Hi, I've never had a pool before but now I have a 30 foot round 54 inch deep pool that my Nature 2 VisionPro refuses to keep chlorinated. I have a Hayward Century Pool & Spa 1081 Pool Pump Duty, a Swim Pro Voyager, and a 2HP Hayward. I was going to switch to a SWG but I was told it would not be good for the structure and that my equipment was probably not compatible. Replacing everything is so expensive that I think I want to just ditch the Nature 2 and go with a more traditional chlorinator. If a SWG is not a bad idea for an above ground pool, what is the most cost effective way to use what I have and make it a stable salt water pool?

I went to the pool store.. and they said that we should be using the "EZ Pool" chemicals. Now, we don't have any special "EZ Pool" equipment. They said that we could use the BBB method, but that it would be more complex.. and with EZ we don't have to test or do much of anything.. except add EZ every week.

Anybody have EZ Pool experience.. or could shed some light on this topic?

Hi all,

We have been looking for ways to reduce our energy consumption as we have bills that are $400+ during the summer. One idea is to switch our pool pump to a variable speed. I was looking through the forum for advice as we’d like to do this ourselves. I took a photo of our current motor but am having a hard time figuring out what VSP we would replace with. Any advice is SUPER appreciated.




Would like to add a general thanks to all for all of the super detailed info found in forums and the pool school. Our pool is the envy of the neighbors and friends, especially the ones who constantly struggle to get theirs “clean”. It’s really not terrible when you get a test kit and dial those levels in!

I just had the plaster installed on my new build pool this past Tuesday with Wet Edge Altima Gray. On Wednesday and Thursday, another crew came to polish the plaster then acid wash and power wash. It’s look and feels good.

One of the polishers said that in one small area on one of the wall, some of the plaster started coming off while he was polishing. It made hole in the new plaster. They called in one of the plaster guys to patch it and he said it needed at least two hours of drying time so they worked around it. When the finished they assured me that once it cured it would be the same color. So far it is much darker and stands out. The pool was then filled with water and I can still see it under the water. It’s an eyesore. I sent a picture to the PB project manager and haven’t heard back so I called the owner of the plaster company and am awaiting a call back.

I won’t sign off on the pool and pay the remainder of the money until it’s fixed. Just wondering how it will be fixed to match. Very disappointing!!!!!

7/23/2024, 11:15am: We have achieved our $10,000 goal! Thank you again to all who have made this campaign so successful!
The benefits of donating during the campaign (see below) will still be active until August 31st, 2024.

Welcome to Trouble Free Pool’s 2025 Campaign! We are seeking to raise $10,000 by August 31st. These funds will cover website expenses and help us to improve our content for all pool owners.

Trouble Free Pool is a 501C3 nonprofit powered exclusively by user donations. We do not display advertisements and our resources are distributed for free. Our TFP supporters are those responsible for “keeping the lights on” and enabling this community to continue growing. If you have ever donated money or spent time helping others on this site, we sincerely thank you for your generosity.

As a TFP supporter, you will receive discounts to online retailers, free TFP merchandise, and a recognition badge on our forums. This year, everyone who donates during the campaign will receive $5 off their next order at TFtestkits.net, regardless of the amount of their donation. They will also receive a 2025 Campaign Trophy to display proudly on their forums profile.

On June 28th 2024, TFP registered its 400,000th member. This summer has been a busy one already and the sheer size of that number gave us pause. How lucky we are to be a part of this enormous, amazing community! TFP’s prolific growth highlights the need for continued revisions and refinements to our resources. As our current website begins to show its age, we must plan for an overhaul to better reach new pool owners. These Campaign funds will enable us to act on those plans.

Thank you on behalf of the TFP administration!

Sarah and Nate
[email protected]

Hey all. I don't pop in a lot but have been around here since the get go. So in 2022 we moved our pool to a new spot on the farmstead (1/8 miles) after it sat since 2016. This was a pool we'd ordered in 2005 along with an AquaRite SWG system. When we moved it over to the new yard and set up again in late summer 2022, we only installed the pool and hadn't yet installed anything additional - no solar panels, pump, nothing. We closed and opened last year to cut in the skimmer and attach the pump and filter. It was HOT so no solar needed yet. We wanted to build a new rack system this spring and incorporate the SWG so I sanitized old school with chlorine jugs. Long story short - I found out that my husband hadn't brought over the AquaRite equipment and in fact it was still at the old yard buried under rubble and dirt where he pushed down the old shed - since 2017. I dug it all out, cleaned it up, bought a new flow switch and turbo cell. I saw that the control board was filled with spiders and Asian beetles as well as a broken thermal limiter. Lucky thing is that the last time I ordered in 2014 (correction - 2012 according to the invoice) I ordered 2 of them and still had the new limiter. Soldered in that sucker and we are operational!!!! Everything is working properly. Hoping this doesn't jinx me! Also - I'm ordering 2 new inrush limiters today ($13 is a cheap fix)

3 years ago my old Polaris 280 had a number of problems, and on the advice of a pool maintenance company I bought a new Polaris 3900. However, I was never very happy with it because it was not "peppy" -- seemed to crawl around where the older model zipped -- and the tail never really swept at all, where on the 280 the tail had been very effective at brushing the walls and sweeping debris to the drain.

The thing was serviced by a maintenance company at the beginning of each season, but the problems just never got any better. This year the problems were noticeably worse, to the point where the corners of the pool were collecting dirt lines that never got swept away. However, the (new) pool company took a look and claimed that there was nothing wrong with the Polaris, and that this is just an underperforming model.

Last week I finally had some little free time so I decided to do some research into the problem. I found hundreds of owners complaining online of the same problems, but I didn't find anybody with a solution.

I counted the wheel rotations and found only 22 RPM where the expected speed is 32-34 rotations per minute for the large wheel (per the user manual). I disassembled the 3900 and did not find any obvious problems, so I called Zodiac.

The nice man at Zodiac told me to remove the flow restriction disk installed at the wall -- but of course there is no flow restriction disk installed. Then he told me my Polaris booster pump was not producing enough pressure or enough flow to drive the 3900. This was not a reasonable suggestion, because the pressure release valve at the wall was blowing off a LOT of water and the flow was more than sufficient to make the backup valve work perfectly. So I thanked the nice man and hung up the phone. I realized that I would have to solve this problem myself, so even though I was pretty sure the booster pump was putting out plenty of water at a high pressure, I decided to prove or disprove this definitively before looking inside the 3900 for some kind of subtle problem.

I learned from another nice person at Zodiac that the 3900 requires 8-10 Gallons per minute at a pressure of 32 - 34 PSI when measured at the end of the supply tubing (after the backup valve).

I went on Amazon and ordered a combination pressure and flow meter (built by Toro). It arrived in just 2 days even though it wasn't sold by Amazon directly. This is a light-duty meter intended for occasional use with a hose bibb. It has a hose faucet connector, so I cut one end off an old garden hose, screwed it onto the meter, and clamped the open end of the garden hose directly to the Polaris backup valve (the inside diameter was a perfect fit, but the screw-on tightener is designed for the thicker wall of the polaris hose, so I used a hose clamp to make sure it didn't blow off under high pressure).

I turned on the booster pump and closed the flow control knob completely, and found that my static pressure was 60PSI -- that's pretty high -- and when the flow control knob was opened enough to allow a flow rate of 8 GPM, the pressure was 34 PSI, which is exactly what the 3900 requires. Just for interest, I also checked the pressure before the backup valve, and found that the backup valve itself introduces a drop in pressure of about 5 PSI, presumably due to flow restriction from the internal mechanism.

With plenty of flow at the right pressure entering the "critter," the problem had to be in the 3900 itself.

I took it apart again and this time I went over everything with a fine tooth comb, and with the absolute conviction that the problem was somewhere inside the critter. Armed with those tools and a magnifying glass, I did in fact find several problems that had not been immediately obvious.

The first problem was that the tail flow control assembly had two O-rings installed where there should only be one. This actually prevented the flow regulator from down-regulating the flow to the tail, and also made it extremely difficult to turn the tail sweep control valve at all -- something I had noticed from day one. OK, one definite problem resolved, except that this fix still would not help me create *increased* tail sweep -- I would now be able to turn the sweep down, but I needed to turn it UP. I looked more closely at the mechanism of the sweep flow control. Basically, there are two plastic surfaces pushed against each other, each with a small half-circle cut out to allow water through. If the tail control is rotated so the two half-circles line up, the maximum amount of water comes through. If one piece is rotated 180 degrees, the two half circles will not overlap at all, and no water will come through.

I connected the tail assembly (with tail) to my flow measuring apparatus and turned up the pressure. The Polaris 3900 water management system delivers flow to six places: three cleaner siphon ports, the wheel drive, the balance jet, and the tail. But even when I gave the tail a full quarter of the total rated pressure, the water that came out was not up to the jet force and volume that I was used to seeing with the old Polaris 280. It seemed to me that the holes feeding the tail are just too small to allow enough flow through at the pressures being supplied. Therefore I decided to enlarge the two holes so that more water would come through when they were aligned. The alteration would mean that I could still turn down the flow, but I could no longer completely shut off water to the tail -- but why would I ever want that? I took a small file and enlarged the holes by about 30%. Instead of two half-circles, they now looked like slightly flattened footballs.

OK, the tail will get more water when turned to max open, and I can still turn it down most of the way if I need to. Now to debug the overall peppiness issue.

Since the wheel is driven by a jet of water that pushes a water-wheel, there had to be a loss of pressure somewhere in the circuit before that jet. I plugged all the holes in the lower water management system and blew into the device, and there were no leaks. I hooked up my flow pipe directly to the lower WMS to drive the jet directly, and -- wow -- the wheels turned like crazy when I put the rated pressure/flow into the WMS. I plugged the upper supply tube and blew air into it, and there were no leaks. That only left the connection between the upper supply tube and the lower WMS. This is an O-ring joint, and I inspected it closely with a lighted magnifier. Lo and behold, the slip joint itself is just a teensy bit loose, and (more importantly) the O- ring that was installed was not *quite* the correct size for the joint. The O-ring was just a little bit larger diameter than its intended seat, and also somewhat narrower than the bed it should have filled. Under magnification I could see areas where the O-ring had become crimped by being squeezed out of its bed. Just looking at it you would not be likely to think anything was wrong -- it hardly looked like enough to make any difference at all. Surely we couldn't be getting much loss of pressure through such a tiny gap? But of course we could.

I went to the hardware store and bought a correctly-sized O-ring and installed it. Then, since I happened to have the slightly over-size O-ring already in my hand, I slid it up inside the upper water supply tube to serve as a compression gasket between the lower water management system and the upper supply tube -- it snugged up in there very nicely, and even though it's not part of the original design, it can serve as a fail-safe in the event of leakage around the primary O-ring.

I did also put a little bit of stopcock grease on all of these surfaces (I have a tube left over from a chemistry lab I had back in 1976, and have found that the stuff works great in harsh marine environments).

Put everything back together, and fired it up, and got a big smile on my face as I watched the little critter go zipping around the pool, lashing its tail exactly the way I had been hoping. I swear, I felt peppier myself just watching it. And in fact my wife sat and watched it perform for about a half hour before she pulled herself away.

So bottom line: I think this thing probably came from the factory with the wrong size O-ring installed in the main water supply junction to the WMS, and with two O-rings instead of one in the tail valve assembly. For sure it came with the wrong size flow adjustment holes designed into the tail valve control mechanism. The original over-large O-ring worked semi-adequately when it was new -- it leaked enough to make the 3900 sluggish compared to other models, but not enough that it failed to clean the pool. Over a couple of years it got slightly extruded and a little bit stiff, and the leakage became worse to the point where the poor little guy was really anaemic and had low blood pressure!

If you have the same sluggishness problem I was experiencing, start by installing the right O-rings -- don't get a replacement for what's already in there, get one that really fits snugly and fills the ring bed. Then if you want more tail action, go ahead and file both half-moon holes a little larger (doing just one won't change anything). The tail modification works perfectly for me -- if I rotate the valve counter-clockwise the tail just lies there, and if I rotate it all the way clockwise it lashes like a live animal. I think Polaris ought to modify this part of their design, but TJMO

BTW, I also learned that there is an add-on tail tip available that will stop the tail from spraying water out of the pool when the critter climbs the wall and then dives back down. Recent models come with this already installed, but mine did not. At one time I might have wanted that feature, but after several years of lackadaisical tail droop, I'm kind of enjoying the occasional spritz, and the shrieks when somebody fully dressed gets unexpected attention from the critter

That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

MOD Insert:
While reviewing our monthly TFP photo contest thread, it occurred to us that we don't have a thread exclusively for funny, amazing, weird, or unusual pool pics. And you KNOW there are lots of them. How did we miss that one? A special thank you to @JessBlount617 for starting a similar thread of her own, so we joined forces here to showcase them all in one place.

So let's have some fun with some entertaining pics that don't necessarily qualify for our monthly TFP photo's contest categories, but are fun to look at anyway.

IMPORTANT - KEEP IT CLEAN PLEASE. TFP is family oriented, so nothing that crosses the line in taste or etiquette, otherwise we'll be forced to delete it. Other than that, feel free to share your funny, amazing, weird, and unusual pool pics here.

This fella was swimming around having a grand old time. My son says it’s a “rhino beetle”

Hello all. I’ve had this pool since July 2017. PermaSalt system has been perfect until this year. Mustard algae (looked like little sand deposits) and some greener algae under the two sets of steps. Couldn’t get rid of it. Algacide from the stores did nothing. Powdered shock did nothing. Started using jugs of 12.5% bleach from pool store. That got it all clear. Crystal clear for a week now. Bought a big test kit from Leslie’s. 89.00. It’s actually a Taylor Total Pool Care DPD Test Kit. But doesn’t have FAS DPD.
Any ways I’ve been going through an awful lot of chlorine gallons this past week. Water is crystal clear and has been for days now but chlorine levels are just disappearing so much it’s ridiculous. I’m waiting on a FAS DPD kit to arrive.

What can be causing all this chlorine to evaporate so quickly.
The pool store talked me into tabs floater to help maintain but a bit ago I looked up the chemical and it has stabilizer in them. Oh well.

Free .5
Total 1.5
Ph 7.5-7.6
TA 110
CH 220
CYA 57

Do I got home and ran the calculator with a target range of 4ppm and it said to add 63oz of 10% chlorine bleach. So I did. It also said to add 7 oz of muratic acid.

So as of now this is where I’m at. I can figure out the levels of most all chems, but the chlorine loss on a pristine looking pool has got me stumped. I don’t think I can afford like two gallons a day.

Saturday from sunup to sundown took 2.5 gallons to keep it just under 10ppm. But 10 is the upper limit on my tester for now.

Any ideas??

Thanks.

Hello,

I have been reading all the materials on this site and finding it to be immensely helpful. I also read the sections and forum posts related to Hydrochloric Acid (HCl) vs Sulphuric Acid (H2SO4). I understand that Hydrochloric Acid is quite a natural choice from a chemical perspective as it doesn't introduce additional sulphates.

However in Europe there are other practical issues that need to be taken into consideration. First of all land plots in Europe are smaller in comparison to the ones in US. Most of us have concrete pools and our water and acid pumps, SWG are all underground in a concrete closed room as opposed to an open air section behind a separator in US (at least it is what I see in youtube videos). HCl is more prone to fumes so this is an issue that needs to be evaluated in a closed room with poor ventilation.

Secondly, major acid pump producers caution against usage of HCl. I gathered below the manuals from 5 different acid pumps (one of them is in Spanish but same story).

https://beniferro.eu/wp-content/uploads/2021/09/Quickstart-Pool-Duo-HS-EN.pdf
https://www.amazon.de/-/en/Peristaltic-dosing-proportional-dosage-measurement/dp/B07PGKTKBT
BOMBA DOSEADORA POOL EASY - pH / Redox
Pool pH Dosing Pump
https://www.distripool.fr/medias/notice_technique/00.008.374_UM Micro Astral_rev1 (1).pdf

I also directly talked to a company that produces peristaltic pumps, they told me that hose damage is common when used with HCl.

In US there seems to be at least two producers, Hayward and Pentair, who seem to produce more amenable pumps. But they also emphasize the dilution of HCL to 16%, which is not a standard product around here so needs more handling from the pool owner's side.

https://www.hayward-pool.com.au/ass.../manuals/AQR-pH-upgrade-kit-owners-manual.pdf
https://www.hayward-pool.com.au/ass...ia/pdf/manuals/omnilogic-chem-pump-manual.pdf

Moreover it seems they need frequent maintenance as discussed on this site as well.

Pentair Intelliph - Further Reading

There seems to be more issues that need to be taken into consideration than the chemical simplicity of HCl. I have been dosing my pool automatically with H2SO4 (as described in Astral Micro PH manual, link above) for the last 2 years without any technical problems. Yes I have Calcium Sulphate accumulation in my pool as my water has 650 calcium hardness. But it is not really a showstopper. We also tend to replace the water every summer season. Pools are rarely kept operational during winter as it is cheaper to clean it beginning of summer than paying the electricity bill over the winter.

I really would like to switch to HCl to get rid of the swimming sulphates and better protect my SWG. My question is what I should do? Is it for example feasible to drill an exhaust pipe from HCl container that will carry the fumes outside of the pump room? Can I find a hose that is more durable to HCL? In general most pool owners just want to be pool enjoyers than pool masters (although it doesn't hurt to be one). Even though I learned all the inns and outs from this site, I am not sure if I want to disassemble my acid pump every year. Also when I am not around someone less capable needs to dilute the HCl. Currently our process is as simple as just dipping the hose from an empty container to a full one and tightening the lid. Or should I forget about this altogether?

Thanks

Hurricane season is here, and Texas is about to receive the first one of 2024. I won't bore you with repetitive hurricane prep notes. We have TONS of those already. From your home page search bar simply enter "Hurricane" or "Hurricane Prep" and you'll see all kinds of threads on how to prepare your pool and equipment.

This is simply a reminder to those who may be new to TFP and over-used products like tablets, powered shock, and/or cal-hypo, that with Hurricane Beryl approaching the Texas coastline in a couple days, you can take full advantage of that free rain. You might even consider lowering your pool's water in advance and allow the heavy rains to fill it for free.

For those of you in the southwest, you know already that August brings monsoon season. Storms roll-in like clockwork in the afternoon, so the same concept applies to you as well. Remove some water in advance to take advantage of those seasonal storm bursts to lower your CYA and/or CH as needed.

For anyone across the country in a storm's path who may have used copper-based products or be on a well (iron), same thing. The more metals removed from the pool the easier pool life is for you. Take advantage of the heavy rains when you can.

Stay safe everyone.

And so it begins. Previous links and related discussion provided below. Refer to that info and you should be fine. Be safe.

So easy! Post ONE pic related to the theme title above. I bet you have a good pic saved somewhere. See the contest rules below to enter.

PLEASE READ ----> TFP Pool of the Month Contest Rules​

Monthly themed photo contests are announced on the first, with a 10-day submission phase. Days 11-15 are for voting, with the winner announced on the 16th, eligible for a $50 prize.



It's easy! What have you got to lose? You might receive a $50 discount code from TFtestkits.net.

Click Here to See Some Previous TFP Monthly Contest Winners​

I recently encountered a raccoon problem with them visiting my pool. There is no deterrent that will work for those who are dealing with this issue(sprays, sprinklers, floating gators etc.).They will visit your shallow end and go for a swim plus defecate.

Calling a trapper is futile and expensive ($300) average cost. Once you get rid of one another will be back(possibly more than one). They will think your pool is “safe” to bathe. Your only solution is to dispatch. I live trap and dispatch with a .25 cal airgun. Once they are live trapped, you just need to hit between the eyes for a humane dispatch. (Shouldn’t be hard once in the live trap)

For the live traps you can cut down a couple thin strips of plywood. 1/4” plywood will do this is to extend the trap trigger. (Lay it over the trigger paddle) They are smart they will step over your standard metal trigger in the live trap. (Especially urban raccoons)

My go to bait is Twizzlers and small amount of cat food in a plastic shot glass (mini Solo cup).

Hope this helps those dealing with this issue and are at their wits end. I have them frequent my pool. Once I dispatch a few, then it takes a few weeks before anymore comes back. Rinse repeat. Just think you’re helping the neighborhood.

This week the app stores enabled Automatic Updates for PoolMath rolling out the update to all users. This is the same version that was released last month to users whom manually updated from the App Store, it’s just now being automatically updated users devices following the expiration of the 30 day “pause” that was put on before. I’d like to take a few seconds to update all on a few items we may see shortly plus a peak into the future.

As we move into the new framework of PoolMath we’ve noticed an uptick of users whom have “lost their data” when opening the App. We’re looking for the cause of this however users can restore their data in a few ways. Most of the time a simple logout/log back in helps sync the data once again however in extreme instances deleting the App and reinstalling takes care of the issue. We’re looking into this more however to get the user up and running asap logging out will address the issue most the time.

Next is the hiccup that’s been around for years, the issue of subscriptions not updating as expected. In this update we attempted again to improve this however it’s clear things still aren’t 100% perfect. We’ve kinda hit a point where we’re looking into hiring some outside assistance to improve this as we too are tired of letting the end user down.

In the meantime simply clicking the “Restore Subscription” will check the App stores and update your subscription. Clicking Restore will not double charge you so there’s no need to worry about that. If this fails please feel free to email us at [email protected] and we’ll be glad to assist further.

Lastly, we have some exciting progress to share. As we move forward with this update, we're thrilled to announce the upcoming Beta launch of a web version of PoolMath.


In the near future, we plan to make this new platform available for users to explore on their computers. However, we're not launching it just yet as we address a few finial issues. We appreciate your patience and understanding during this development phase.

Hi All,
New pool owner. We have a 16x26 pool. We recently made upgrades after buying the house with the pool. The pool guy we hired made some bad suggestions for equipment (I now know but didn't and went along) He installed the Pentair Easy Touch 8 (only have the pool with no spa or water features, so didn't really need the 8 for what we have). he also installed the Intellichlor SWCG and a Hayward VSP900 pump. Since installing the new pump, we don't really have any control over the pump via the Pentair screenlogic connect and since we purchased the home as a vacation home, we would like to control as much as possible remotely via the Pentair automation. Is there a way to wire this Hayward variable speed pump to the Pentair Easy touch so that we can control scheduling and pump speeds?? Heck...currently we can't even turn pump off/on remotely the way it is wired up.

Thanks.....George

Good Morning,

Im in the middle of a SLAM just over a week and even though my CC and OCLT are always passing still can’t get past that partial green and cloudy stage ( can see bottom of pool but still green and cloudy). So im questions my CYA number. Right now I believe it’s 50. Anyway, I read in 2 different posts about the test where one said first step to combine R-13 and pool water in tube, the “shake then wait 30 seconds”. I also read where it said “shake for 30 SECONDS then wait”. Not sure if that would even make a difference but is there?

So we picked up a new/used SUV earlier this month. 2023 Rogue with only 700 miles. Virtually flawless - except ...... it was a fleet vehicle and apparently it was the go-to smoker's vehicle. Otherwise it's immaculate. We knew getting it would be challenging, but I'm all-in for a good challenge, so we got it. For the life of me I can't crack the final code on that smell. It's not nearly as bad as before, but it still lingers a bit. Here's what I've done thus far:

- Interior head-to-toe/front-to-rear vacuum and deep cleaning with my extraction tool; used Odoban cleaner too (5Xs).
- Literally with cleaner, hand brushes, and even Q-Tips, hit every inch, crack, and crevice for residual material.
- Removed all floor mats, rear truck shelving, etc and deep cleaned outside the vehicle.
- New cabin filter
- With AC on high (fresh air), sprayed duct cleaner/Lysol through the outside intake under the hood. Then placed AC on Recirculate and did the same thing from the air intake by the passenger's feet area.
- Bought a new ozone machine doing several treatments anywhere from 20 min to an hour at a time; probably about 10 attempts so far.
- Hand-brushed and damp cleaned the headliner (gotta be very careful with those).
- Treated the seatbelts
- Deep cleaned/extracted the carpets I think 3 times now.
- I've detailed this interior about five times now with Odoban as my primary cleaning agent and using a 4" round nylon brush on my cordless drill for scrubbing. The dirty water pulled from my extractor is not nearly as dirty as in the early stages, but still comes out light brown. Hard to tell if it's nicotine related or just dirt, body oils, etc.

I'm at the point now where I'm just trying to find a good air freshener to help mask the residual smell for a while until hopefully one day the smoke smell fades away completely, but everything I've tried is a bust. Odoban tubs, Febreze new car smell spray (nope), Chemical Guys new car smell in a bottle (don't waste your time).

So, do any of you have any tips/tricks I might have missed or could try? Any good car freshener products that were a homerun for you?

Firstly some background information:

Location: Sydney, Australia (well, just an hour north near Gosford)
Pool volume: 22,000 L (4850 gallons)
Salt water chlorinator
Pool cover mostly kept on except when swimming
No opening/closing routine for winter/summer. Coldest it gets here is around 5 deg C (40 deg F)
Age of pool: 2 years, so pretty new.
Surface: plaster - beadcrete.
Chem test kit from Clear Choice Labs (very similar to Taylor I believe). I also take a sample to my local pool shop.

I don't know which forum to post this in as it falls under multiple headings, but I figure Water Chemistry might be the most appropriate.

So onto the query!
Last November we had a big windstorm which deposited a fair bit of leaves and debris (dust, twigs etc) into the pool.
I hadn't tested or checked the water for about a week (it's under my pool cover) but when I uncovered the water, it was a bit green & chlorine level was basically 0 as expected with all that Crud!
So I increased the chlorinator level & added extra liquid chlorine to clear up the outbreak. I basically SLAMmed with a big dose of liquid chlorine for a few days.
Vacuumed, backwashed a few times.
A few days later & we're all good. Nice clear water.
I mention the above as that seemed to be the start of my issues - whether it has any bearing or not I don't know, maybe just coincidence.

But I was never able to keep the chlorine level at appropriate levels, around the 4 to 5 ppm.

Since I have had the pool, my chlorinator would run for about 9 to 10 hours a day split between day and night, so 5 hours in the day and 4 hours at night. And it's chlorination level was about 35%. That is summertime. In the winter, it's about 7 hours at 5%.

But since the November incident I cannot get a chlorine reading above 1 (usually 0 to 0.5) & I have increased the running to 11 hours a day, running at 95%.
I just don't know what is causing the low levels - either something is consuming the chlorine e.g. algae. Or the chlorinator isn't producing chlorine to it's pre November levels. By the way, I can visually see the chlorine getting produced by the cell blades so I know it IS working.

All other chem levels (CYA, salt, TA, CH, phosphates et al) are well within correct ranges although I have always found it hard to maintain the recommended CYA level (70 to 80) so the CYA is typically around 50 but it drops quickly so each week I find I need to add more CYA to keep it at the 50 mark or thereabouts. That has always been the case but just mentioning it in case it has any relevance.

I did have low salt thanks to flooding rains over 2022 but I have since thrown in a few bags of salt so all good there. It's currently sitting around 5000 ppm.
I vacuum every 4 to 5 days using a robot (this one Dolphin S 200)

Over the following weeks, I have kept a close eye on chem levels, and have added liquid chlorine just to boost the chlorine level.
Nevertheless, just before Xmas I submitted a warranty claim on the chlorinator as I had eliminated just about every other option.

Last Friday (today is Tuesday) the technician came out and replaced the chlorinator with a new controller and cell, so the whole kit was replaced with new (or what I assume is new).
So it's 4 days later & was hoping to see chlorine levels back up to 5 ppm or even higher as it's running 11 hours a day at 95%.
But alas, the chlorine levels are still in the small 0.nn range.

I am completely baffled why I can't get good chlorine levels.

(There a two threads about 0021 errors, but TFP policy basically says "no necro posting" Thread number 3 follows)

OK, first time listener, first time caller.

My Superflo is also giving err 0021's. I pulled the 5 pin connector, squirted contact cleaner, put the plug back and... no change. The area under the "black box" is dry - the pump is in a utility shed (AKA "pump palace" with lots of room, no weather intrusion). I'm fairly certain the problem is related to clearing a 0002 code (pulled volute, cleaned diffuser and impeller, end of problem). The black box flapped around while I worked on the pump. My guess is I did something rude to the wiring. Maybe not.

I looked up the price for "Pentair Drive / Cover Kit 353127 ". The best I can do is $389. For a $700 pump? Puh-leeze! The pump was bought in April, '17 which, I think, puts us well outside the warranty window.

What, aside from the 5 pin connector, can produce 0021? Since I'm out of warranty, I'm not too worried about opening the "warranty void if opened" (security) screws. Has anyone been inside the black box? If so, anything in particular to look for?

(While the SuperFlo isn't the latest and greatest pump, it's done the job so far. Would I buy it again? Yes. Do I worry about a custom schedule? No. "If it ain't broke, don't fix it".)

Hello TFP Community,

I wanted to take a moment to thank all the members of Trouble Free Pool, especially the TFP experts, guides, and moderators, for all the hard work you have done in this community. Your dedication and expertise have made this a truly valuable resource for pool owners everywhere.

I'm excited to share that later today or likely early tomorrow, we will surpass 400,000 users. This milestone is a true testament to the strength and value of our community, where members continually assist and support one another.

Thank you all for your contributions and commitment!

Hey Folks !!!

With a large pool, I need 4lbs of CYA to only raise it 15, and I don't think I have that many socks without holes in them. So I use a Tshirt. Plus, I like that it's doubled up for redundancy. But it can also be scaled down with socks.

So I measure out my dose and can get 4 lbs in my kitchen scale. If I need more I do 4+2, etc.




Then I dump it on the chest.



I sack it up careful to get all the sides and tie it off



Then I roast tie it for support and add a loop to hang it.



I weigh down the pool pole so it doesn't tip in and soak the bag in front of a return. You want it just far enough to be way clear of the wall, but close enough it still has good movement.



With warm water these days. It's mush 2 hours later. In the spring I let it go a full day. This part was hard to get a pic while shaking, but you get the idea. Some squeezes and a bunch of shakes and it comes right out. Brush well after.




5 mins of making clouds later, just a little is left. The shirt gets hosed off and sun dried for next time.

I used to use a Barracuda G3 cleaner and last year I dumped the Barracuda for a Maytronics Active 20. The Active 20 worked reasonably well, but the wall cleaning was really disappointing. It would rarely manage to climb the wall all the way to scrub the tiles, instead slipping off the wall and back down most of the time, only cleaning the tiles in occasional spots here and there.

Anyway, I never took the battery powered vacuum cleaners very seriously until I heard forum members talking about the Aiper Scuba S1 and giving it similar plaudits to the Betta. I considered getting the S1, but I have a kidney-shaped hopper bottom pool and the complaints about the S1 sometimes having difficulty with that kind of pool was a real concern.

During my research I found the Wybot C1, which seemed to be more or less in a similar class, less expensive than an S1, and the reviews didn't seem to complain about pool shape or slope, so I figured for $400, I might as well take a chance.

In short, it wildly exceeded my expectations. It completely blows away the much more expensive Active 20 at wall climbing and waterline scrubbing. It's not even close. It'll climb the wall until it's vertical a couple feet below the water line, pause, and then the impeller will appear to kick into high gear to increase traction and then it'll go right on up to the surface and get to work. It has a dedicated wall mode where it'll just scoot to the right and repeat around the perimeter of the pool.

It cleans the bottom just fine, and it does a much better job than the Active 20 at climbing steps and cleaning them as well (though brushing steps is still a good idea either way). No issues whatsoever climbing from the deep end to the shallow end of the pool.

The basket is roughly similar to the Active 20 with a hinged bottom. You can't swap out the mesh sides but it has a much better no-return flap than the Active 20 does, so it appears to be better at sucking up leaves where the Active 20 sometimes sucks them up and sometimes pushes them around. I'll follow up in the fall when leaf pickup will be a lot more challenging. There is no fine pleated filter mesh option like the Active 20, so that's a point in Maytronics' favor. Putting the basket back in the robot is a little bit fussy until you get used to the right angle to use. Once you have that down, it's fine.

The app is mandatory if you want to change settings, so something to think about there if you have an aversion to apps. Speaking of which, there are a variety of modes and patterns (different wall patterns, different floor patterns) to select from so you can find whatever works best for your situation. You can even select from a variety of pool shapes and materials in the app, but I'm not sure if the pool characteristics actually affect the robot at all. The app can sometimes be a bit fussy in that it's sometimes confusing about whether the robot picked up the mode switch or not. My advice is to set the desired cleaning mode and pattern, wait for the app to say "Successfully Sent!" and then let it get to work - but double check to see that the robot is behaving consistently with the requested mode.

One very nice feature the app provides is "scheduled cleaning". The robot will set aside 120 minutes of its 150 minute putative run time and split it up across 2,3, or 7 days for floor cleaning only (no walls). This is a really fantastic feature and since the robot is cordless, it's much more practical to leave the robot in the pool 24/7 - no ugly tangled cords running around the pool and the Betta and C1 coexist peacefully throughout the week. The pool has never been this clean day after day with minimal effort on my part before. I typically use 3-day mode and bring up the robot to charge in the middle of the week when I get back from work before dropping it back in the next morning.

Unfortunately, these schedules are "take it or leave it" - you can't tailor the timing or run time at all. For example, the 7 day schedule cleans every other day for 30 minutes, but you can't ask it to clean for a consecutive four days at 30 minutes a day, something I would have appreciated, or five days skipping only one day somewhere in between.

The robot is supposed to park itself at the waterline when it's done to be easily picked up, it doesn't seem to be very well implemented. You don't get any notification on your phone that it's done and ready to be picked up so in practice I just find the robot parked at the foot of the wall.

Charging is a piece of cake - you just unscrew a cap on the top of the robot and plug in the charger. There's nothing tricky or difficult about taking off the cap or putting it back on - it works exactly like you'd imagine it should. The charger wires are a little too thin IMHO and easily strained - mine came with a pretty good bend right at the edge of the strain relief and this made me a little worried about the longevity of the wire. Also replacement chargers are very expensive from Wybot - somewhere around $80-100 IIRC. Speaking of which, Wybot doesn't seem to carry much in the way of parts, so if the robot dies out of warranty, it may be hard to keep it in service. That's less of an issue considering the reasonable price, but it would be a shame to throw out a whole robot for want of a small part sometime down the road.

Overall, as long as the longevity is there, my impression is that the Wybot C1 is amazing for the price. If it only had filter mesh as nice as the Active 20 I'd really question if the Maytronics robot serves a purpose at all anymore. I've never used or seen an Aiper Scuba S1 in use so I can't say how the Wybot compares to that, but since it climbs the slopes of my pool fine, at least in terms of performance and navigation it appears to be a good alternative for folks with hopper bottoms and freeform shapes.

Hopefully this is helpful for folks looking in this space. If anyone has any questions I'll respond as best as I can as time permits.

Follow another post of mine and you'll hear about me frying my Pentair ScreenLogic Wireless interface. After pricing a new one at $150-$200 I decided to come up with a cheaper solution. I moved the protocol adapter inside the easytouch panel and bought a wireless bridge for under $20. Everything mounted inside the panel and now the Protocol adapter is on my LAN just as it was prior.
Here's what I used.

Hope this helps someone.
-J

After more than 6 months of designs, working with builders/contractors, I finally pulled the trigger on a build. It cost me almost double what I set out to pay, but the more time I invested, the less corners I wanted to cut. I wouldn't be here with this builder if it wasn't for an individual on this forum that reached out and shared their build story and provided a referral to their builder. This build includes the following basic design elements (much more represented in pictures):

- 784 sq ft, 123 perimeter ft rectangle pool (38' x 26')
- 29,000 gallons
- Pentair Salt Water Setup
- 70 sq ft spa
- 400,000 BTU gas heater for pool/spa
- 1,050 sq ft Travertine coping (excluding foundations for bathroom, equipment, stairs, etc)
- 75 sq ft bathroom (vanity, urinal, toilet, shower)
- Fencing and Screening of Existing deck
- 620 sq ft cabana with outdoor kitchen w/ 35 sq ft granite counter-top
- (Not pictured) spiral stair case from third story balcony to mid-balcony

I left out a lot, but focused on sheer dimensions. Anyways, this build is on a very difficult canyon like backyard. I live on 1 acre in the city with a steep backyard grade. The foundation on the rear side of my house is 15+ feet of slab (level at front side). I wanted a build high enough to be part of the view (above trees) and integrate well into my existing deck. After reviewing countless proposals, this is the design I landed on. NOTE: Colors and tile material are just examples here, and I will likely raise the faux edge to prevent spillage.

I'm excited, we're about to break ground! See post 2 for terrain pictures.

Just checking in with those long-time SWG users - Who has the oldest TCell15 that is still working? I installed mine beginning of 2012 season, and it is still working. I run my pump at 100% for 12 hours, salt generation at 30% in my 20,000 in-ground vinyl pool. I think oversizing the cell and using at lower percentages and cleaning are the trick. I also remove and put it indoors during Central PA Winters. How are others doing?

Hi
I'm a first time pool owner. Pool stats in signature. I have a HTH 6 way test kit. Just filled the pool this weekend, it is clear. No chemicals have been added yet.

Chlorine: no color
PH; at least a 7.8 but I think the red is slightly darker then that. Maybe not quite the 8.3 line though.
CYA: I don't see any cloudiness whatsoever when I add to the eyeball test tube and fill it up
Alkalinity: I added 10 drops of the Alkalinity Titrant and the liquid is still green so if I'm reading this right its very high.
Hardness: I didn't test this but we have very hard water

I have liquid 10% chlorine on hand.
I have a container of 1" chlorine tablets on hand.
I couldn't find muriatic acid but I ordered HTH down granules which should be ready for pickup later today.
I have baking soda and borax on hand.

I'm trying to do research myself because I like to learn but I'm a little confused. I read I should adjust the PH first? So that would be the PH down when it is ready later today. How much do you recommend? How long afterwards do I add chlorine? should i start with the liquid chlorine or tablets? Or can I add liquid chlorine or the tablets now? and the PH down later when its ready? Thank you!!

Hi All - New to the forum, and love all the information here. After 5+ years of considering a pool, we're finally taking the steps to get quotes from some of the area builders here in DFW. I haven't been very impressed with the level of knowledge with the few I've met so far. In the latest instance of this, after the on-site meeting where I made it very clear some trees were off limits, the design included (Owner coordinates Removal of trees) and the setback for overhead utility from waterline was incorrect. Just seems like some of them don't have the basic knowledge that is accessible by everyone.

Has anyone built their own pool, in other words, acted as your own general contractor? I'm in no rush to build, the cost savings over time to build seems like a worthwhile effort.

June 3-Today

As posted in a previous thread at the end of last season I was battling white water mold as a result of high cya/chlorine issues. My scheduled opening is early May. Took a look at things today. The entire pool is COVERED with white mold. I did test chlorine, ph and cya today .
Fc basically zero mayyyybe 0.5
Ph 7
Cya 50

Is there anything I can or should prior to opening to try to get a handle on this ?
Thanks in advance