Where Do I Start???

[jcpundt]

In 02/2017 my husband and I purchased a foreclosure that sat vacant since late 2012. There is a concrete inground, peanut-shaped, pool in the back yard. It measures approximately 25'x15'x at it's widest. We cleared the overhanging branches and brush around the pool and now decided that it may be worth keeping. The pump and filter are not operational as parts are missing. The pool has been covered with a custom, breathable/porous, cover since 2012. It's holding water and is filled almost to the tile line. There is a small crack in the concrete sidewalk. The water is full of algae and frogs! We don't know what to do first and any help you guys can provide would be helpful. Questions we have are:

1. Should we drain it first, or shock it to kill most algae before draining to clean?
2. If we shock it first, what do we use?
3. If it wasn't winterized, should we get a cheap pump and filter to see if the the lines are still intact? Why waste time cleaning a pool that will need $$$$ worth of work. We will not do major repairs. We will fill it in if we find the pool won't operate properly.
4. What is the best moderately priced pump and filter to get?

We have no idea where to start besides taking the cover off! HELP.

 

[tim5055]

Welcome to the TFP pool! :splash:

The first step will be to get teh pump/filter replaced or working. Some photos of the equipment pad may help us identify what you need.

Resist running down to the local pool store. They are going to see you as $$$$! We find that many times pool store employees primary goal is to sell stuff, not necessarily get your pool in perfect condition. As to whether that is because of improper training, lack of knowledge or just to sell stuff I will leave up to you. While you would think that a "professional" would be the best, unfortunately in most cases it is quite the opposite. Between employees who blindly trust the word of chemical sales representatives and high school kids working in the pool store for the summer you end up with poor results from their advice and testing.

Once we get past the pump/filter working it will be time to clear the water, but we can cross that bridge when it's time.

 

[jcpundt]

Thanks tim5055. I will take pics of the equipment pad when I get home and I'll post them. I never thought to get the pump working before cleaning but I guess that would save us working on cleaning a pool that has potential to work lol.

 

[jcpundt]

Good Morning tim5055. I finally got around to taking pictures of the equipment pad. I have no idea what I'm looking at. View attachment 83390

 

[kchinger]

Without any labels, I'll make a couple guesses and others can chime in.

The pipe with the red handled ball valve (this should be replaced eventually if you keep the pool, but it's approximately #123 on the list of things to worry about) is coming from the main drain. The two pipes with the black handled valve in the middle (this is a good valve) are coming from two skimmers. You can figure out which side is which later and label them. The pipe on the far left going back into the ground goes to the return(s). All in all, the equipment pad doesn't look that bad.

A close up of the main pump (the one to the left in your picture, the other is a booster for a vacuum I think, unless there's a spa under the cover maybe) would be helpful, including the nameplate of the motor and any names on the pump or motor. What parts do you think are missing? A close up of the filter, including any nameplates, plus anywhere it looks like parts are missing would also be good.

 

[ajw22]

What parts are missing from the pump and filter? From the pics they look intact.

 

[tim5055]

In addition to kchinger’s information, you have a reasonable sized sand filter (my personal favorite filter type) with a top mounted multi port valve.

First how hand are you and your husband? Are you all doing the work yourselves, or will everything get hired out?

If it were me I would test the electric to the main pump (the one on the left in the photo) and if it has power and still doesn’t I would take it to a local pump repair shop. To remove it you close the multi port valve on the top of the filter, the red valve is already closed and the black valve needs to be closed. Make sure the breaker is off and disconnect the power. Unscrew the two union joints on the two pipes going to the pump and if it’s not bolted down you can just pick it up. And take it to a shop like these guys. Roberts Electric Motors Inc -Frederick, MD

 

[kchinger]

In addition to kchinger’s information, you have a reasonable sized sand filter (my personal favorite filter type) with a top mounted multi port valve.

First how hand are you and your husband? Are you all doing the work yourselves, or will everything get hired out?

If it were me I would test the electric to the main pump (the one on the left in the photo) and if it has power and still doesn’t I would take it to a local pump repair shop. To remove it you close the multi port valve on the top of the filter, the red valve is already closed and the black valve needs to be closed. Make sure the breaker is off and disconnect the power. Unscrew the two union joints on the two pipes going to the pump and if it’s not bolted down you can just pick it up. And take it to a shop like these guys. Roberts Electric Motors Inc -Frederick, MD

Black valve from the skimmers looks closed to me already too.

 

[zea3]

Before you try to start the pump, make sure the multiport valve on top of the filter is set on filter or recirculate. Also look at the returns and skimmers in the pool and remove any plugs that may be in there. You will also need to add enough water so that the skimmer opening are 1/2 way under water.

Edit: I agree, I think the black valve is closed. Turn it so the end of the handle is pointing toward the pump. Here is a video that demonstrates how these valves work: How a Jandy 3-Way Valve Works - YouTube

 

[ajw22]

Here is an annotated picture of your pool equipment.

Note that both the red ball valve and the black Jandy valve are closed blocking any water into your pump. They must be opened before you turn on your pump.

You have both a main pump and a secondary booster pump for a pressure cleaner. Don't worry about running the booster pump right now.

Take and post a pic of the valve on the top of the filter. You need to understand what the setting is before you turn on the pump.

 

[zea3]

The blue thing looks like a Nature 2 mineral system. Open it and make sure the cartridge is removed before starting the pool.

 

[DeanP66]

That looks like a really decent equipment pad. Being a foreclosure, I was expecting to see something really deteriorated and on its last legs.

 

[jcpundt]

I think the reason it's not working is the electric. It's shut off outside... but somewhere inside the house it is shut off too. There are switches downstairs that control unknown things. We are still trying to figure it all out. I'm not opposed to spending money on new equipment (that way we know it's good and we know how to use it)

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And to me it looks like it's on it's last leg. Hahaha. Our neighbors have a nice clean area with parts still with labels. This area looks a mess to me. But good to know everything is there.

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Well, this was unexpected. Thank you for this pic. I have no idea what does what and if we are going to do this on our own, we are going to need all the help we can get. THANK YOU.

 

[EddieMc]

Hello Jacq! I'm new to TFP as well...I just wanted to share our story and maybe that will help you decide on what to do.

We purchased a home in 2015 that has a pool. We did have the pool inspected, and he said everything checked out perfect. Fast forward one month, and we starting having serious issues. We went to the pool store to seek help. We dumped so many chemicals in the pool, and we always had to dump more chemicals in the pool to counteract the previous chemicals we just dumped in there. The pool store would test our water, and they had the pool already in the system for 30,000 gallons. Eventually, we ran into needing to add flock to the pool...once the flock settled, I couldn't figure out how to vacuum it up. The hose kept collapsing, it was barely picking up anything...and then of course the hose broke (I actually found it in the woods next to the pool shed).

I called a pool service and they treated us very well. They taught me how to use the multiport on the sand filter, they taught me a lot about the setup on our pool...which pipe was the main drain, which one was the skimmer, pressure side return lines, etc. Fast forward one month, and even the pool service had a difficult time balancing the chemicals.

Eventually, the pool pump stopped working...which I learned was a bad capacitor. Then the pump capacitor went out about every three weeks. We also went through about 20" of water monthly because of the constant needing of backwashing the filter. We decided to shut the pool down once the motor completely seized.

Fast forward two years later!! A month or so ago, I cleaned up the equipment pad with all the over growth vegetation, I found this website and started learning and asking a few questions. We completely drained the remainder of the water by renting a trash pump, scoped all the nasty out with a plastic shovel, and gave the plaster a water hose and light brush cleaning (our pool is plaster finished). I cut out all the plumbing, purchased a new pump, new cartridge filter, salt water generator, all thinking the pool is 30,000 gallons or super close to it.

I finished the plumbing about two weeks ago, started filling the pool up with water last Wednesday/Thursday (I can't remember what day it was). I found out that the pool is 20,500 gallons by taking a reading at the water meter before and after. I ran new electrical for the pump and salt water generator, and hooked up a new light. The pool had a niche, but no light/housing or anything.

I am now in the middle of getting help by some of the members of this Forum on balancing our water.

My advice...start from scratch. The pipes were cracked in some areas, there was a jandy valve never leak that cracked, I had no idea if the sand filter was the right size, even the fittings leaked, it was a mess. A few months after we moved in, we learned that the previous Owners never used the pool because it was completely black/super dark green.

I have learned so much with this forum. I can't even thank these guys and gals enough.

 

[ajw22]

I think the reason it's not working is the electric. It's shut off outside... but somewhere inside the house it is shut off too. There are switches downstairs that control unknown things. We are still trying to figure it all out. I'm not opposed to spending money on new equipment (that way we know it's good and we know how to use it)

There are “ac circuit tracers” that you plug in or clip onto a wire and you can then trace where it goes. If you are handy you can buy one and explore your wiring. Or you can hire an electrician to figure it out.

 

[EddieMc]

There are “ac circuit tracers” that you plug in or clip onto a wire and you can then trace where it goes. If you are handy you can buy one and explore your wiring. Or you can hire an electrician to figure it out.

I second this. If the electrical is rough looking in the house, you’ll use it more than once!

 

[kchinger]

I think the reason it's not working is the electric. It's shut off outside... but somewhere inside the house it is shut off too. There are switches downstairs that control unknown things. We are still trying to figure it all out. I'm not opposed to spending money on new equipment (that way we know it's good and we know how to use it)

Unless those are heavy duty switches, it's very unlikely that anything in there is controlling it. Most likely there's a double breaker in your main panel, and then the sub panel at the equipment pad, and that's it. A normal house light switch isn't really meant to control a large load like a pool pump, not to mention the voltage wouldn't work.

You could get a non contact voltage detector and start from the main panel and work your way out.

 

[getreal720]

Can you identify the breaker for the power line that is run out to the pool?

Usually, unless it's some kinda hack job, a dedicated line will be run directly from a panel box to the area where the pool equipment is. There may be a small sub panel out there... or maybe just an outdoor style outlet. Looks like you have some kinda sub panel / box that the wire is run to. It's pretty standard for that feed to come directly from a breaker box, and be it's own (isolated) circuit.

That pump looks like (to me anyhow) a hayward super pump. Get your power verified with a multi meter (be careful around electricity if you don't know what your doing.. you do not want to risk getting zapped with 120 / 240). Once you know you have good power to the box, make sure all the valves are open, and the multi port valve is set to recirculate, double check water level is up past the highest skimmer line and let it rip.

Being an in ground pool, you may need to prime the pump... there may be an air port to open on the sand filter... you need to purge all the air out of the system in order for it to run correctly. I'm not sure if your setup will self prime or not.


As far as the water goes... if it's green and has wild life living in it... I'd probably be more willing to drain the pool and refill. This will allow you to paint the pool (if necessary) and get a good look to see if other repairs are necessary on the walls of the pool. I'd hate to find out after weeks of SLAMing the pool that it needs drained due to a necessary repair.


I think I'd personally go in this order:

Verify electric to subpanel is good / get power working to sub panel

Get enough water in the pool (set pump to recirculate and figure out how to prime if not self priming) to test the pump / filter hardware

Run the pump a lot for about a week or two.... to make sure you don't have leaks in any of the plumbing.... both the pipes you can see and the ones you can't. Again on recirculate.

Drain the pool, inspect and then clean it (if inspection results please you).

Refill the pool, dump in start up chemicals (Cal-Hypo and CYA powder)

Enjoy your new pool!


I honestly think it's not going to be as bad as you are expecting.

To replace that pump yourself, which isn't very hard, will cost you in the neighborhood of about $700 USD (that's brand new pump and filter)

To refill your pool is going to vary. You are looking at somewhere between 20,000 and 30,000 gallons of water. If I were to fill that pool, with my
water rates... I'd probably spend about $400 (extra) on the water itself.

The part that may cost you is if you have to have the pool walls repaired, or the underground plumbing repaired. Provided you can't do that yourself
or you don't know anyone who would help you out ( I.E. not having to pay a contractor). Even then, if those are required the worst case scenario is
getting a few quotes and deciding if you want to spend that kind of money or not. You may be surprised and get a few quotes much cheaper than you
were expecting.

The best thing is that the progression I've outlined (and others) works from pretty much cost free to the only expensive things coming at the end of the
process. You'll never be that far in the hole and then get trapped to find out you invested a lot already and need to invest a lot more. You'll have very little
in it by the time you "could" be faced with an expensive decision.

Even if you go as far as to buy a new pump / filter combo... I'm sure you could easily recoup a decent percentage of that money if you were to decide to fill in the pool AFTER already buying a new pump filter. I'd imagine even used you could probably get 50%+ percent of you money back without trying.

 

[zea3]

Please keep in mind that if you decide to drain the pool, not to try and drain it 100% unless you are positive you know how high water table levels are in your area. Either have a professional pool service do the draining or only drain 50% of the pool, then refill. High ground water levels can damage an empty pool.

 

[jcpundt]

Hello Jacq! I'm new to TFP as well...I just wanted to share our story and maybe that will help you decide on what to do.

We purchased a home in 2015 that has a pool. We did have the pool inspected, and he said everything checked out perfect. Fast forward one month, and we starting having serious issues. We went to the pool store to seek help. We dumped so many chemicals in the pool, and we always had to dump more chemicals in the pool to counteract the previous chemicals we just dumped in there. The pool store would test our water, and they had the pool already in the system for 30,000 gallons. Eventually, we ran into needing to add flock to the pool...once the flock settled, I couldn't figure out how to vacuum it up. The hose kept collapsing, it was barely picking up anything...and then of course the hose broke (I actually found it in the woods next to the pool shed).

I called a pool service and they treated us very well. They taught me how to use the multiport on the sand filter, they taught me a lot about the setup on our pool...which pipe was the main drain, which one was the skimmer, pressure side return lines, etc. Fast forward one month, and even the pool service had a difficult time balancing the chemicals.

Eventually, the pool pump stopped working...which I learned was a bad capacitor. Then the pump capacitor went out about every three weeks. We also went through about 20" of water monthly because of the constant needing of backwashing the filter. We decided to shut the pool down once the motor completely seized.

Fast forward two years later!! A month or so ago, I cleaned up the equipment pad with all the over growth vegetation, I found this website and started learning and asking a few questions. We completely drained the remainder of the water by renting a trash pump, scoped all the nasty out with a plastic shovel, and gave the plaster a water hose and light brush cleaning (our pool is plaster finished). I cut out all the plumbing, purchased a new pump, new cartridge filter, salt water generator, all thinking the pool is 30,000 gallons or super close to it.

I finished the plumbing about two weeks ago, started filling the pool up with water last Wednesday/Thursday (I can't remember what day it was). I found out that the pool is 20,500 gallons by taking a reading at the water meter before and after. I ran new electrical for the pump and salt water generator, and hooked up a new light. The pool had a niche, but no light/housing or anything.

I am now in the middle of getting help by some of the members of this Forum on balancing our water.

My advice...start from scratch. The pipes were cracked in some areas, there was a jandy valve never leak that cracked, I had no idea if the sand filter was the right size, even the fittings leaked, it was a mess. A few months after we moved in, we learned that the previous Owners never used the pool because it was completely black/super dark green.

I have learned so much with this forum. I can't even thank these guys and gals enough.

EddieMc, I think we are headed down the road of replacing the pump and motor. I'd like to go saltwater since our neighbor has one... and she knows how it all works. We can call her for help lol. For now, I just didn't know where to start with cleaning and I had no idea what I was looking out. Shout out to the people on this site who jumped in and offered help. Especially the guy who labeled my pic for me. High five to that dude!

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Please keep in mind that if you decide to drain the pool, not to try and drain it 100% unless you are positive you know how high water table levels are in your area. Either have a professional pool service do the draining or only drain 50% of the pool, then refill. High ground water levels can damage an empty pool.

I do know in our area, specifically my yard, the water table is 100ft below ground level. Now with all the rain we have had the past few days, the water table is probably 2 inches below ground now lol

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Tomorrow night, my husband, my father, and myself will start with the electric, then progress to the pump and motor. My father is handy and will be able to help get it working if it's possible. If not, we may go purchase a new/used one. Pray to the pool gods that this works lol. I need a pool to jump in after hours of yardwork in the summer.