Are UV filters a scam?

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Rockish

Member
May 24, 2020
13
Harrisburg, PA
So last year before we purchased our pool we were set on a Swg. After consulting with the pool store before building, we were presented with more options and sold on going with a UV filter instead. I discovered tfp this summer the week our pool went in. I’m embarrassed I didn’t do more research before hand. We were told we could keep the chlorine levels very low, like 1-3ppm and it was better for your skin than swg pools.
So now I know better. I’m just really disappointed we lost our chance at an easier to maintain system. I’ve been calculating daily chlorine per pool math using our cya relationship and not accounting for the UV at all.
I really haven’t seen much about UV on this site. Did we get completely scammed or is there actually utility in it?
 
Rockish said:
Did we get completely scammed or is there actually utility in it?
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It does work to an extent, but the bulbs break and you have no way to test or know until the pool is green. Seing how a properly maintained chlorine pool is undetectable to 99.99% of people, why install something else to have to still use half of the chlorine.
 
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UV.....<sigh> Don'tcha get sun up there in Yankeeland?? That free UV kind?? '

UV, Ozone and other "alternative* systems can have a place in indoor public pools, high bather loads, ect. But residential pool sales of these items are just money makers for the pool builder and you *still* need chlorine in the water. So why buy 'em??

In fact, they cause an increase in burn off of your desirable Free Chlorine.

SWGs are easy to add. We'll talk ya thru it!

MADDIE
 
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YippeeSkippy said:
UV.....<sigh> Don'tcha get sun up there in Yankeeland?? That free UV kind?? '

UV, Ozone and other "alternative* systems can have a place in indoor public pools, high bather loads, ect. But residential pool sales of these items are just money makers for the pool builder and you *still* need chlorine in the water. So why buy 'em??

In fact, they cause an increase in burn off of your desirable Free Chlorine.

SWGs are easy to add. We'll talk ya thru it!

MADDIE
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Oh man! I knew it. I was actually wondering if it was causing our pool to eat through even more chlorine.

We had a whole winter to research this before the pool went in and I don’t know why we didn’t. Even when you google it, most sites promote it as a positive “chlorine free” method. I had a spidey sense though...
 
Is the device itself a scam? No. It does produce UV-C light which does kill microbes. When it's working properly.

Is the sales pitch a scam? Ehhhhhhh, I won't go that far, but it is full of half-truths and exaggerations. UV provides supplemental sanitation of pool water, it doesn't have the capacity in a pool to sanitize very effectively so it doesn't really affect the need for proper chlorination. Nor is it needed in the low bather load situation of a residential pool. It can be handy in an indoor pool to help burn off CCs, but even a shaded outdoor pool gets enough UV from sunlight to accomplish this many times over. UV also has its place in the commercial pool arena where the high bather load for extended time benefits from extra sanitation, but those units are much larger (and greatly more expensive) than the units for a residential pool. Residential models are so anemic that they barely do anything.

So why are they pushed so much? Because the costly UV bulbs need replaced regularly. They advertise it as producing UV, but it produces way more RI... Residual Income.
 
Donldson said:
Is the device itself a scam? No. It does produce UV-C light which does kill microbes. When it's working properly.

Is the sales pitch a scam? Ehhhhhhh, I won't go that far, but it is full of half-truths and exaggerations. UV provides supplemental sanitation of pool water, it doesn't have the capacity in a pool to sanitize very effectively so it doesn't really affect the need for proper chlorination. Nor is it needed in the low bather load situation of a residential pool. It can be handy in an indoor pool to help burn off CCs, but even a shaded outdoor pool gets enough UV from sunlight to accomplish this many times over. UV also has its place in the commercial pool arena where the high bather load for extended time benefits from extra sanitation, but those units are much larger (and greatly more expensive) than the units for a residential pool. Residential models are so anemic that they barely do anything.

So why are they pushed so much? Because the costly UV bulbs need replaced regularly. They advertise it as producing UV, but it produces way more RI... Residual Income.
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Thanks for the insight. What would you do if you were me? Run it this season and ignore its contribution to the pool or just stop running it now?
 
I would consider it a waste of electricity to operate, so I would disconnect power to it. Maintain the proper chlorine level per the FC/CYA Levels via liquid chlorine and if you are considering installing an SWG I would start a thread specifically about that. There are a LOT of really knowledgeable people in that area on the site who can give you some guidance on what to look for and common pitfalls to avoid.

If it's any consolation, getting a UV is a relatively mild "oopsie" one can make when getting a pool installed. Many get talked in to ion systems which then cause staining, or baquacil which is crazy expensive and unreliable, or some wholly unsanitary "chlorine-free alternative". UV is a waste, but it hasn't messed up your water.
 
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Rockish said:
There’s room. It’s a bitter pill to swallow after all the expenses but next year is a new one.
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I hear you there Rockish. I did the same thing. The bad thing for me was it was all my doing. My PB didn't push it, they threw it on as an option and I bit on it. I simply didn't do any research past the manufacturers literature, which is not like me. And within 3 months of opening I had removed my Ozone lamp and I am planning on removing my UV lamp and using that real estate for an IntellipH system.

--Jeff
 

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Rockish, I made similar costly mistakes for my install (tab chlorination, pool tiger, ozone) - so don’t feel so bad! PB marketed lower free chlorine levels (0.5 to 1 ppm) with the system. Discovered TFP during the build and gained enough knowledge in a very short time through this site for the builder remove the pool tiger and installed the SWG on my own. Subsequently, I’ve also removed the ozone generator. The SWG system has been running for over a month. Water is TFP clear. No regrets! Best of luck. (y)

-Andy
 
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My PB threw in the pentair bioshield UV light for free. Initially they installed it wrong in a way that you couldn't change the bulb properly. They fixed it. Shows you their inexperience.
One thing I do notice is we no longer get that chlorine smell on our skin. Also, when I've been a lax not keeping up with chemicals I haven't had any water issues whereas in my 2 previous pools I would be battling the beginning of an algae bloom.
Also, because the UV light is on no matter the rate of the variable speed pump I run the variable speed pump at high power mostly for a short period of time because I don't want to use that extra 120W of power nor burn out the UV lamp early. My UV lamp went out within a year because I had the the variable speed pump running at low speed continuously.
It's been an educational process for sure.
 
Hi Dadoc, welcome to posting at TFP :) Glad to have you join us. :)

Tell me Dadoc.... Where do you live?? Is it someplace devoid of UV rays from the sun?? Those little bitty lamps only treat the fraction of water that flows by.....then that water re-enters the rest of the pool's water and it's exposed to all the possibilites there. There is no residual sanitizing power in that bitty little bulb.

A lot of folks write in and say their bulbs burned out and weren't replaced and they never noticed a difference. They're money makers for the builder, that's all.

Maddie
 
YippeeSkippy said:
Hi Dadoc, welcome to posting at TFP :) Glad to have you join us. :)

Tell me Dadoc.... Where do you live?? Is it someplace devoid of UV rays from the sun?? Those little bitty lamps only treat the fraction of water that flows by.....then that water re-enters the rest of the pool's water and it's exposed to all the possibilites there. There is no residual sanitizing power in that bitty little bulb.

A lot of folks write in and say their bulbs burned out and weren't replaced and they never noticed a difference. They're money makers for the builder, that's all.

Maddie
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I'm in Phoenix, AZ. Lots of sun and heat. The UV light in the UV sanitizer is of a different wavelength and intensity then just the sun. UV light is a known method of sanitizing in various applications in addition to pool/aquatics.

I don't think a true experiment has been performed UV sanitization vs nothing relative to algae growth. I do believe that it provides an extra level of buffer so to speak.
 
dadoc said:
The UV light in the UV sanitizer is of a different wavelength and intensity then just the sun
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🙄 Please don't start quoting sales literature around here. We are well aware of the difference between UV-A, B, and C. But a little tiny 120 watt UV-C lamp is laughably anemic. Meanwhile a residential pool has an abundance of sanitizing chlorine because of the low bather load so any supplemental sanitation provided by the UV light is completely wasted. What UV does help with is reduction of CC, but UV-A and B do that quite well and that's more than taken care of from sunlight. So in an outdoor residential pool it is entirely worthless.

It does not offer any buffer for mismanagement either. I am sure the ease you are experiencing this year can be explained by other means (lower CYA is the most likely) and there's no reason to believe a tiny UV light that only sanitizes water flowing through your system much slower than algae can grow would have a noticeable effect.

You didn't answer my question, are you following the FC/CYA Levels?
 
Donldson said:
🙄 Please don't start quoting sales literature around here. We are well aware of the difference between UV-A, B, and C. But a little tiny 120 watt UV-C lamp is laughably anemic. Meanwhile a residential pool has an abundance of sanitizing chlorine because of the low bather load so any supplemental sanitation provided by the UV light is completely wasted. What UV does help with is reduction of CC, but UV-A and B do that quite well and that's more than taken care of from sunlight. So in an outdoor residential pool it is entirely worthless.

It does not offer any buffer for mismanagement either. I am sure the ease you are experiencing this year can be explained by other means (lower CYA is the most likely) and there's no reason to believe a tiny UV light that only sanitizes water flowing through your system much slower than algae can grow would have a noticeable effect.

You didn't answer my question, are you following the FC/CYA Levels?
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I've been using pucks the past 2 years and stumbled onto here because of that issue with a CYA >100 and low FC. I had been using an OTO test kit and am now using my expanded taylor test kit. Per the TFP rules my water is not properly sanitizing and I should have had an algae bloom.
My last measurements:
pH 7.3
TA 120
TC 3
FC 0.5
CYA > 100 (I didn't do the dilution test)
 
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