Help needed - Pool pad equipment dry fit - What would you change?

[wgipe]

Well the day is finally here! The contractors started laying everything out, so things are starting to get real. I took some time today to unbox all of my equipment and dry fit everything together just so I could get an idea of how best to lay things out. I've attached pictures of my first attempt, and would love to have your critique. I am a couple of unions short, and would need to straighten things up with the final install - this is just to get things laid out so that I can pour the pad to the pool house (where the equipment will be) such that the returns and suction lines are coming up through gravel and not concrete.

Critique away!

Thanks in advance,

Wes

 

[ajw22]

I would position the pump to the right of the filter, not in front of it. You need room to work on the filter without stepping over the pump. Pulling off the lid, removing the cartridges, and things can be wet and you don't want slobbering water all over the pump. Move the pump tot he side and give yourself plenty of room to work around the filter.

Your pump suction makes a 180 degree turn - two 90's. That is inefficient for the water flow. Connect the 2 lines to a T and connect the T straight into the pump.

Why do you have a CV before the suction input to the pump?

 

[Texas Splash]

Looks pretty good. I'm assuming the vertical segment is for a salt generator? Have you considered a valve after the pump-before the filter so that with a cart filter, you would have the option to pump water directly to waste? Some like that option. Or at least a hose bib.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Wes,


It should be illegal to install a $1,200 pump without $25 pump unions...

They look like this.. Amazon.com: 2 PACK -CMP Hi-Temp Union 2" inch 2MIP x 2" inch PVC Whisperflo & Intelliflo - 2 PACK: Garden & Outdoor

Why do you have a check valve in front of the pump??? I would either move the check valve, or add a 2-way valve between the output of the pump and the input to the filter.. This will allow you to open the pump lid without having the water drain out of your filter.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[wgipe]

I would position the pump to the right of the filter, not in front of it. You need room to work on the filter without stepping over the pump. Pulling off the lid, removing the cartridges, and things can be wet and you don't want slobbering water all over the pump. Move the pump tot he side and give yourself plenty of room to work around the filter.

Thanks - That seems obvious now that you say it.

Your pump suction makes a 180 degree turn - two 90's. That is inefficient for the water flow. Connect the 2 lines to a T and connect the T straight into the pump.

Perfect - I didn't love that either, so that would fix it.

Why do you have a CV before the suction input to the pump?

That actually a flow meter. It has a check valve in it, but I don't really need one there - it's just where it fit the nicest given the layout I had. I can move it also.

Thanks for your help! Any other comments welcome - this is my first go at this, and I'd like to do it right the first time.

Thanks!

Wes

 

[wgipe]

I'm assuming the vertical segment is for a salt generator?

Yes - that's the dummy cell in there. I'll replace it with the cell once everything's glued up.

Have you considered a valve after the pump-before the filter so that with a cart filter, you would have the option to pump water directly to waste? Some like that option. Or at least a hose bib.

That's what the tee off the returns on the three way valve was meant for - should it be before the filter for some reason?

Thanks!

Wes

 

[wgipe]

It should be illegal to install a $1,200 pump without $25 pump unions...

Brilliant. It seemed to me like there ought to be something like that out there. Just ordered a pair.

Why do you have a check valve in front of the pump??? I would either move the check valve, or add a 2-way valve between the output of the pump and the input to the filter.. This will allow you to open the pump lid without having the water drain out of your filter.

That's actually in there just for the flow meter so I can fine tune the pump speeds. Makes perfect sense to move it to the output of the pump, before the filter. Thank you!

Wes

 

[ajw22]

I think positioning the flow meter between your SWG and returns gives a better measurement of the flow to the pool.

 

[wgipe]

@Jimrahbe - is this better? Moved the flow meter to after the pump, rerouted the suction lines.

 

[Texas Splash]

That's what the tee off the returns on the three way valve was meant for - should it be before the filter for some reason?

Not necessarily. Your call. You can pump water out quickly from the return T. I have something similar when I need to drain water quickly. But if you ever needed to vacuum junk to waste, you would want it directly after the pump before the filter (same function as a multiport valve-WASTE). Not a huge issue though. Some do it, most do not.

 

[wgipe]

But if you ever needed to vacuum junk to waste

Great point - makes a ton of sense. May as well change it while I can so I have the option.

 

[Jimrahbe]

is this better? Moved the flow meter to after the pump, rerouted the suction lines.

How would you ever get the pump's control panel open? You will need to be able to see the pump's display more often than you think..

Also... if you add pump unions, then there would be zero need for the two "Home Depot unions on either side of the check valve or Jandy valve. You could take the whole pipe out, as you would have a unions at both ends..

Jim R.

 

[wgipe]

How would you ever get the pump's control panel open?

Good grief. Good point. Would it be better to extend the line up and come back down at the filter, or pull the pump forward a bit? Either way adds a 90. Is there some other better way I'm missing? Sorry to be a dunce.

Also... if you add pump unions, then there would be zero need for the two "Home Depot unions on either side of the check valve or Jandy valve. You could take the whole pipe out, as you would have a unions at both ends..

For sure. I'll do just that.

-Wes

 

[Jimrahbe]

Wes,

You could add fifty 90's to your plumbing and not make much of a difference in actual operation..

OK, maybe not 50 of them, but several before there would be any problems.

Keep in mind that the whole point of having a VS pump, and a large cartridge filter, is that you will be running at a low RPM most of the time. With little back pressure from the filter any 90's will not get in the way.

I would plumb for accessibility of the equipment. You need to be able get to the pump to clean the pump basket, and to the filter to clean the cartridges, and to the SWCG so it can be cleaned from time to time.. Check out the filter's drain plug.. I have to become a human pretzel in order to get to my drain plug.. Not ideal. I would not spend 10 minutes trying to worry about water flow dynamics, etc.. The layout should be for ease of maintenance..

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[wgipe]

Wes,

You could add fifty 90's to your plumbing and not make much of a difference in actual operation..

OK, maybe not 50 of them, but several before there would be any problems.

Keep in mind that the whole point of having a VS pump, and a large cartridge filter, is that you will be running at a low RPM most of the time. With little back pressure from the filter any 90's will not get in the way.

I would plumb for accessibility of the equipment. You need to be able get to the pump to clean the pump basket, and to the filter to clean the cartridges, and to the SWCG so it can be cleaned from time to time.. Check out the filter's drain plug.. I have to become a human pretzel in order to get to my drain plug.. Not ideal. I would not spend 10 minutes trying to worry about water flow dynamics, etc.. The layout should be for ease of maintenance..

Thanks,

Jim R.

Super helpful, Jim. Thank you. I’m overthinking it...again (I seem to have a PhD in OCD). I’ll rearrange things a bit per your advice and try again!

Thanks to everyone for all the great tips - I hope to be able to pay it forward someday when all of this stuff finally makes sense to me.

-Wes

 

[wgipe]

Okey done - third time’s the charm?

- Rearranged the pump/suction lines for better pump access.
- swapped the flow meter and check valve (gives flow reading right before SWCG, and also serves as a check valve, and the standard check valve prevents back flow into the pump during maintenance)
- Moved drain valve ahead of filter per comment above
- took out some unnecessary unions

Just need one more valve for the third return, which comes tomorrow.

Please pick it apart - if there are ways to fine tune, now’s the time!

Thanks!

Wes

 

[ajw22]

- swapped the flow meter and check valve (gives flow reading right before SWCG, and also serves as a check valve, and the standard check valve prevents back flow into the pump during maintenance)

If your heater bypass is not 100% closed your flow meter will not give you to the flow to the pool. It will only give you the flow through the heater as it is placed. There are reasons you may not want full water flow through the heater.

I would place the flow meter between the SWG and the returns.

 

[Newdude]

But if you ever needed to vacuum junk to waste

Great point - makes a ton of sense. May as well change it while I can so I have the option.

I used this many many times. I would often extend vacuum and filter cleaning frequency by sweeping everything to one corner and then vac-ing to waste. It wasn’t perfect but it took 5 min to sweep, 5 min to suck it out and I didn’t need a full hour long vac for another week while none of the crud went into the filter.

@Jimrahbe will say it’s all irrelevant with a robot but dang it I LIKE my rotary phone !!

 

[wgipe]

If your heater bypass is not 100% closed your flow meter will not give you to the flow to the pool. It will only give you the flow through the heater as it is placed. There are reasons you may not want full water flow through the heater.

I would place the flow meter between the SWG and the returns.

View attachment 168346

I now see why. Thanks for your patience. I can easily move that.

 

[wgipe]

Okay..... Pool house is up, and I've got the equipment pad laid out. The only thing holding it together right now is a bit of Dawn dish soap so that I could get all of the fittings completely inserted for measurement. I think I'm ready to plumb it up, but I thought I'd get one last look from you guys just in case you find something I missed. Any/all suggestions welcome. This is my first time doing this, and I want to make sure it's right. Note that not all of the controls and electrical are complete - mostly concerned with the plumbing at this point. Thanks!!