Bio-Dex Protect All

[JoyfulNoise]

No, I'd say it was closer to 7500. Not as low as I'd hoped, but getting the CH so low does help add to the time until the next refill (filling with tap instead would've started me around 400CH), which does save water in that respect.

My summation is that the service is great for people that want to save a bit of water (~30-50%), get higher quality water, but don't mind paying a bit extra as a trade-off.

Here's a softener question...would a softener help maintain the same level of water quality that is now in the pool? Specifically, would metals and other minerals in the tap water like iron or copper be filtered out by a water softener? Obviously calcium would be.

Softeners remove mineral hardness, so mostly calcium and magnesium. You don’t want a softener exposed to iron or copper as the bonding to the ion exchange resin will be irreversible for transition metal ions (Fe, Cu, Mn, etc). Typically when significant quantities of metals are present, one must use a special green sand filter for that.

But, a softener would maintain low calcium levels as the water from the softener has zero Ca or Mg in it. So if your pool had a softener hooked up to the auto fill, you would see no rise in your current calcium levels.

 

[JoyfulNoise]

I may consider RO service even if I have to pay a premium. With my tile cleaned, I’d like to drop my CH as quickly as I can. If I do a series of partial drains, I’ll use just as much water as RO but it would take me longer to get there. I’ll pht some request for quotes out here to local RO service providers and see how much of a premium it will be....

Thanks for updating the thread. It’s helpful.

 

[spoonman]

Interestingly enough, I was looking at softeners yesterday and came across small models that could be placed outdoors and used for pools to top off. They were only about $200 ish, but would require some re-plumbing. At that point, it would make more sense to do the whole house, but it is a good idea for anyone that just wanted to address the pool water.

 

[mknauss]

Interestingly enough, I was looking at softeners yesterday and came across small models that could be placed outdoors and used for pools to top off. They were only about $200 ish, but would require some re-plumbing. At that point, it would make more sense to do the whole house, but it is a good idea for anyone that just wanted to address the pool water.

I had looked into some small units but had not researched very far. I wondered what they did with the regen waste?

If you have any links or general areas you searched, that would be great.

Take care.

 

[JoyfulNoise]

Interestingly enough, I was looking at softeners yesterday and came across small models that could be placed outdoors and used for pools to top off. They were only about $200 ish, but would require some re-plumbing. At that point, it would make more sense to do the whole house, but it is a good idea for anyone that just wanted to address the pool water.

Yes. I know people that have small softeners on their pool autofill lines. There are even models out there intended for outdoor installation. Regeneration brine waste is an issue if you don’t have close access to a sewer drain but it is doable.

My softener is installed on the autofill line with a separate 1/4 turn shutoff and is cross-connected to my hard water line (spigot) as well. This way, if I have to go in an extended vacation and I want to shut-off the house water, I can supply the autofill with regular water. Or, if the pool water gets too soft over time, I can simply switch to hard water for a while.

 

[spoonman]

mknauss...here is a "portable" softener that appears to be usable for pools. It is 2,000 gallons per regen. In my case that would probably be every 6-8 weeks.

https://www.amazon.com/Portable-Sof...mr1&keywords=portable+water+softener+electric

You may be able to plumb a waste line to your sewer cleanout. When I had RO done on my pool, the company had a special attachment cap that connects a standard garden hose fitting to your sewer cleanout. Presumably you could connect a garden hose from the softener unit to the sewer cleanout and just bury it under your soil/rocks/etc. I'm no plumber though.

 

[JoyfulNoise]

I had looked into some small units but had not researched very far. I wondered what they did with the regen waste?

If you have any links or general areas you searched, that would be great.

Take care.

If you don’t have a sewer clear out nearby or a drain to the neighbors yard laughblue, then you can always attach the waste hose to a large container and just remember to empty it. A small softener is going to have a smaller amount of brine waste volume.

 

[Parabolic]

Here is a picture of the RO unit working...

View attachment 77541

The unit is attached to a dolly/hand truck lying down. The large tube is the intake. Once the process is complete, Ecoklear will rebalance the water.

Did you by chance take a picture of the inner workings of that unit you could share. Seems awfully small, but appears to work.

 

[JoyfulNoise]

mknauss...here is a "portable" softener that appears to be usable for pools. It is 2,000 gallons per regen. In my case that would probably be every 6-8 weeks.

https://www.amazon.com/Portable-Sof...mr1&keywords=portable+water+softener+electric

You may be able to plumb a waste line to your sewer cleanout. When I had RO done on my pool, the company had a special attachment cap that connects a standard garden hose fitting to your sewer cleanout. Presumably you could connect a garden hose from the softener unit to the sewer cleanout and just bury it under your soil/rocks/etc. I'm no plumber though.

The volume you get depends on the input hardness of the water. So you take your input hardness (should use total hardness) in ppm and divide by 17.1 to get grains/gallon. Then take 16,000 grains (the size of that softener) and divide it by your input grains per gallon. So, if your total hardness was 300ppm, that would be 17.5 gr/gal and that softener would process (16000/17.5) = 912 gal of water. You want at least a 24hr reserve volume in the softener and a pool can easily use 100 gal per day of fill water so you’d only get about 800 gal of water out of that unit before needing to regenerate.

If you watch the video for How To Regenerate it, there’s a huge mistake - the uses Morton’s Iodized Table salt to regen it. That would be REALLY bad as table salt has anti-caking additives (yellow prussate of soda) and iodine in it that would eventually destroy the resin. You should only ever use softener salt in a water softener.

 

[spoonman]

No, sorry. I believe the company sells the units for $11k if you want to buy one. IIRC, someone on TFP posted about this a while back.

If you are in SoCal, there are other RO services available there. I know many use larger truck mounted units, but often charge more as it is faster.

 

[cfherrman]

At 400 ch, the water coming out would be:

0 ch
+187 ppm salt

 

[JoyfulNoise]

At 400 ch, the water coming out would be:

0 ch
+187 ppm salt

Sodium, not salt. This is a key distinction and very often quoted (and misleading) attack against the use of water softeners. Remember, the exchange is between sodium ions and calcium ions. There is no “salt” involved, ie, there is no chloride ion exchange. If salt, ie, sodium chloride, were present in the softener during exchange, it would interfere with the exchange process.

Softeners increase the sodium levels in water, not sodium chloride levels.