What did I inherit with this new house?

[peacefulkancer]

I moved into a new house about two months ago and have thus changed pools. I actually really liked my old pool and everything was operating just as it should. The new house, not so much.

The Pump:
The pool pump has difficulty priming, if it primes at all. Secondly, it sounds like an AC130 taking off. It is seriously loud.

Filter:
The Hayward Pro-Grid D.E. filter is garbage. I have completely disassembled and it looked as if it hadn't been cleaned in like 5 years. The filter tank was about 1/3 of solid mud at the bottom, to start. The top manifold also was not treated well, so that is cracked. Putting that all back together was a nightmare compared to my old Pentair.

As of right now the system won't prime. It is almost like whatever dirt was in there was holding it together? I'm a bit confused by it all as I don't see water leaking anywhere and if I cut out the piping by putting water directly into pump basket the pump will pump that water fine. If I switch the slide-valve assembly to backwash it seems to backwash, but not with a lot of velocity. But it won't prime, so maybe an issue with the slide valve?

So I don't know if I am just longing for my old setup or if I really need to upgrade (or do some serious repairs).

At the very least I need to replace:
DE grids as they are all broken at the top (DEX3600DA (x7) + DEX3600DS (x1), $100)
DE tank large O-ring (DEX2422Z2, $45)
DE manifold (DEX2400C, $50)

Since the pump sounds terrible and has been running dry for who knows how long with previous owners... I probably at least need to rebuild the pump's bearings/o-rings. I'm not even sure what pump body I have as there are no markings but I think it looks like a Pentair.

So my question is... do I just attempt to rebuild and hope I can figure it out... or do I use this chance to upgrade? I have wanted to upgrade to a dual or VS pump since my last house but wasn't going to just do that at my last place with working equipment. I've also thought about a Pentair Quad DE, but I've also been interested in just going filter (are they good for places like Arizona?). I know the amount of money is up to me... but I'm looking for suggestions on whether it is better to salvage what I have or just cut ties with equipment that obviously has been abused and has a lot of outstanding issues. Also, the pad that the equipment sits on is like 8-12" below the ground level around it. I had to un-bury the equipment (hence the piles of dirt around it) to get to it so I may use an upgrade opportunity to properly set the equipment up.

Thanks for your time!




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And if I upgrade, there is a fair chance I'd look into getting a SWG again. LOL, money is adding up on this upgrade.

 

[smitty195]

IMHO... I would take this opportunity to upgrade to a vs pump... the savings alone means it will pay for itself in a very short amount of time..
Im not a great lover of DE filters as i believe a good cartridge filter works almost as well as a DE filter... less the messing about with carcinogens.
However.... its not my money im spending so the decision is entirely up to you.
When i changed over to a vs pump it paid for itself in the first year.... good luck with your decision.

 

[Mayorb]

That's a Sta-Rite pump, now owned by Pentair. Check the pump lid o-ring, also the stem o-rings in the Jandy valve. It sounds like the motor needs replacing so a new seal would be in order regardless whether that was an issue. Getting the pump running correctly would be you main priority at this point.

Depending on the pool, I have found that many (not all) of the 36 sf filters tend to clog quickly and have short run cycles. They need frequent cleanouts. When you have the ability to get into a new filter, I'd recommend the Pentair Quad 60. The curved panel DE filters should have gone away with the last century. The Quad filter is a snap to open, cleanout, and re-assemble. The filter has 4 easy to clean (true "rinse off") cartridges.

I would like to let others know that when buying a house with a pool, get the pool inspected by a pool tech. Some home inspectors are totally inept on pools. A customer of mine had a home inspector look at the pool equipment and blasted it for having leaks EVERYWHERE. What he saw was condensation. In many cases if the pool equipment is in rough shape, an allowance can be worked into the sale, usually 1-2 thousand.

 

[peacefulkancer]

IMHO... I would take this opportunity to upgrade to a vs pump... the savings alone means it will pay for itself in a very short amount of time..
Im not a great lover of DE filters as i believe a good cartridge filter works almost as well as a DE filter... less the messing about with carcinogens.
However.... its not my money im spending so the decision is entirely up to you.
When i changed over to a vs pump it paid for itself in the first year.... good luck with your decision.

I am not in love with DE. Which is why I'm open to the hybrid Quad and just a filter only.

Not into sand.

Thanks for your input.

 

[peacefulkancer]

That's a Sta-Rite pump, now owned by Pentair. Check the pump lid o-ring, also the stem o-rings in the Jandy valve. It sounds like the motor needs replacing so a new seal would be in order regardless whether that was an issue. Getting the pump running correctly would be you main priority at this point.

Depending on the pool, I have found that many (not all) of the 36 sf filters tend to clog quickly and have short run cycles. They need frequent cleanouts. When you have the ability to get into a new filter, I'd recommend the Pentair Quad 60. The curved panel DE filters should have gone away with the last century. The Quad filter is a snap to open, cleanout, and re-assemble. The filter has 4 easy to clean (true "rinse off") cartridges.

I would like to let others know that when buying a house with a pool, get the pool inspected by a pool tech. Some home inspectors are totally inept on pools. A customer of mine had a home inspector look at the pool equipment and blasted it for having leaks EVERYWHERE. What he saw was condensation. In many cases if the pool equipment is in rough shape, an allowance can be worked into the sale, usually 1-2 thousand.

I have liked the Pentair Quad xx for some time now, but I've also heard that here in the Southwest that filters are a good option. In either case, I'm either going with a filter only or a Quad with DE.

I did inspect the pump lid o-ring and it looks good, but I suppose it could be bad.

As for having it inspected, it was. It was inspected and problems noted in the BINSR prior to the sale. The buyer had someone come out and "repair it." I'm guessing they were told to do it as cheap as possible, because it was priming for a while and then it stopped. They probably gummed something up with a ton of silicone lube and now I've washed that away or dislodged it. After their work the pump was of course still screaming which I noted and worked out a cash deal to replace the pump. So with that said... I don't think I have much to stand on a home buyer since I noted problems in the BINSR, the buyer "fixed them" enough to show they were working, and then a few months later I am at where I'm at. Sure, I could have argued the point more, but I guarantee that I would have lost the house which I had been waiting for about 10 months for the right house at the right price to come along.

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There is someone selling a Pentair Quad 60 here in town, used of course, for $200. They say it comes with filters in good condition, but I haven't seen them. Unit comes off of a refurbished pool. I know new they are about $700, so is this a deal of a lifetime or suspicious with the quality of the filters?

 

[peacefulkancer]

Posting this for reference as this seems like my pump: Sta Rite Dura-Glas And Max-E-Glas Parts Series Pe - Pea - P2Ra - P2R Pool Pump Parts - Discount Parts For Sta Rite Dura-Glas And Max-E-Glas Parts Series Pe - Pea - P2Ra - P2R Pumps

So I decided to just go ahead and replace any consumables (o-rings, bearings, etc) and see how that works out. If that fails, then I'm out $25 and I move onto a new pump or other items. If it works, this buys me some time until the end of season to see about replacing some items that I'd like/need to replace.

 

[peacefulkancer]

So I installed the o-rings and bearings to get me through last summer and that was OK but it is now time to upgrade this lil mini-disaster. I am looking to upgrade pretty much everything in the above pictures - valves, pipes, pump, and filter. Strongly considering adding a SWG as I loved having one on old pool.

For the filter looking to go with the Pentair Quad 80 or 100 even though that is way more than I need for my modest pool.

Looking for suggestions for a pump though. I believe I would like to go with a variable speed but am a little confused as to what to get since my pipes are all different sizes. If it was 2" in and 2" out I'd assume that almost any VS pump would work but I have 2" in and 1.5" out.

Suggestions?

 

[Jimrahbe]

P,

Unlike single speed pumps, there is no problem with having a large variable speed pump on a small pool...

Think of it this way... Your car may have 200 HP but that does not mean you can't drive it through a School Zone...

VS pumps should be called variable horsepower pumps.. you just use the HP you want. Large HP VS pumps even use less electrical energy than smaller VS pumps.. (But not by much..)

I have a couple of pools at rent house that have 3 HP IntelliFlo pumps and 1.5" plumbing and they have been working just fine for over four years or so.

If you plan to get a SWCG, then having a VS pump is the only way to go.. I love my SWCG, but it does mean having to run your pump longer..

VS pumps cost so little to run at low RPMs that it just does not matter.. For reference, I can run my 3 HP Intelliflo, at 1200 RPM, 24/7 for less than $20 bucks a month...


Thanks for posting and allowing us to spend your money.. Go big or go home..

Jim R.

 

[peacefulkancer]

JimR, thanks for the reply!
So what about versions? It seems like the normal Pentair IntelliFlo VS (011018) is the basic/core model and would suit most people. I'd guess that the VS-SVRS and the VF would be wasted money since I don't have a bunch of features nor am I really worried about sucking kids into drains.

As for control all I want to do is run it at low speed all day and then off during the peak time (2hrs). I guess with the side port cleaner I'd have to speed it up for a little bit during the day too, right? I think the 11018 allows for you to set various speeds throughout the day so correct me if wrong.

 

[Jimrahbe]

P,

The IntelliFlo 011018 is a great pump... and, you are correct you don't want the SVRS version and don't need the VF version.

There is a newer model that allows you to rotate the control head.. (Not sure of p/n..) It would also be a good choice and would allow you to mount the control head on a wall if you wanted. Depending on your plumbing configuration, the pump's control panel on the 011018, may be upside down. This is not a problem with automation, but a real pain if you have a tight equipment pad...

An even newer model has the ability to be a VS or VF pump all in one unit.. (Not sure of that p/n either...)

If you ever decide to go with automation, the IntelliFlo pumps are the only one that the EasyTouch can control..

You can program the pump to come on and off, at whatever speed you want for each time period.. You can also manually push buttons on the pump and override any scheduled program..

Thanks for posting,

Jim R.

 

[peacefulkancer]

Jim,
As I'm going through my upgrade I am wondering about automation. When looking at the IC40 one can get it with the controller or the EasyTouch for a few hundred more ($830 vs $1200). But is it worth it for my setup?

I read your post here.

And I am thinking to myself, that I don't have a spa, water features, heater, no landscaping lights, and my pool equipment is not far from my pool so it isn't like I have to make a trek to walk to the equipment pad... so is it worth it in my scenario (I know is it "worth it" is subjective)? Also, I'd be adding it after the fact so installation won't be as straight forward as if it was a new pool build, either.

My thoughts for pro:
1. Clean up the boxes on the wall. I'd get to replace the mechanical timer, the light switch, and not have the IC40 power center box on the wall.
2. Better control. I can control the Intelliflo VS and IC40 and pool cleaner to be as efficient as possible. But even so, right now all I have for a pool cleaner is a Baracuda G3, so hardly intelligent).
3. Smart valves/actuators. I'm already planning on redoing all my piping, plus the current Jandy Valves.

Cons:
1. I don't have a lot of devices to control nor do I plan on adding anything else.
2. Retroactive installation. If wires aside from the incoming power needs to be ran, my pool is already established and I am not looking to tear stuff up.
3. Cost. Is $370 worth it? Is controlling only two things, maybe a few more if I really "find" stuff to control worth it? If I do it, I feel like I'd want to get the wireless remote to make it worth it so that is an additional $350.

Your thoughts are appreciated.

 

[Jimrahbe]

P,

No one needs automation.. for that matter no one really needs a pool...

I built my pool to enjoy it... I doubt it will add any value to my house and might even make it harder to sell... But I could not care less.. it is not why I built my pool..

Automation is the same.. I enjoy having it.. I enjoy being able to look at my PC and see that my pump is running and at what speed, I enjoy being able to adjust my SWCG from inside my house, and I just enjoy having it... Is it worth it??? It is to me, but may not be worth it for you..

I have a friend that is a gun nut. He really enjoys buying new guns and all the options that go along with them. I think he is nuts, but it is what he enjoys.. I'm sure he thinks I'm nuts.. So it works well for both of us..

Sorry, but you are on your own on this one...

Thanks for posting,

Jim R.

 

[peacefulkancer]

No offense, but I'll never understand why people answer questions in this manner. All I'm asking is if my current setup/equipment makes it hard to install and use to any degree of worthiness.

 

[tstex]

Peace,

Jim is just trying to give you multiple examples of preferences, but all that really matters is what you like or not.

If I were to make a call, if I were you I would skip the automation, mainly bc you have so few things and if you buy a new pump [and the only thing you're running on the pad], you can program it all from the pump. you will have to manually turn on waterfall and anything else, unless you get an auxiliary pump for your waterfall that is programmable too. Automation is for convenience and control other than the pad too. Since you would be only working on the equip pad, you do not have to make any wiring runs to the pool, so it's a pretty self-contained install. Automation is nice, but it's also more expensive an another element for potential failure.

If I were you, I would buy more robust programmable pumps that you can program and skip the automation.

Good luck either way, tstex

PS - my brother lives in chandler and we're driving there from TX for spring break. Can't wait to eat at RigaTony's.

 

[mknauss]

With a SWCG you will need a timer for it if you do not have automation.

Not a big deal, but something to consider.

 

[peacefulkancer]

I went ahead and went "all in" - got the ET4 and wired the ET with 100A just for anything I may add in the future. Now to figure out how to control from computer/phone/Alexa. Any help is appreciated.

Saw this thread but I feel like there are a ton of kits out there but I don't know what each kit does.
Wireless Control / Monitoring Options - Pentair EasyTouch?

 

[Jimrahbe]

P,

If you want to be able to control the ET from your phone or computer you pretty much have to have ScreenLogic2..

Here is a link... https://sunplay.com/products/pentair-screenlogic-interface-and-wireless-522104

This is the kit you need...

Here are a couple of screenshots to wet your ScreenLogic whistle...

Thanks for posting,

Jim R.