why adding borax would bother. But hold off if your pH pen is showing higher pH. Add if FC under 10, your drop test should work.
 

tessv

Gold Supporter
Bronze Supporter
Jul 3, 2015
161
Auburn, KS
And to just be super clear @JoyfulNoise—that should take 38lbs of Borax...

We’ve never had to raise pH...

This means we’re going to add these things—and introducing Borates???
092B3422-044A-4BAC-83D2-2B5F34D7078B.png
 

mknauss

Mod Squad
TFP Expert
Bronze Supporter
May 3, 2014
22,449
Laughlin, NV
Big pH changes in PoolMath are not very accurate. See the warning.

IF you need to raise your pH, do it in very small increments.