I know, BELIEVE me I know....what a summer....covid, blew my back out back in June moving my snowblower (long story), and now a crappy swimming season.
A few questions about converting
- Thread starter anthonypool89
- Start date
- Mar 5, 2020
- 3,055
- Pool Size
- 66000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Astral Viron V35
There is a very recent thread on a tarp method water replacement with pictures and video:
Tarp method in-place water replacement
As some of you may know, my pool has been quite problematic with metal staining for many years. For the past 3 years I had been using Metal Magic to control the metal staining but lately, I've been having to use about 2 quarts of Metal Magic a week and have been having problems with chlorine...
www.troublefreepool.com
Last edited:
It will likely postpone your headaches, but the "problems" will come back. I mentioned this is in a reply on one of your other topics. I switched from DE to sand early on in my baqua adventures.
Pookie....I seem to recall you mentioning this before, as you say. Also, I've talked to several people now who have said that after 30 years with DE they doubt that I'd be happy with sand (?) Can't speak to that since I've never used one nor ever seen a pool that runs on one. I think I'd like to stay with DE but get back to chlorine. It's time.
JoeSelf
Gold Supporter
Thanks Joe. I bookmarked the TF site. Out of curiosity I compared prices between TF and Taylor. Taylor is cheaper until you figure in their shipping (which has gotten pretty high). So I stopped getting them there. Most recently I've been buying through Sunplay.com. Buying an entire test kit refill at TF might be a good deal.
Anthony, I feel your pain. We installed a 24' X 52" AGP in May of 2016. The installer sold me on Baquacil. Worked great for the 1st year and a half...then the dreaded white water mold appeared. Except, I didn't recognize it for that at the time. I found TFP and began reading and asking questions. An "expert" on Baquacil with whom I conversed was one "Anthonypool89." 
You gave me several suggestions about what might be happening and ideas to try, which I did, to no avail. Then, I made the decision last fall that I was going to convert when I opened this spring.
With my 4 years experience, and your 30, me giving advice to you seems like the second grader giving advice to the high school principal. Anyway, one of the big reasons for my converting was also the extensive backwashes putting a big strain on our well. I mentioned on this site going from sand to cartridge filtering, just to avoid dumping 300-400 gallons each time. Several spoke up and recommended that I not do that until after I had finished converting. Most said that they were now backwashing much less frequently than previously, and they had not changed anything except the Baquacil.
My pool's capacity is very similar to yours, and I closed it with heavy doses of Baquacil, as always. Upon removing the cover and opening, the water was crystal clear with a solid layer of dead water mold on the bottom. I had let my pool overfill so I could vacuum all of that to waste. Then the chlorine dump began. Follow the TFP plan explicitly, even when you begin to think you might have messed something up. I believe mine took about a week from start to finish, with only three backwashes in total. Total chlorine used: 34 gallons.
And now, for my piece of advice... use hairnets in your skimmers from the beginning of the conversion (even before you begin filtering) until forever! During that week of the conversion, I was replacing the nets three-four times a day. They were a sticky yellow goop that probably weighed two pounds or more each time. I'm sure they probably saved me many backwashes. With the nets in my skimmer continuously this summer, thus far I have backwashed just three times, and two of those were mostly to lower my water level before predicted heavy rains fell.
Best of luck to you in your anticipated "great adventure." You'll never regret it!
You gave me several suggestions about what might be happening and ideas to try, which I did, to no avail. Then, I made the decision last fall that I was going to convert when I opened this spring.With my 4 years experience, and your 30, me giving advice to you seems like the second grader giving advice to the high school principal. Anyway, one of the big reasons for my converting was also the extensive backwashes putting a big strain on our well. I mentioned on this site going from sand to cartridge filtering, just to avoid dumping 300-400 gallons each time. Several spoke up and recommended that I not do that until after I had finished converting. Most said that they were now backwashing much less frequently than previously, and they had not changed anything except the Baquacil.
My pool's capacity is very similar to yours, and I closed it with heavy doses of Baquacil, as always. Upon removing the cover and opening, the water was crystal clear with a solid layer of dead water mold on the bottom. I had let my pool overfill so I could vacuum all of that to waste. Then the chlorine dump began. Follow the TFP plan explicitly, even when you begin to think you might have messed something up. I believe mine took about a week from start to finish, with only three backwashes in total. Total chlorine used: 34 gallons.
And now, for my piece of advice... use hairnets in your skimmers from the beginning of the conversion (even before you begin filtering) until forever! During that week of the conversion, I was replacing the nets three-four times a day. They were a sticky yellow goop that probably weighed two pounds or more each time. I'm sure they probably saved me many backwashes. With the nets in my skimmer continuously this summer, thus far I have backwashed just three times, and two of those were mostly to lower my water level before predicted heavy rains fell.
Best of luck to you in your anticipated "great adventure." You'll never regret it!
ghall: glad I could be of some help to you - at least to offer baqua suggestions which helped, but ultimately didn't help! I know all too well.
I'm most appreciative of the hairnet suggestion and just copied and pasted that into an ongoing document I created about all things baqua-to-chlorine conversion.
I'm so glad things are working out well for you. I'm pretty set at this point on waiting till spring to do this. It sounds like your experience with opening a pool is somewhat different than mine. You say you just converted this spring, right? And that when you opened, the water was clear but with a bunch of mold, etc. on the bottom. I can't imagine having 'clear' water open taking off the cover. You might have a solid cover. Mine's mesh, although even when I did have a solid cover, I don't ever recall opening to clear water. It's usually a (stinky) swamp - can't even see the 2nd step. The bottom is full of decomposed worms, leaves, etc. It takes a lot of vacuuming to get as much of that out as possible. A dirty and rather disgusting process. Then, the water VERY gradually starts to clear after putting the grids in and adding the baqua chemicals. For the first few hours after removing the cover and getting the water circulating, I don't even put the grids in. Never saw the point since they'd probably clog up in minutes. A few days to really clear everything up. So, next spring, what I'll likely do - if I stay with the plan - is to do all the vacuuming again, but then not add any baqua chemicals. Rather, start right in with the chlorine.
I'm most appreciative of the hairnet suggestion and just copied and pasted that into an ongoing document I created about all things baqua-to-chlorine conversion.
I'm so glad things are working out well for you. I'm pretty set at this point on waiting till spring to do this. It sounds like your experience with opening a pool is somewhat different than mine. You say you just converted this spring, right? And that when you opened, the water was clear but with a bunch of mold, etc. on the bottom. I can't imagine having 'clear' water open taking off the cover. You might have a solid cover. Mine's mesh, although even when I did have a solid cover, I don't ever recall opening to clear water. It's usually a (stinky) swamp - can't even see the 2nd step. The bottom is full of decomposed worms, leaves, etc. It takes a lot of vacuuming to get as much of that out as possible. A dirty and rather disgusting process. Then, the water VERY gradually starts to clear after putting the grids in and adding the baqua chemicals. For the first few hours after removing the cover and getting the water circulating, I don't even put the grids in. Never saw the point since they'd probably clog up in minutes. A few days to really clear everything up. So, next spring, what I'll likely do - if I stay with the plan - is to do all the vacuuming again, but then not add any baqua chemicals. Rather, start right in with the chlorine.
Anthony, sorry it took so long to respond. Yes, I do have a solid cover. I have never opened to a swamp, but I always prepare myself mentally for it, because I'm sure it will happen. Having TFP experts ready to help blunts the panic a lot!
In the past, when closing, I never finalized the close (heavy dose of Oxidizer, Sanitizer, and Baquacil Algaecide) until the water was 55-60 degrees for about a week. Algae can't grow at those temps. Then I did a very thorough vacuuming job, quickly lowered the water to a few inches below the skimmer, and immediately placed the cover on. When snow accumulates on top, I shovel as much as I can reach as soon after the snowfall (PLASTIC shovel!) as possible. You never get it all, but keeps excessive weight from pulling on the top of the pool, a problem you won't have. You get worms, etc. instead. Sorry. There's no free lunch, right? During the winter, give away, sell, or return everything Baquacil. The high cost of replacing it will prevent you from changing your mind.
When Spring arrives and everything on top of my cover is melted and mixed with rain, I use my pool net to catch as much accumulated sediment as I can. Then I use a small utility pump with a hairnet over the inlet (you can never have enough hairnets!) with an attached piece of garden hose (with another hairnet rubber- banded over the end of the hose) to put this free water back into the pool. I do this each time I get a decent accumulation of water on top, until my pool is full. Overfill it a little bit, and your initial vacuuming can be sent directly to waste (sand.) Not sure how you do it with DE, but you get the idea. Then pour in the chlorine, set up a chair by the pool, and let the adventure begin. I used 10% chlorine, which I purchased online from True Value Hardware @ $4.00 a gallon. It was shipped to my local store; no shipping costs. I just had to go pick it up.
As we talked earlier, our pools are similar in volume and mine required 34 gallons to complete. I noted you also used the Baquacil CDX, which I did not. That may make a difference, I'm not sure. Over the Winter, get your test kit acquired, and learn how Pool Math works. It will become your best friend. I over-tested in the beginning until I began to see that most of my numbers were nearly the same for weeks at a time, with only insignificant changes. I now only test for chlorine and pH daily. PH hardly ever changes; I need to add chlorine daily. I test for TA, CH, and CYA every week-and-a-half to two weeks. I was told to expect to use about a half-gallon a day of chlorine for my size pool. On days when the pool is uncovered all day and in use for half of it, I need to add about a quart of chlorine. Covered and no use--about 15 oz. At $4.00 a gallon, that equates to either $1.00 or $.50 a day. And don't forget, that is both my oxidizer and sanitizer. Also, I have used no algaecide, clarifier, flocculant, etc. all year. I can only imagine how much those numbers must shock you- they still shock me. But it's true, I have added nothing but chlorine and around $2.50 worth of 20 Mule Team Borax (pH-Up) since my initial set-up was finished. I occasionally go into the basement and re-count my used chlorine jugs just to make sure I'm not dreaming! My pool has never been cleaner nor more sparkling. No red eyes, green hair, chemical smell, or anything else us Baquacil-er's were told about chlorine.
To close this year, my first with chlorine, when the water temp is right, I expect to do a SLAM, stabilize everything, then add Polyquat 60 algaecide. I am currently reading up here on TFP to finalize my plan.
Let me know if I can be of any help; if you need any encouragement, etc. Us old guys have to stick together, LOL. Nearly every bit of experience I have shared is a result of using info gleaned from this site. I had so much help from the members on this site when doing my conversion. I am by no means an expert, but there are MANY on here who are, and they can't wait to help you.
In the past, when closing, I never finalized the close (heavy dose of Oxidizer, Sanitizer, and Baquacil Algaecide) until the water was 55-60 degrees for about a week. Algae can't grow at those temps. Then I did a very thorough vacuuming job, quickly lowered the water to a few inches below the skimmer, and immediately placed the cover on. When snow accumulates on top, I shovel as much as I can reach as soon after the snowfall (PLASTIC shovel!) as possible. You never get it all, but keeps excessive weight from pulling on the top of the pool, a problem you won't have. You get worms, etc. instead. Sorry. There's no free lunch, right? During the winter, give away, sell, or return everything Baquacil. The high cost of replacing it will prevent you from changing your mind.
When Spring arrives and everything on top of my cover is melted and mixed with rain, I use my pool net to catch as much accumulated sediment as I can. Then I use a small utility pump with a hairnet over the inlet (you can never have enough hairnets!) with an attached piece of garden hose (with another hairnet rubber- banded over the end of the hose) to put this free water back into the pool. I do this each time I get a decent accumulation of water on top, until my pool is full. Overfill it a little bit, and your initial vacuuming can be sent directly to waste (sand.) Not sure how you do it with DE, but you get the idea. Then pour in the chlorine, set up a chair by the pool, and let the adventure begin. I used 10% chlorine, which I purchased online from True Value Hardware @ $4.00 a gallon. It was shipped to my local store; no shipping costs. I just had to go pick it up.
As we talked earlier, our pools are similar in volume and mine required 34 gallons to complete. I noted you also used the Baquacil CDX, which I did not. That may make a difference, I'm not sure. Over the Winter, get your test kit acquired, and learn how Pool Math works. It will become your best friend. I over-tested in the beginning until I began to see that most of my numbers were nearly the same for weeks at a time, with only insignificant changes. I now only test for chlorine and pH daily. PH hardly ever changes; I need to add chlorine daily. I test for TA, CH, and CYA every week-and-a-half to two weeks. I was told to expect to use about a half-gallon a day of chlorine for my size pool. On days when the pool is uncovered all day and in use for half of it, I need to add about a quart of chlorine. Covered and no use--about 15 oz. At $4.00 a gallon, that equates to either $1.00 or $.50 a day. And don't forget, that is both my oxidizer and sanitizer. Also, I have used no algaecide, clarifier, flocculant, etc. all year. I can only imagine how much those numbers must shock you- they still shock me. But it's true, I have added nothing but chlorine and around $2.50 worth of 20 Mule Team Borax (pH-Up) since my initial set-up was finished. I occasionally go into the basement and re-count my used chlorine jugs just to make sure I'm not dreaming! My pool has never been cleaner nor more sparkling. No red eyes, green hair, chemical smell, or anything else us Baquacil-er's were told about chlorine.
To close this year, my first with chlorine, when the water temp is right, I expect to do a SLAM, stabilize everything, then add Polyquat 60 algaecide. I am currently reading up here on TFP to finalize my plan.
Let me know if I can be of any help; if you need any encouragement, etc. Us old guys have to stick together, LOL. Nearly every bit of experience I have shared is a result of using info gleaned from this site. I had so much help from the members on this site when doing my conversion. I am by no means an expert, but there are MANY on here who are, and they can't wait to help you.
Gary,
Wow! Thanks for all that great info. Most interesting. I copied and pasted parts of your post to a document that I've started relative to all things conversion-related.
34 gallons for the conversion, huh? Then I imagine mine would be similar. Man, that's aLOT of chlorine! Sounds like you keep you pool covered at times. I used to do that back when we were still using solar covers, but once we got a heater I leave it open all the time. I have been using CDX for several years but must say that, ever since the Line Cleaner episode last month, I haven't added any. Actually have added very little Oxidizer either. Rather, I've been relying on additional Line Clean as a sort of maintenance shock treatment, and then recently added a container of Ahhsome. I'm relieved that - at least for now - the filter pressure has been stable. I don't know how much longer I could have trudged on with taking the filter apart every few days. It was getting to be too much. See how the rest of the season goes. Taking all this one day at a time.
Wow! Thanks for all that great info. Most interesting. I copied and pasted parts of your post to a document that I've started relative to all things conversion-related.
34 gallons for the conversion, huh? Then I imagine mine would be similar. Man, that's aLOT of chlorine! Sounds like you keep you pool covered at times. I used to do that back when we were still using solar covers, but once we got a heater I leave it open all the time. I have been using CDX for several years but must say that, ever since the Line Cleaner episode last month, I haven't added any. Actually have added very little Oxidizer either. Rather, I've been relying on additional Line Clean as a sort of maintenance shock treatment, and then recently added a container of Ahhsome. I'm relieved that - at least for now - the filter pressure has been stable. I don't know how much longer I could have trudged on with taking the filter apart every few days. It was getting to be too much. See how the rest of the season goes. Taking all this one day at a time.
JoeSelf
Gold Supporter
You should be able to get 2.5 & 5 gallon containers of 12.5%. I get them at a pool store. They are from Buckmans.
Thanks Joe. I just found out a few days ago that there is a local pool business in my town that I wasn't aware of. From discussions with him he said he can get whatever I need - said he only works with "professional chemicals" (?) and has done many baqua to chlorine conversions. Seems really up on everything - so I may work with him on the chlorine depending on how expensive he is.
mguzzy
Gold Supporter
TF sells Taylor reagents and I find the prices are very competitive as well. ... also the proportions they sell are more appropriate for residential testing. Thats the biggest savings in my opinion. I'm not buying what I don't need.
Anthony.. get that dang thing converted and save what's left of your summer swimming season. From following your various threads it sounds like you have so much stuff in that pool a drain and refill will be the easiest method to convert.. and if you think you have ground water issues I would do the tarp method. It sounds like the cost of a tarp from Harbor Freight and a pool full of new water will be far cheaper than the chemical warfare that will be needed to convert. Just pull the trigger and DO IT! we will be here to root for you and assist!
The water has completely settled down - no more odors or fumes. Most recent filter change is not even budging from the start-up. My most recent experiment was to add another pound of line cleaner - seems to have created some amazing improvement in the water. It almost feels like it did 6 years ago when a fresh fill was added. I'm dumbfounded. See how things progress from here. At this point I'm ruling out doing any conversion this summer.
Anthony, great news on your water quality improvement. I don't blame you for not jumping into a conversion right now. You've apparently been living with a pool war for practically the entire summer. Pools stop being fun at that point. As long as there is only a month-and-a-half of swim season left in PA, at most, no one would blame you for giving "Anthony The Pool Technician" a much-deserved vacation and let him enjoy his pool (while keeping a watchful eye on the Baqua-Demon." I Hope you still continue to consider a full-blown conversion at some point, though.
Take care, and ENJOY!!!
G.
Take care, and ENJOY!!!
G.
There...... I fixed it for ya !! Lol
Seriously though Anthony if it’s going better finally I personally wouldn’t tempt the Universe who has not been so kind to you this season. Enjoy the gift for a few weeks and it will be an easier Baqua battle in the Spring.
Geez, Newdude....how'd YOU know I curse and throw things? 
Sometimes it's really good not to have any close neighbors- like when you're totally p-off at how things are going with the pool. I'm treading on little cat feet - just added 2 quarts of Oxidizer - dreading that within an hour some toxic reaction would again make its appearance and not allow me to get within 3 feet of the fence without a gas mask for the next 10 days - but - didn't happen, so looks like another good swim this evening. I only added 2 parts of CDX instead of the usual 5. Wasn't brave enough. So weird how the water has been clear with an Oxidizer level of 10 or less. This Line Clean is certainly the mystery ingredient that has been thrown into the stewpot this summer with most unpredictable results.
Maybe THIS is what I've liked about baquacil - never a dull moment, nor what to expect next. I mean, c'mon guys....doesn't always knowing exactly how much chlorine and stabilizer to add, and the pool always looking sparkling clear sorta get old after awhile? Where's the challenge in that??
lol....
Sometimes it's really good not to have any close neighbors- like when you're totally p-off at how things are going with the pool. I'm treading on little cat feet - just added 2 quarts of Oxidizer - dreading that within an hour some toxic reaction would again make its appearance and not allow me to get within 3 feet of the fence without a gas mask for the next 10 days - but - didn't happen, so looks like another good swim this evening. I only added 2 parts of CDX instead of the usual 5. Wasn't brave enough. So weird how the water has been clear with an Oxidizer level of 10 or less. This Line Clean is certainly the mystery ingredient that has been thrown into the stewpot this summer with most unpredictable results.
Maybe THIS is what I've liked about baquacil - never a dull moment, nor what to expect next. I mean, c'mon guys....doesn't always knowing exactly how much chlorine and stabilizer to add, and the pool always looking sparkling clear sorta get old after awhile? Where's the challenge in that??
lol....Google Earth has really come a long way...
Yeah man, Don’t upset the fragile balance of the universe.
Everybody has their own ‘thing’. Maybe yours is this like you said
As if the pool situation wasn't bad enough this summer, an x-ray taken today reveals a compression deformity of the superior endplate of the L1 vertebrae. I knew I did something worse than a sprain earlier this summer - one of those TOTALLY stupid things that you do that you wish you could take back. Worse pain I've ever had. So now ordered to 'take things easy'. So hopefully the filter will continue to behave. Should have gone to have it checked back in June already. Hopefully next summer will be kinder to me than this one has been.
Yeah man, you ain't kidding. Statistically speaking I don't think it can be worse.
Rest up and feel better.