G'day from Sydney Australia and would love your opinion!

lukeyluke

Bronze Supporter
Jan 8, 2019
14
Australia
#1
Hi all

My name's Luke, I'm from Sydney Australia and yes it has been around ~42c (108F) for a couple of days, not fun :)

I'm a relatively new pool owner (round 12 months), have been riding the pool shop merry go round and finally decided to really understand my pool. That's where TFP came in, I've learnt a tonne in the last couple of weeks and appreciate the threads and advice here. I bought a proper test kit from Clear Choice Lab

https://clearchoicelabs.com.au/shopping/total-pool-water-testing-kit-salt-water/

I've been balancing my pool for the last couple of weeks trying to get it to a good equilibrium, and reduce my reliance on adding acid constantly

Here's my latest numbers, would love your input if I should adjust anything or if I'm on the right track

FC: 5
CC: 0 - 0.5 (hard to tell, when testing)
PH: 7.2
TA: 90
CYA: 60
CH: 150
Salt: 5000 (recommended by SWCG manufacturer)

My pool is a 28000 litre fibreglass pool using a SWCG and cartridge filter, the water is clear.

A few questions

1) Do I need to be concerned with my CH numbers? I emailed my pool manufacturer (Leisure Pools) and they confirmed there is no calcium used in the gelcoat or filler. Would there be any benefit to me over time reducing the CH number a bit? Or does it not really matter?

2) My acid use has definitely slowed since I lowered my TA (used to be 175), but can I take TA a bit lower? Are there any repercussions for a lower TA?

3) I use a quat based algaecide, and top up weekly. Is this a good course of action?

4) When testing pool water I take a sample from mid way down the pool and at elbow depth. When should I take the sample, before, during or after the SWCG has been operating?

Any other advice / tips would be appreciated

Cheers - Luke
 
Last edited:

tim5055

Mod Squad
TFP Expert
LifeTime Supporter
May 11, 2014
10,096
Franklin, NC
#2
Welcome to the TFP pool! :handwave:


To answer your questions, don't worry about a CH of 150

Yes, you can take TA lower but not below 50/60 Generally the lower the TA the slower the rise in pH

If following our methods and maintaining a proper CYA/FC ratio there is no need for weekly additions of algecide.

It doesn't matter when you take your sample, just try to be consistent and do it the same way each time
 

Costas > DownUnder

Bronze Supporter
Dec 17, 2017
588
Adelaide | Australia
#3
Hi Luke,

I'm in Adelaide and I think you must be on the receiving end of the weather we had a few days ago... :)

You results look fairly good - If anything you might want to let your PH rise up a tad - Keep an eye on CSI levels as you don't want your CSI to be too negative (PH has a large impact on CSI).

Use the Pool Math Calc to have it calculate the CSI level for you.

Note I am running a fibreglass pool as well - I have my CH at 300 and my PH is running at 7.6 - Mainly to keep CSI levels in check.
 
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lukeyluke

lukeyluke

Bronze Supporter
Jan 8, 2019
14
Australia
#4
Hey Costas! Gees you guys have had your share of hot weather! Thanks for the reply

Im a little confused with CSI, particularly with a fibre glass pool with no calcium in the construction. My understanding is the water may be looking for calcium but without calcium in the pool construction it has no where to get it from. And hence does not matter. Leisure Pools recommend not adding calcium and largely just ignoring it... ?
 
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lukeyluke

lukeyluke

Bronze Supporter
Jan 8, 2019
14
Australia
#6
Leisure Pool have in BOLD type in their manual to keep pH between 7.2 and 7.4. Is there any issue running the pH a little higher than that? Thanks
 

aussieta

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
#7
if your pool is under warranty then follow their numbers
otherwise
higher ph doesn't rise as much and you will stop the rollercoaster ride
these are the tfp guidelines
https://www.troublefreepool.com/blog/2018/12/12/recommended-levels/
when your ta gets closer to 60 you will find the ph will stop rising as long as you dont try to keep it too low
leisure pools has ph up to 7.8 and also reccomend max fc of 5ppm with cya at 100ppm
http://media.icompendium.com/leisurep_pool-spa-care-guide.pdf
oh the more of that i read the more i want to scream,
 
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lukeyluke

lukeyluke

Bronze Supporter
Jan 8, 2019
14
Australia
#8
Hi all! Thanks for all the advice

Another quick questions, this time in regards to FC. I just tested the FC (the SWCG had been running for around 3.5 hours) and the FC was 6.5.
The day was very overcast, not a lot of sun.

The only thing is I have the Chlorinator turned down to 3 (there are 8 possible levels). I'm going to turn it down to 2 (out of 8). What's everyone's thoughts? Seems like it's running very low. I know the levels work because if I turn them up I get a significant increase in FC

Do you think an FC of 6.5 is too high, particularly when tested after the SWCG has been running for almost 3.5 hours?

I run the SWCG 4 hours in the morning and 4 hours in the afternoon / evening
 

aussieta

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
#9
i keep my fc around 6 with 70cya
i like the safety margin in case someone pees in the pool
or i dont get time to test during the week.

you could drop 1 hour of run time that would reduce daily output by 12%
dropping chlorinator from 3 to 2 would be 30% reduction and could be too much
if you know the specs on your swg you can calculate output
 

kimkats

Mod Squad
LifeTime Supporter
Jul 10, 2012
36,764
Tallahassee, FL
#10
The CSI balance, which includes CH, will help keep scaling from happening on the pool walls, even on a fiberglass pool, and on the SWG cell. Water temps also play a big part in the CSI. Go play with the pool math numbers and see how each thing changes the CSI. It is kind of fun!
 

Texas Splash

Mod Squad
TFP Expert
LifeTime Supporter
#11
In addition, while Leisure may say (for now) that CH isn't required, if something were to happen with your gelcoat they would be the first to say, "Did you follow our published recommendations?" Most manufactures are that way. For CH specifically, I wouldn't let it get crazy low. Not for fear of plaster erosion obviously, but because the water itself can become acidic and "might" result in an oxidation discoloring of sorts. Also, a low level of CH might help to prevent or minimize some types of staining. I think you're good at 150 as well.
 
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lukeyluke

lukeyluke

Bronze Supporter
Jan 8, 2019
14
Australia
#13
Still a bit confused about CSI

As mentioned above I have confirmed with my fibreglass pool manufacturer that there is no calcium in the gelcoat or filler, so not sure I need to be too concerned but wanted to double check.

Here's todays numbers

PH: 7.4
FC: 5
CC: 0-0.5
TA: 80
CH: 150
CYA: 60
TEMP: 25c

Leisure Pools suggest a CH of no more than 120 and PH of around 7.2-7.4 max

Should I be overly concerned with my CSI number of -0.82

Would love everyone's feedback

Cheers Luke
 

duraleigh

Admin
Mod Squad
TFP Expert
Platinum Supporter
LifeTime Supporter
In The Industry
Apr 1, 2007
31,394
Sebring, Florida
#14
Pools with high CH fill water (most all in the Southwest) have a use for it but the majority of pools do not. Unless your fill water is VERY high in CH (What is it?), then you have no need to worry about it

Your pool simply doesn't have the characteristics that would tend towards scale which is what csi calculates.

Staying within the TFP published guidelines is all you need. Calculating CSI may offer some reassurance but chasing a CSI number for a pool that doesn;'t have scaling tendencies is overkill.
 
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lukeyluke

lukeyluke

Bronze Supporter
Jan 8, 2019
14
Australia
#15
Thanks duraleigh

The fill water is very low in CH, 50ppm

Should I bump up my CH to 220 as per TFP guidelines or follow Leisure Pools (pool manufacturer) recommendation at no more than 120?

Cheers
 

yann

Well-known member
#18
Hi all! Thanks for all the advice

Another quick questions, this time in regards to FC. I just tested the FC (the SWCG had been running for around 3.5 hours) and the FC was 6.5.
The day was very overcast, not a lot of sun.

The only thing is I have the Chlorinator turned down to 3 (there are 8 possible levels). I'm going to turn it down to 2 (out of 8). What's everyone's thoughts? Seems like it's running very low. I know the levels work because if I turn them up I get a significant increase in FC

Do you think an FC of 6.5 is too high, particularly when tested after the SWCG has been running for almost 3.5 hours?

I run the SWCG 4 hours in the morning and 4 hours in the afternoon / evening
G'Day

Welcome to the forum

I cannot advise on fibreglass pools and what CH levels you should keep, but if your pool is still under warranty stick to their recommended levels.

I believe CSI levels should run your chemistry and as long as you keep your CSI at 0 or slightly negative, you should be fine. Use Pool Maths to play with numbers and find what chemical levels work best for you. pH is the parameter that has the biggest impact on CSI.
Get your pH and TA to stabilise at the "sweet spot" and work the rest of your chemicals (CH) accordingly.

When it comes to chlorination, SWG power (%) and pump run time work together. You want your pump to run enough hours every day to keep your pool clean from debris (skimmer) and algae (circulation, or turn over). Once you have established how many hours you need your pump to run, and your daily FC loss, then use this: SWG Run Time Calculator to set up the power (%) on your SWG

The Excel document is in imperial units so you'll have to convert your pool volume from litres to US gallons, and your SWG output from g/h to lbs/day.

The best way to calculate your daily FC loss is to test your FC at the same time every day. I do my testing around 6pm, once the sun is down and pool activity is over. This way you can accurately measure your FC and adjust your SWG output.
CCL kits are the best we can get here in Australia so good on you for choosing them.

As for when to run your pump, it's really up to you and what work best for you. If you are on Time of Day usage, you might want to run most of your pump time at night when it's cheaper. If you're on the same rate all day like me, I run my pump mostly during the day (about 80% run time) when the pool is in the sun and in use, the rest at night to get some circulation.

Best of luck, don't hesitate to reach out. Lots of experienced people here to help you get started and build up confidence maintaining your pool.
 

duraleigh

Admin
Mod Squad
TFP Expert
Platinum Supporter
LifeTime Supporter
In The Industry
Apr 1, 2007
31,394
Sebring, Florida
#19
I believe CSI levels should run your chemistry and as long as you keep your CSI at 0 or slightly negative, you should be fine.
There are thousands and thousands (maybe millions) of pools that are crystal clear, managed correctly and CSI has NEVER been calculated. NEVER.

TFP teaches that you test for 5 basic parameters (pH, FC. TA, CH, CYA) and if you stay within the guidelines published, your pool can, in the vast majority of circumstances, be managed impeccably.

CSI is not even a testable parameter......it is a calculation of the parameters for which you CAN test......and it is ONLY a test for the tendency of calcium precipitation....nothing else.

Placing mandatory importance on CSI is allowing the tail to wag the dog.
 

yann

Well-known member
#20
Ok fair enough, maybe I didn't express myself very well.

What I meant is you can use CSI to help you choose let's say your PH to counteract let's say a high CH level due to fill water CH levels. Lots of experienced TFP users recommend using CSI in that case.

I do not rely on CSI to balance my pool, but when I enter my results in pool math I do check that my CSI is slightly negative. And if out of range i see what I can do to rectify it.

Maybe I should have said it is an additional tool to confirm the pool is well balanced.