Euro Gutter Repair and Coping Install - Please Help!

[davidmflorida]

Hello,
We had a bad leak in the gutter that required us to pull up the coping and back row of travertine. We had to grind off all of the thinset and mud from each piece as well as the beam. My question now is..... What is the most accurate way to ensure that the coping edge is pitched perfectly and absolutely level around the entire perimeter of the pool? Size is approx 50' x 18'. The original plans call for a mud bed with a slope. Pix attached and Thank you in advance!

 

[Jimrahbe]

David,

Most of us here are just pool owners that like to talk about our pools.. We do have several that are into the construction of pools, but it might take a day or so for one of them to see your post..

Let me see if I can round one of them up...

Calling, @JamesW @jimmythegreek @bdavis466

Does that "gutter" go around the entire pool? I assume it takes the place of normal skimmers?? Very nice looking pool.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[davidmflorida]

That would be incredibly kind of you! Yes. The gutter goes around the entire pool. I’m really looking for the specific technique to ensure perfect leveling around the entire perimeter. I’m not sure if a line level or laser is used. There is also a layer of mud that is built up to create the angle and not sure how they make that perfectly level either. I’m actually fascinated and hopeful to find an answer.

 

[ajw22]

What are you expecting to be perfectly level? The blueprint specifies he exterior coping and interior coping have a 1/2" slope.

I think a good mason uses a 4' level to measure the slope. @Rich D may have some ideas.

 

[kimkats]

In my head I am seeing some kind of jig being made that will help you make sure the mortar is even and level and sloped how it needs to be for the system.

Do you have any idea who the PB was?

 

[davidmflorida]

What are you expecting to be perfectly level? The blueprint specifies he exterior coping and interior coping have a 1/2" slope.

I think a good mason uses a 4' level to measure the slope. @Rich D may have some ideas.

The issue isn’t the slope but making sure the elevation of each corner of the pool (as well as the long runs of the coping). Line level? Laser? Technique?

 

[jimmythegreek]

If the layout worked as built before, I would establish the corners of the pool amd set them into place letting them dry. I would then use a spacer like standard 3/4" lumber amd make several spacer blocks. I would pull a very tight string line or even jet line amd start setting coping using a quality bullet level amd a spacer as your guide for height. Use bullet for side to side level, and as you go use a 4 or 6ft to keep it all on plane.
You use spacer blocks to space the line above the set corners so you have room to lay coping amd not be on top of the string line. The spacer is then your reference to the proper height. Could use two lines even one for front amd one for back to establish the correct pitch

 

[davidmflorida]

If the layout worked as built before, I would establish the corners of the pool amd set them into place letting them dry. I would then use a spacer like standard 3/4" lumber amd make several spacer blocks. I would pull a very tight string line or even jet line amd start setting coping using a quality bullet level amd a spacer as your guide for height. Use bullet for side to side level, and as you go use a 4 or 6ft to keep it all on plane.
You use spacer blocks to space the line above the set corners so you have room to lay coping amd not be on top of the string line. The spacer is then your reference to the proper height. Could use two lines even one for front amd one for back to establish the correct pitch

Thank you so much for the reply..... I guess the BIG question is how to "establish the corners" and making sure the 4 corners (that are approx 50' apart) are at the exact same elevation. I am sure that there is a "trick" that an experienced installer uses and I'm profoundly curious as to how they do it AND ensure that every piece of travertine is aligned on the way to each corner.

 

[Jimrahbe]

David,

I have never used one, but I suspect you will need a transit level.. I know when they initially built my pool they use the transit level to set all the points that needed to be in the correct position with each other.. Like where each skimmer needed to go, where all the deck drains needed to be in relation to the deck itself, and of course to make sure the the bond beam was level around the whole pool.

Transit Levels: All About Transit Levels | How To Use Transit Level | Transit Level Parts | Laser Levels | Johnson Level & Tool Mfg Company

Transit levels is a optical instrument with a built-in spirit level designed for surveying and building construction. They can also be used to find relative position of objects and lines.

www.johnsonlevel.com

.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[davidmflorida]

David,

I have never used one, but I suspect you will need a transit level.. I know when they initially built my pool they use the transit level to set all the points that needed to be in the correct position with each other.. Like where each skimmer needed to go, where all the deck drains needed to be in relation to the deck itself, and of course to make sure the the bond beam was level around the whole pool.

Transit Levels: All About Transit Levels | How To Use Transit Level | Transit Level Parts | Laser Levels | Johnson Level & Tool Mfg Company

Transit levels is a optical instrument with a built-in spirit level designed for surveying and building construction. They can also be used to find relative position of objects and lines.

www.johnsonlevel.com

.

Thanks,

Jim R.

Jim R! Thank you!!!!!! This appears to be awesome.... except my challenge now is that my gutter edge is at ground level. I may have to pull up some surrounding pavers. I really appreciate the advice.

 

[Jimrahbe]

David.

I think the transit just has to be level.. You can then use it to determine at what level a point in space is to a known reference. It can be + or - .. But like I have said, I have no actual experience using one.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[jimmythegreek]

Doesmt have to be perfect all around, just super close. No deck is perfect but the variations are so subtle you dont see them. Can you post a pic of the current status of the deck. I would just go off of the existing edge if it's not all torn up

 

[Rich D]

.. I guess the BIG question is how to "establish the corners" and making sure the 4 corners (that are approx 50' apart) are at the exact same elevation. I am sure that there is a "trick" that an experienced installer uses and I'm profoundly curious as to how they do it AND ensure that every piece of travertine is aligned on the way to each corner.

A transit will give elevation, distance and location. You only need elevation. A builders level or rotary laser level is all you need. These are most commonly accurate to 1/4" at 100' wich is also the accuracy of most transits. There are some models with slightly better accuracy however it is more important to get a good quality unit that has been recently calibrated. I would recommend a recently calibrated, self leveling rotary laser.

 

[cowboycasey]

A water level is more accurate at 50 feet than a laser and they are cheap for the cost of tubing, 2 yard sticks and water..

I have not used one nor built one yet but it is in my future...

water level - Google Search

 

[Rich D]

A water level is more accurate at 50 feet than a laser and they are cheap for the cost of tubing, 2 yard sticks and water

where the water level loses its accuracy is transferring the actual water level to whatever you're trying to set. It's not always possible to get the water level right at the side whatever you're trying to set because it needs to go beside and below what you are trying to set. There is also the meniscus that can be difficult to read as well. not to mention the surface tension which needs to be overcome by some kind of liquid soap or such. The pool water would probably be the best water level, maybe you could plug the gutter and fill it with water and use that... . I still stand by my original recommendation..