EasyTouch and MasterTemp 400

[aug0211]

Having trouble getting my EasyTouch to control the MasterTemp 400 (pool use).

MT works fine when I manually control it on the MT panel.

ET doesn’t seem to turn MT on or off when I turn on or off filter pump or on or off heat mode on ET, or adjust ET thermostat above/below current temp.

Pool installer is sadly not prioritizing our job right now as he’s working on other jobs.

Installed water temp sensor yesterday and confirmed that part is working correctly, and fixed the broken ET transmitter. Now if I can just get the ET to control heat, life will be much better thanks to controlling from our phones.

I read in a very old (2017) thread that I may need to set the heater to 104 degrees? Installer _said_ it was hooked up for ET control so I’m hoping the wiring is there but I’m not certain.

Any easy steps I can look at before getting into wiring?

 

[Jimrahbe]

Aug,

The very first thing is to determine how your heater is wired into your EasyTouch.

Depending on your heater, it may be connected to an RS-485 com port or it may be connected to what is called the fireman's loop.

Open the little drop-down panel at the top of the EasyTouch and show us a picture of the circuit card.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[aug0211]

Aug,

The very first thing is to determine how your heater is wired into your EasyTouch.

Depending on your heater, it may be connected to an RS-485 com port or it may be connected to what is called the fireman's loop.

Open the little drop-down panel at the top of the EasyTouch and show us a picture of the circuit card.

Thanks,

Jim R.

Thanks Jim! Here you go, included some extras as well.

Really appreciate your help.

 

[1poolman1]

The heater needs to be turned on and be in pool heat or spa heat mode (doesn't matter which) and the temperature set to 104. Then walk away and turn it off at the EZT. If you can turn the heater on and off, even with that 2-conductor cable, connected with the EZT not having turned the heater on it is not connected correctly.

Once the EZT turns the heater on, you will have complete manual control but shouldn't need to touch the heater if setup as above. I usually will take a small sheet metal screw and fasten a Max-E-Therm's sunshield down so that people are less likely to play with the heater and the wind doesn't blow the shield out of position allowing the Sun to destroy the membrane pad.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Aug,

Ok, you are using what is called the fireman's loop. A small voltage is sent by the heater up to the Gas Heater connection. When the EasyTouch calls for heat a small relay closes and allows this voltage to go back to the heater, which tells the heater to fire up.

I see there is a heater circuit breaker in the EasyTouch. This may provide AC power directly to the heater, or the circuit breaker may be wired to a relay. If wired to a relay, we need to know which one. Because the heater will not get power without the relay being closed. Tell me if the heater's control panel turns on with the EasyTouch off??

For this whole thing to work, the heater has to be turned on and set to 104 degrees. At this point the heater will not make heat, as there is no water flow and the gas contacts inside the EasyTouch are open. The pump needs to be running fast enough to close a pressure switch inside the heater. Then the EasyTouch will monitor the water temp sensor and when the pool water is less than your heat set point, it will close the gas contacts and send the voltage back to the heater and it should fire up.

Let's see if that helps,

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[aug0211]

The heater needs to be turned on and be in pool heat or spa heat mode (doesn't matter which) and the temperature set to 104. Then walk away and turn it off at the EZT. If you can turn the heater on and off, even with that 2-conductor cable, connected with the EZT not having turned the heater on it is not connected correctly.

Once the EZT turns the heater on, you will have complete manual control but shouldn't need to touch the heater if setup as above. I usually will take a small sheet metal screw and fasten a Max-E-Therm's sunshield down so that people are less likely to play with the heater and the wind doesn't blow the shield out of position allowing the Sun to destroy the membrane pad.

So even with the EZT “heat” and “filter pump” turned off (but pump running via a programmed Feature), I can turn the heater on and off on the heater itself.

Does this mean it’s wired wrong?

 

[aug0211]

Tell me if the heater's control panel turns on with the EasyTouch off??

The heater and its control panel both turn on and operate even with EasyTouch off.

 

[aug0211]

If I set the heater to 104 on its screen, no matter what I do at EZT, the heater stays on and just keeps heating.

 

[1poolman1]

If you can operate the heater with only the pump running and the EZT showing the heater off, it is not wired correctly. If the pump is on and EZT has the heater as being off and the heater still lights up when you press a pool or spa button, the EZT is NOT controlling it. The EZT just completes the power circuit and allows the heater to function. If wired correctly the control circuit of the heater will not get power to the circuit board if the EZT is off.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Aug,

On the EasyTouch's main board is the Gas connection where you show a pic of a red and white wire. You need to show us exactly where those two wires go inside the heater.

I supposed the relay that controls the two pins on the "gas" connector could be stuck on. Just disconnect the gas connector and the heater should shut off. If it does not, then fireman's loop in the heater is not wired correctly.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Rocket J Squirrel]

Perhaps the jumper was not removed on the heater side of the fireman's loop.

 

[aug0211]

Is the front panel (black) of the heater the best one to remove to see this, or do I need to take off the side (where the gas line and vent are)?

 

[Jimrahbe]

Aug,

See page 36 of this manual..

https://www.pentair.com/content/dam/extranet/nam/pentair-pool/residential/manuals/heaters/mastertemp/Manual-MasterTemp-472592-English.pdf

Thanks,

Jim R

 

[ajw22]

Is the front panel (black) of the heater the best one to remove to see this, or do I need to take off the side (where the gas line and vent are)?

This is what you are looking for...

Pentair MasterTemp Heaters - Further Reading

www.troublefreepool.com

 

[aug0211]

See page 36 of this manual..

This is what you are looking for...

Thank you both!

I took off the front and back panels and was surprised at what I found, after looking at the manual sent by Jim and the additional photo/link from AJW (thank you both!).

This is looking at the front of the unit, at a Circuit board that is on the back of the main touch panel/control panel of the heater unit.

It seems like this is all in the wrong spot - I have red arrows showing the brown wire coming from the EZTouch panel (photos earlier on thread), highlighting where it is connecting to this circuit board on the backside of the heating unit’s control screen.

This doesn’t seem right based on the links/photos - right? Do I need to move these?

 

[aug0211]

Almost forgot - here is the photo of the back control panel which does not appear to have been setup for the fireman’s switch, looks like the factory jumper is still there if I’m reading the manual and photos correctly.

 

[ajw22]

You have one of the new 6 button connected heaters and your heater is connected by RS-485 and not the Fireman’s switch.

Where does the other end of that wire connect to in the top low voltage panel of your IntelliCenter?

 

[aug0211]

My interpretation is I need to:

1. Remove the brown wire leads from the heater touch/control panel (front of unit)

2. Cut yellow jumper at back of unit control board for fireman’s switch

3. Use wire nuts to splice brown wire leads coming from EZT panel (from step 1) into yellow jumper ends of fireman switch (from step 2)


Is this correct?

Also, does the front panel of the unit not need anything going into the circuit board on the front? I assume not since the unit turns on/off currently completely independently of the EZT, indicating that those leads going to the back of the touch panel are not serving a purpose.

Hoping someone may be able to confirm my understanding so I can get to work (and reduce the risk of frying something due to my misunderstanding).

Thanks in advance!

 

[aug0211]

Where does the other end of that wire connect to in the top low voltage panel of your IntelliCenter?

Here you go! Photos of where it goes to the EZT in this post:

Post in thread 'EasyTouch and MasterTemp 400'
EasyTouch and MasterTemp 400

 

[ajw22]

Do you have an EasyTouch or an IntelliCenter? Your signature says IntelliCenter.