Help needed - Pump is bad and considering automation options

[Travis Pierce]

My pump is dying, and based on some preliminary reading, it seems like I may want to consider future automation in this decision. I don't have a spa or water features, so my needs are pretty basic. I was originally going to purchase the Pentair SuperFlo VSF since it would be a direct replacement for my existing pump and planned to explore automation options later, but I read that particular pump won't work with all of Pentair's automation systems. I then saw in another post that the IntelliFlo3 could support some automation with a relay board and thought that maybe that might be a less expensive route than a new pump + separate automation system.

Automation wishlist:

• turn pump on/off and adjust settings
• Turn heater on/of (ideally adjust settings but not critical)
• SWG turn on only when pump is running

Current Wiring:
Breaker --> Intermatic 24hr timer --> pump, SWG, and heater are all on the same timer and includes a fireman switch for the heater.

Current Equipment:

• 20k gal pool (no spa or water features)
• Pool light is connected to separate smart switch so I don't need this to integrate with the pool automation.
• SuperFlo 1hp single speed pump (loud whining started yesterday and probably need to replace (it's 8-9 years old)
• Pentair Tagelus 60d sand filter
• PureChlor SWG
• Rheem M406A gas heater
• Polaris Robotic cleaner

Questions:

• Can what I'm looking to accomplish be handled with the IntelliFlo3?
• Is it better to include the automation in the pump or separate it?
• Is there an ideal way to accomplish this?

Thank you in advance for any help!

 

[ajw22]

The Intelliflo3 relay board will not do heater control.

The Pentair IntelliConnect with the latest firmware can control a Superflow VST pump and do heater control and control the power to a SWG. You need to install the optional water temperature sensor for heater control.

Pentair Automation Systems - Further Reading

www.troublefreepool.com

 

[Travis Pierce]

@ajw22 Thank you for your response! Do you feel the SuperFlo VST is a solid pump, or would you recommend a different model?

I noticed that the SuperFlo VST mentions "Note: IntelliConnect Control and Monitoring Systems can NOT externally control this pump via RS485" IS this still accurate?

 

[ajw22]

@ajw22 Thank you for your response! Do you feel the SuperFlo VST is a solid pump, or would you recommend a different model?

I prefer the 3HP Intelliflo3 pump if cost is not an issue. The Intelliflo3 will move more water at lower electrical consumption then the Superflo VST.

The Superflow VST is a solid pump but not as powerful or energy efficient.

Is your Superflo pump connected to 120V or 240V?

I noticed that the SuperFlo VST mentions "Note: IntelliConnect Control and Monitoring Systems can NOT externally control this pump via RS485" IS this still accurate?

Pentair changed the IntelliConnect firmware in late 2023 to make it compatible with SuperFlo VST, SuperMAX VS, and WhisperFlo VST pumps manufactured after 10/15/20. 1.5.2.5 was the most recent IntelliConnect software as of May 2024. Pentair Support can push updated firmware to the Intelliconnect connected to the internet.

 

[Travis Pierce]

I prefer the 3HP Intelliflo3 pump if cost is not an issue. The Intelliflo3 will move more water at lower electrical consumption then the Superflo VST.

The Superflow VST is a solid pump but not as powerful or energy efficient.

Is your Superflo pump connected to 120V or 240V?



Pentair changed the IntelliConnect firmware in late 2023 to make it compatible with SuperFlo VST, SuperMAX VS, and WhisperFlo VST pumps manufactured after 10/15/20. 1.5.2.5 was the most recent IntelliConnect software as of May 2024. Pentair Support can push updated firmware to the Intelliconnect connected to the internet.

@ajw22 I sincerely appreciate your help here! I'd prefer to get whatever is the preferred option now rather than regretting it later.

I haven't tested the voltage at my current SuperFlo, so I don't know if it's getting the full 240V, but it's connected to two breakers, so it should be pretty close.

 

[ajw22]

Here is a review from someone who has the Intelliflo3 and IntelliConnect...

IntelliConnect with IntelliFlo3 Pump and Heater

I installed an IntelliFlo3 pump last year and have it setup in the Pentair Home app. The pump has been working great standalone, but I wanted the ability to control the heater remotely. I've purchased an IntelliConnect controller that I have powered up, but not installed yet. In reading the...

www.troublefreepool.com

 

[Travis Pierce]

@ajw22 Thanks for sharing that review. Sounds like it would work, but might not be the smoothest experience.

Do you think I’ll have any issue with fitting the larger 3hp pump in the space available?

Looks like they have a few models of the Intelliflo3. Do you have any recommendations on the specific model I should get, or places I can purchase one at a fair price?

 

[Travis Pierce]

@ajw22 It appears I can't buy the Intelliflo3 online, so I'm going to call a few local places tomorrow. A person at epoolsupply.com mentioned that an IntelliFloXF VSF Variable Speed and Flow Pump (022056) might also be an option. What are your thoughts on that model combined with IntelliConnect to handle the automation?

 

[ajw22]

@ajw22 It appears I can't buy the Intelliflo3 online, so I'm going to call a few local places tomorrow. A person at epoolsupply.com mentioned that an IntelliFloXF VSF Variable Speed and Flow Pump (022056) might also be an option. What are your thoughts on that model combined with IntelliConnect to handle the automation?

It should work fine.

 

[Travis Pierce]

Thanks for the help @ajw22

 

[Travis Pierce]

@ajw22 I just realized that my underground plumbing is 1.5" and only have 2" at the pump equipment. With that being the case, does it still make sense to upgrade to the 3hp motor? I like the idea of avoiding plumbing changes with the SuperFlo VS, but it's worth the change if getting a big improvement on efficiency.

 

[Travis Pierce]

Good afternoon! My 8-year-old Pentair Superflo 1hp is dying and needs to be replaced with a VSP. I have 1.5" underground plumbing for 1 supply & 3 returns with 2" between the equipment (Pump, filter, heater).

Current Pump Options:

• Superflo VS (1.5hp)
  • This is the easiest path, because I don’t have to change any plumbing.
• Intelliflo3 (3hp)
  • I’m having a hard time finding this one online and don’t know if the smart capabilities are no longer needed if I add Intelliconnect. I'd need to modify the plumbing for this option.
• IntellifloXF (3hp)
  • On-sale for $1,600 at epoolsupply.com. I'd need to modify the plumbing for this option.

@ajw22 was an immense help in another thread and referenced he prefers the Intelliflo3 typically so was going to go that route, but having a challenge sourcing so looking at other options. I’ve read that the 3hp VSPs are more efficient running at low RPM, but I'm not sure how much more efficient and if it will actually add up to real-world $ savings. I haven't found a good way to quantify this. I currently run my pool for 10 hrs per day, but thought about moving to 24/7 at a lower speed with a VSP.

What’s the recommendation from those with real experience in this area?

Pool info:

• ~20-23k gallons (no spa or water features)
• 1.5" plumbing underground
  • 1 supply line (2 floor drains connected to my 1 skimmer and back to pump)
  • 3 returns (1 of 3 is only 3/4" - I believe it was for the original cleaner)
• 2" plumbing between equipment (pump, filter, heater)
• Pentair Tagelus 60D sand filter
• SWG
• Rheem Heater
• Automation: None currently, but looking to add the Intelliconnect so that I can power my SWG and connect with my heater). The Superflo VS now supports connectivity via RS-485 with their most recent firmware.

 

[ajw22]

You still get the energy efficiency savings of having a 3HP pump do the work.

You have to weigh those long term savings against the cost and hassle of the one time plumbing change.

 

[Jetjohn6]

You can probably still buy the intelliflo3 if you call a place like epoolsupply. It's no longer an online purchase if you do it over the phone. I bought a pentair pump from epoolsupply last year by doing this.

 

[Travis Pierce]

You can probably still buy the intelliflo3 if you call a place like epoolsupply. It's no longer an online purchase if you do it over the phone. I bought a pentair pump from epoolsupply last year by doing this.

Thanks for the recommendation @Jetjohn6, I'll give this a try!

 

[Travis Pierce]

You still get the energy efficiency savings of having a 3HP pump do the work.

You have to weigh those long term savings against the cost and hassle of the one time plumbing change.

Thanks @ajw22 for your patience with me as I'm going through this. I've been trying to find data on the real-world efficiency gains so that I can try to weigh the difference, but struggling to find it. I used the Pentair calculator, but it's showing all the pumps at about the same savings (89-90%) and seems to be basing it on running it at the same RPM, and it doesn't give an option to compare it to running longer at a lower RPM. My power bills this time of year are outrageous, but I can't tell how much is attributed to my pool pump.

Any idea what the difference in efficiency actually equates to in $?

 

[ajw22]

What is your fully loaded cost/KWH on your electrical bill?

What are the amps rating on your pump motor data plate?

How many hours per day do you run your pump now?

 

[Travis Pierce]

@ajw22 Seriously, thank you for the patience.

• My cost on my most recent bill $1,135 / 5,096kwh used = $.2227 p/kwh
• Amp ratings on plate: Max Amps SF 6.2-6.6/13.2
• Current hours p/day: 10

In the future I'd like to run it based on the recommended run time for efficiency, ease of maintenance, etc. I've seen people on here recommending 24/7 @ 12-1500 RPM's, but not sure what's the best runtime.

It seems that moving to a VS pump is going save considerably compared to my current single speed, so I'm trying to quantify the incremental difference between the Superflo VS and the Intelliflo VS.

 

[ajw22]

Your current pumps costs .33/hour at low and .66/hour at high speed.

Intelliflow3 will cost about .08/hour less to run then the Superflo VS for the same flow rate.

 

[Travis Pierce]

@ajw22 THANK YOU! That helps immensely. I've put some calls out today and should hear back from them tomorrow. I'll most likely go ahead and try to get the Intelliconnect at the same time.