Expansion joint

Aquaman7

Well-known member
Sep 15, 2019
88
NNJ
I’m in the process of planning to build an in ground vinyl saltwater pool. The panels will be polymer. The backfill will be 3/4” clean crushed stone. The coping and the pool deck will be pavers. Do I have to put an expansion joint between the coping pavers and the deck pavers? If so, what kind of material would I use?

Thank you,
Joe
 

ajw22

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Jul 21, 2013
11,701
Northern NJ
I think an expansion joint is a good idea. @jimmythegreek thoughts?

Best flexible sealant for expansion joints is

 
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jimmythegreek

TFP Expert
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In The Industry
Aug 10, 2017
1,459
Morris Cnty NJ
I leave a fat joint when using pavers. I like to space a solid 1/4 joint behind coping which helps make the cuts look good and gives some room. I just polysand the whole thing after I grout the coping. Never had an issue the pavers dont move. We use minimum 12" of base material and geotextile fabric. Alot of clay soils here
 
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Aquaman7

Well-known member
Sep 15, 2019
88
NNJ
Thank you aj and Jim.

Jim, Do you fill the 1/4” joint behind the coping stone with polysand? or something like ay mentioned?

Do you use regular mortar for the side joints and under the coping stone?
 

jimmythegreek

TFP Expert
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Aug 10, 2017
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Morris Cnty NJ
I only use laticrete 254 thinset for coping. If you try to chip coping it breaks before the thinset its super strong. I do either 1/4" gap or 3/8" depends on pavers used but 3/8 is best for curved pools. I grout with a bag using good type S mortar and joint roller to finish. When mud sets up slick off back flush to the rear of coping. I then do the pavers with a matching gap of the joint behind coping and finish with polysand on whole thing. After a few months I go back and clean it all blow it off them seal the pavers. I only use penetrating sealers the coping is a pain to do but worth it
 
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Aquaman7

Well-known member
Sep 15, 2019
88
NNJ
Jimmy,

Have you ever had to remove the coping from a pool edge when Laticrete? Is it difficult? Reason being is I might make a form to make pavers and pool coping. If the product doesn’t look good after a few years I would like to know if the pool coping would be easy to remove. Will it damage the Top of the polymer pool wall?

Thank a lot Jimmy.
Joe
 

jimmythegreek

TFP Expert
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Aug 10, 2017
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Morris Cnty NJ
You dont adhere anything to the pool walls. When you so individual precast coping you form a small pad to stick to behind and under the wall cap

If I understand your post, you are saying you are going to form your own pavers and coping?
 

Aquaman7

Well-known member
Sep 15, 2019
88
NNJ
You dont adhere anything to the pool walls. When you so individual precast coping you form a small pad to stick to behind and under the wall cap

If I understand your post, you are saying you are going to form your own pavers and coping?
Yes. I going to cast a few pavers and coping. If they come out nice I will use it around the pool. I’m going to make it with “Rapid set cement all” brand cement.

How wide should the wall pad be? Too the end of the coping? I’m guessing the pad is going to go around the perimeter of the pool? The coping I will cast will be 6”Lx12”W.
 

jimmythegreek

TFP Expert
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In The Industry
Aug 10, 2017
1,459
Morris Cnty NJ
The pad would be inside edge of pool wall to just short of coping width in your case 10.5 " You want to be shy of the rear of coping and account for overhang. 5-6" thick and ideally it's one continuous pour. We drill thru the holes in panels where they connect and use rebar pieces to strengthen those spots. Need a copper bond wire jumper when you do the bond ring.
Not to sway you, but I wouldnt bother with the attempt to cast pavers or coping. You can never replicate the material used. The casting is very controlled with rubber forms and release agents and the concrete is very high strength like 6000+ psi and dry mixed then vibrated to form. It is SO much work to prep a proper base, then set and pour the coping base. You dont want to have to fudge every piece trying to make things level, and then when you install pavers and compact them they will crack. Its just not worth the effort. You can get decent quality stuff for cheap. Find a CST dealer near you and use their coping and pavers. The laticrete I referenced is 60 bucks a bag you will need several bags. CST coping is around 2 bucks a piece 2 pieces is a sqft. Average pool is 120 pieces coping. Just not worth the labor or effort to make stuff and then redo it or it fails. If I understand you ate planning to DIY this pool? If so I promise you by the time it comes to the decking you will be wondering what you got yourself into and sick of the pool build.
 
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bdavis466

TFP Expert
Platinum Supporter
Aug 4, 2014
5,215
San Clemente, CA
Yes. I going to cast a few pavers and coping. If they come out nice I will use it around the pool. I’m going to make it with “Rapid set cement all” brand cement.

How wide should the wall pad be? Too the end of the coping? I’m guessing the pad is going to go around the perimeter of the pool? The coping I will cast will be 6”Lx12”W.
Have you priced that out? RapidSet isn't cheap either. When you also factor in your time you will have very expensive pavers that may not perform as less expensive alternatives.
 
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Aquaman7

Well-known member
Sep 15, 2019
88
NNJ
The pad would be inside edge of pool wall to just short of coping width in your case 10.5 " You want to be shy of the rear of coping and account for overhang. 5-6" thick and ideally it's one continuous pour. We drill thru the holes in panels where they connect and use rebar pieces to strengthen those spots. Need a copper bond wire jumper when you do the bond ring.
Not to sway you, but I wouldnt bother with the attempt to cast pavers or coping. You can never replicate the material used. The casting is very controlled with rubber forms and release agents and the concrete is very high strength like 6000+ psi and dry mixed then vibrated to form. It is SO much work to prep a proper base, then set and pour the coping base. You dont want to have to fudge every piece trying to make things level, and then when you install pavers and compact them they will crack. Its just not worth the effort. You can get decent quality stuff for cheap. Find a CST dealer near you and use their coping and pavers. The laticrete I referenced is 60 bucks a bag you will need several bags. CST coping is around 2 bucks a piece 2 pieces is a sqft. Average pool is 120 pieces coping. Just not worth the labor or effort to make stuff and then redo it or it fails. If I understand you ate planning to DIY this pool? If so I promise you by the time it comes to the decking you will be wondering what you got yourself into and sick of the pool build.
Jimmy,
You are very knowledgeable and extremely helpful. I will cast the concrete ring, like you mentioned. As far as casting my own coping/ pavers your the third person to tell me “don’t waste your time”. Advice taken. I’ll look at CST website to see what they have available. Yes I will be doing DIY. and I’m sure your right again, by the end I’ll be sick of the pool build.
I have to draw up the planes and submit to the town for permits. Once I start I’ll take pictures and post them on TFP.

Thanks Joe
 

Aquaman7

Well-known member
Sep 15, 2019
88
NNJ
Have you priced that out? RapidSet isn't cheap either. When you also factor in your time you will have very expensive pavers that may not perform as less expensive alternatives.
Come to think of it. I didn’t price our Rapid set. I price out Sakcrete which was 4.00 a 80 lbs. bag. Have to look into Rapidset. Yes and time is always a factor. Point taken.
Thanks