Testing and Balancing My Pool Water/1st Time HELP

[Mendy48]

Hello!!!

Okay! I've tested samples my pool water extensively over the past two days. I wasn't certain if I was getting the correct numbers. This time (today), I tested it very slowly (with nobody around to distract me ) and this is what I got.View attachment 76384
CC 0.5
FC 0.5
TC 1
TA 390 (yup)
CH 100
CYA 20 (this is more than 20. see picture attached above. I can still see the bottom of test tube. there wasn't anymore measurement after 20
PH 7.2
Temp 81F


eerrgghh....I'm going to get the speed stir for my TC-100. I was told it will help with testing. Nevertheless, here are my results above.

Now! I took my pool water sample to my supplier and they got the below results.

pH 7.2
FC 6.8
TA 104
TC 6.8
TH 80
CYA 15

So now I'm stuck...should I believe my results (I've tested a total of 5 times for 2 days) or the suppliers results? Since I'm a newbie.....I may be off by some results. who knows. I would like to trust my results though. I really would. especially considering that I've re-tested all the components 5 times over the past 2 days.

Any advise.

 

[lightmaster]

Don't ever trust pool store results. I've taken my perfectly balance pool sample to a store, and sure enough they claimed almost everything was way off of wack and tried asking me all kinds of potions. Even complained that my FC of 8 was way too high and dangerous to swim in, when I had a cya of 30 according to them. Cya was really at 50 and FC of 8 is way below shock levels.

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Have you ever added CYA to your pool? When you perform the test, you need to be outside, on a bright sunny day, with the sun to your back and the long vial at waist level in the shade of your body. Pour some of the sample in without looking at the long vial, and then glance down to see if you can see the dot. If you see the dot with a glance, add more of the sample and try again. It's very important that you only glance at it. If you stare at it, you will likely still see the dot, but a quick glance and you won't see the dot.

Also, if once you perform the test, or go to far, you can put the sample back into the red tipped bottle and do it again with the same sample.

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Using PoolMath, get that FC up to 4-5 quickly. Depending how long it's been that low, you might be in for a SLAM Process.

 

[Mendy48]

Thanks for that advise...you're correct...at a glance, I didn't see the dot. However, when I looked closely, I could see it. LOL.

Also I've never added CYA to my pool. I defiantly use PoolMath to proceed. I think I'm going to go for a SLAM and see what happens. Keeping my fingers crossed cause I'm new to this.

Don't ever trust pool store results. I've taken my perfectly balance pool sample to a store, and sure enough they claimed almost everything was way off of wack and tried asking me all kinds of potions. Even complained that my FC of 8 was way too high and dangerous to swim in, when I had a cya of 30 according to them. Cya was really at 50 and FC of 8 is way below shock levels.

- - - Updated - - -

Have you ever added CYA to your pool? When you perform the test, you need to be outside, on a bright sunny day, with the sun to your back and the long vial at waist level in the shade of your body. Pour some of the sample in without looking at the long vial, and then glance down to see if you can see the dot. If you see the dot with a glance, add more of the sample and try again. It's very important that you only glance at it. If you stare at it, you will likely still see the dot, but a quick glance and you won't see the dot.

Also, if once you perform the test, or go to far, you can put the sample back into the red tipped bottle and do it again with the same sample.

- - - Updated - - -

Using PoolMath, get that FC up to 4-5 quickly. Depending how long it's been that low, you might be in for a SLAM Process.

 

[lightmaster]

I noticed you have an automatic chlorine feeder, I assume you used tabs at one point to chlorinate? If so, those add CYA.

 

[Mendy48]

Yes...I have an automatic chlorine feeder and use tabs. Is adding CYA a good thing in my case?

Also, I used the PoolMath and attached are the tasks that I need to do:
Questions:

1. The percentage of the bleach I have is higher than the suggested amount. Should I just use 96oz of the 8.25% (Sodium Hypochlorite - maybe dilute it before pouring it in my pool - near the jets)?
2. The Borox I have has an ingredient of Sodium Tetraborate (a natural mineral). Will this work?
3. What type of calcium chloride and liquid stabilizer should I get, or does it really matter? I believe I can get both of these at meijers. Not sure though.

View attachment 76403View attachment 76405View attachment 76402View attachment 76404

View attachment 76406

 

[lightmaster]

How long have you been putting tabs in? I'd expect your CYA to be higher if you've used them for a long time. Either way, take the tabs out.

1. Change that % for bleach to whichever you have, and it'll adjust the amount you need to use.

2. Borax is good to raise your pH, but your pH is already with the acceptable range of 7.2-7.8, so don't add any.

3. Any brand of Stabilizer will work good, as long as it says 100% Cyanuric Acid. Same with Calcium Hardner, any will work. I don't use CH since I have a vinyl pool, so I can't remember the name of the chemical in it.

I think you probably did the TA test wrong, since that's a really high result. When using the 3rd reagent, R-0009, before each and every drop, wipe the tip of the bottle off with a damp paper towel. Each drop builds up a static charge in the bottle so the drops get smaller and small, giving a false high result. Damp paper towel fixes that. Check my signature for some extended test directions to help make sure you're doing each right.

Also, if I were you, after using tabs, I'd do the CYA test again on a second day just to make sure you did it right the first time. If you have transition glasses, try to use some normal glasses for the test, since in my experience tinged glasses mess up the results.

 

[Mendy48]

I've only put in 10-13 Cl tablets once. This is a new pool. They aren't even dissolved yet in the auto Cl feeder near my pump. is the what you're talking about? since my Cl level was at 0.5, I turned the dial on my auto feeder from 1 to 3 yesterday.

1. I changed the percentage in PoolMath and it says to add 76Oz now. I'll do that.

2. Since my pH is fine, why is PoolMath telling me to add borax or baking/ash?

3. I have some gifts in my garage, are any of those stabilizers? I've attached an image. If not, I'll get some from the store and make sure it says 100% Cyanuric Acid. I have a vinyl pool too so I don't need CH as well.

4. I'll retest the TA for sure as you instructed.

5. Again, what are tabs. I'll retest the CYA and make sure I wear normal glasses...thanks for the heads-up.

View attachment 76428

How long have you been putting tabs in? I'd expect your CYA to be higher if you've used them for a long time. Either way, take the tabs out.

1. Change that % for bleach to whichever you have, and I'll adjust the amount you need to use.

2. Borax is good to raise your pH, but your pH is already with the acceptable range of 7.2-7.8, so don't add any.

3. Any brand of Stabilizer will work good, as long as it says 100% Cyanuric Acid. Same with Calcium Hardner, any will work. I don't use CH since I have a vinyl pool, so I can't remember the name of the chemical in it.

I think you probably did the TA test wrong, since that's a really high result. When using the 3rd reagent, R-0009, before each and every drop, wipe the tip of the bottle off with a damp paper towel. Each drop builds up a static charge in the bottle so the drops get smaller and small, giving a false high result. Damp paper towel fixes that. Check my signature for some extended test directions to help make sure you're doing each right.

Also, if I were you, after using tabs, I'd do the CYA test again on a second day just to make sure you did it right the first time. If you have transition glasses, try to use some normal glasses for the test, since in my experience tinged glasses mess up the results.

 

[lightmaster]

I've only put in 10-13 Cl tablets once. This is a new pool. They aren't even dissolved yet in the auto Cl feeder near my pump. is the what you're talking about? since my Cl level was at 0.5, I turned the dial on my auto feeder from 1 to 3 yesterday.

1. I changed the percentage in PoolMath and it says to add 76Oz now. I'll do that.

2. Since my pH is fine, why is PoolMath telling me to add borax or baking/ash?

3. I have some gifts in my garage, are any of those stabilizers? I've attached an image. If not, I'll get some from the store and make sure it says 100% Cyanuric Acid. I have a vinyl pool too so I don't need CH as well.

4. I'll retest the TA for sure as you instructed.

5. Again, what are tabs. I'll retest the CYA and make sure I wear normal glasses...thanks for the heads-up.

View attachment 76428

The balance pak is just over priced baking soda, increases you alkalinity. Walmart sells a cheaper per pound resealable bag of it.

Shock treatment and clarifier, don't put that in your pool. Clarifier will mess up your sand filter, and shock typically adds extra stuff that you don't want/need. Only thing you'll ever need to raise your Chlorine is good old bleach, or liquid shock, which is just a higher concentration of bleach.

The problem with tabs is that they add as much CYA as FC, but the CYA never leaves your pool. So you wind up with a CYA level through the roof and you have to have an ever increasing amount of FC for it to remain functional. Many people have been suckered into tabs and tab feeders, just to find out they aren't usable long term. Best thing is to get your CYA to the level you need (30-50 based on temperatures and amount of sunlight) and then just use liquid bleach daily to keep your FC up. You can either calculate how much CYA those tabs have, and only add enough to raise your CYA up to a target of 30 to start with, or pull the tabs out and use granular Stabilizer to get your CYA up.

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Also, Pool Math tells you what to add to get to whatever value is in the target box, not just within the range. Personally, I use Pool Logger, which uses the same math that Pool Math does, but it doesn't have you adjust anything if you're already within the recommended range.

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Tabs = Chlorine tablets. Part chlorine, part CYA stabilizer. Chlorine gets used up and CYA builds up in your pool at first protecting the chlorine, but ends up getting so high that the chlorine is ineffective. This is why we typically recommend measuring granular CYA to get your CYA level up, and then only adding bleach for chlorine, so you don't make your chlorine ineffective with 100+ CYA level.

 

[Sid/]

LightMaster, Just trying to check out the Pool Logger app on my phone at the App store... Maybe I typed it in wrong or something. Should it be in the App store??? Did not see it listed in the App store.

 

[Mendy48]

LOL... I guess I don't need the balanced pak right now (it's baking soda). I'll go to Walmart for more baking soda if I needed any. I don't need to increase my TA as it is already high. I'm going to retest though, like you said, just to make sure.

I'm going to get some bleach from Walmart to start this process (8.25%), cause I don't have enough. You mentioned not to add shock treatment to my pool, but you talked about liquid shock treatment and how that's okay to add. Is the shock treatment in the picture different from a liquid shock treatment? Oh! I'll keep the Clarifier away from my pool. I don't want to mess up my sand filter.

I will get my CYA level up to where it needs to be (30-50; depending on temperature) by using Granular Stabilizer, and remove the tabs from the auto feeder near the pump? Correct? Does the Granular Stabilizer go directly into the pool? If so, how much of it do I need?

I don't see Pool Logger on my App Store (iPhone). Is there another name for it?

Thanks for explaining "Tabs".

The balance pak is just over priced baking soda, increases you alkalinity. Walmart sells a cheaper per pound resealable bag of it.

Shock treatment and clarifier, don't put that in your pool. Clarifier will mess up your sand filter, and shock typically adds extra stuff that you don't want/need. Only thing you'll ever need to raise your Chlorine is good old bleach, or liquid shock, which is just a higher concentration of bleach.

The problem with tabs is that they add as much CYA as FC, but the CYA never leaves your pool. So you wind up with a CYA level through the roof and you have to have an ever increasing amount of FC for it to remain functional. Many people have been suckered into tabs and tab feeders, just to find out they aren't usable long term. Best thing is to get your CYA to the level you need (30-50 based on temperatures and amount of sunlight) and then just use liquid bleach daily to keep your FC up. You can either calculate how much CYA those tabs have, and only add enough to raise your CYA up to a target of 30 to start with, or pull the tabs out and use granular Stabilizer to get your CYA up.

- - - Updated - - -

Also, Pool Math tells you what to add to get to whatever value is in the target box, not just within the range. Personally, I use Pool Logger, which uses the same math that Pool Math does, but it doesn't have you adjust anything if you're already within the recommended range.

- - - Updated - - -

Tabs = Chlorine tablets. Part chlorine, part CYA stabilizer. Chlorine gets used up and CYA builds up in your pool at first protecting the chlorine, but ends up getting so high that the chlorine is ineffective. This is why we typically recommend measuring granular CYA to get your CYA level up, and then only adding bleach for chlorine, so you don't make your chlorine ineffective with 100+ CYA level.

 

[lightmaster]

Pool Logger is a web app, so no need to download or install anything, just go to the site, register, and start using.

Liquid shock is just a higher strength version of bleach, usually a little cheaper per ounce of actual chlorine in it. Powder shock is chlorine mixed with something else, typically calcium, and can also contain other things like copper that lead to staining. And with liquid chlorine/bleach, it mixes easily since both the pool and chlorine source are liquids, whereas powder chlorine can sink down onto your pool surface and make bleached white spots if its not brushed.

For adding CYA, measure out 3/4 of whatever Pool Math says to bring it from where you are to your target (go with 30). I always go with 3/4ths of what the calculator says since its better to undershoot it and add more later, than overshoot. Get a clean sock, not an ankle sock but a full length one with no holes and pour all that CYA into the sock. Hang that sock in front of your return and set your pump to run continuously. After an hour or so, you should be able to go kneed the sock and you'll see white clouds coming out of it. Just keep massaging it and letting it hang in front of the return and it'll all dissolve into your water.

Recommended Pool CHemicals is a good source of info about the various chemicals we recommend for pools. Read through Pool School, there's a lot of good info in there.

 

[Mendy48]

It started raining when I retested everything..LOL

FC 0.5
CC 0.5
TC 1
pH 7.2
TA 180
CYA 20

I'm going to get bleach (8.25%) add it to my pool to increase FC?
I'm also going to get Granular Stabilizer (100% Cyanuric Acid) and add to my pool to increase CYA? ---- but how much??? I'm looking at this link here Pool School - Chlorine / CYA Chart
but I'm not understanding it at all.
From what I've read,

1. Add recommended amount of CYA to a sock (this is the Granular Stabilizer right?)
2. Hang sock in front of return flow or set to the side in the skimmer.
3. Leave Pump running while it's dissolving.
4. The CYA should fully dissolve within 24/48 hours depending on flow of water. Leave pump running for additional 24 hours.
5. After adding the CYA, assume your levels are now higher and you bump-up your FC levels according to the chart (I thought adding the stabilizer wouldn't effect the FC). In order to get your FC up, bleach is recommended. I'm I right.
6. After 5-6 days after the CYA dissolved, run a test to confirm level.

 

[lightmaster]

With a FC of .5, you need to get some bleach in there quick. Do you have any at your house that you can throw in?

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16x32 (2ft radius)? I assume its a rectangular pool that's 16 feet by 32 feet? how deep is it?

 

[Mendy48]

It's a rectangular pool (16x32 2inch radius..not 2ft). The depth is 6.5 feet.

I'm out now getting bleach. I'm VERY low on bleach.

 

[lightmaster]

So a 16'x32'x6.5' pool comes out at 24,500 gallons.

New water and 55 degree weather up there in MI, probably no algae starting in your pool yet. Wouldn't hurt to do a Overnight Chlorine Loss Test tonight just to be sure though. First is getting everything in balance. Like the directions you read said, go ahead and target your FC for what your CYA will be once you've added it, so target a FC of 5ppm. You'll need just over 1 gallon, 2 quarts of 8.25% bleach for that.

For CYA, to go from 20ppm to 30ppm, you'll need 2lbs of CYA, added to a sock. I know the directions say it'll take up to 24/48 hours, but I just dissolved 30 oz in my pool in about 30 mins, just by massaging the sock. You always do your FC target for you new CYA level because as your CYA goes up, you'll need a higher FC for the chlorine to remain effective. Also, don't remember if I mentioned before, but always round your CYA number up. If its halfway past 20, its considered 30.

Your pH looks good, and it'll trend up over time. As you add muriatic acid to lower your pH, your TA will drop some each time. Until your TA falls to under 100, your pH might rise rather fast and need acid once a week, but once your TA comes down closer to the 50-80 range, your pH will rise much slower and you'll end up hitting a nice sweet spot where your pH rises very slowly and you don't need much acid to keep it within 7.2-7.8 range.

You didn't list a CH test, but as long as it isn't sky high, that's not very important for us vinyl owners. Your CH is fine all the way down to 0, since there's no plaster for the water to leech calcium from. On the other hand, if your CH is really high, you can still get scaling on the walls and salt cells (if/when you get a SWG). So its good to know what level your CH is at the start, and then test it once a month or even once every couple of months.

Also, don't worry about adding FC and CC to get TC. I know pool stores seem to enjoy writing TC down, but it really has no value. And if you're referring to the yellow chlorine test attached the the pH test, you don't really need to do that test, since you're gonna do the FAS/DPD test anyways.

 

[Mendy48]

Awesome advise...

Ok! I just added bleach (8.25%) and the Stabilizer. The socks are in there..near the jets. pump is running...now I'm just waiting for all to dissolve. I hope it dissolves fast like yours did...LOL.

Now that I've done this, do I wait a week before testing my levels again?

Oh!!! another questions..do I turn off my auto Chlorine feeder near the pump. I still have some tabs in there..very small now but they're in there.

So a 16'x32'x6.5' pool comes out at 24,500 gallons.

New water and 55 degree weather up there in MI, probably no algae starting in your pool yet. Wouldn't hurt to do a Overnight Chlorine Loss Test tonight just to be sure though. First is getting everything in balance. Like the directions you read said, go ahead and target your FC for what your CYA will be once you've added it, so target a FC of 5ppm. You'll need just over 1 gallon, 2 quarts of 8.25% bleach for that.

For CYA, to go from 20ppm to 30ppm, you'll need 2lbs of CYA, added to a sock. I know the directions say it'll take up to 24/48 hours, but I just dissolved 30 oz in my pool in about 30 mins, just by massaging the sock. You always do your FC target for you new CYA level because as your CYA goes up, you'll need a higher FC for the chlorine to remain effective. Also, don't remember if I mentioned before, but always round your CYA number up. If its halfway past 20, its considered 30.

Your pH looks good, and it'll trend up over time. As you add muriatic acid to lower your pH, your TA will drop some each time. Until your TA falls to under 100, your pH might rise rather fast and need acid once a week, but once your TA comes down closer to the 50-80 range, your pH will rise much slower and you'll end up hitting a nice sweet spot where your pH rises very slowly and you don't need much acid to keep it within 7.2-7.8 range.

You didn't list a CH test, but as long as it isn't sky high, that's not very important for us vinyl owners. Your CH is fine all the way down to 0, since there's no plaster for the water to leech calcium from. On the other hand, if your CH is really high, you can still get scaling on the walls and salt cells (if/when you get a SWG). So its good to know what level your CH is at the start, and then test it once a month or even once every couple of months.

Also, don't worry about adding FC and CC to get TC. I know pool stores seem to enjoy writing TC down, but it really has no value. And if you're referring to the yellow chlorine test attached the the pH test, you don't really need to do that test, since you're gonna do the FAS/DPD test anyways.

 

[lightmaster]

I would take the tabs out. You added the CYA that you need, they'll only raise it more.

An hour after you added the chlorine, go check your FC again and then massage that sock some to help the CYA dissolve.

 

[Mendy48]

Tabs are out now..

My FC is 4

Now.... I tested the pool water that was near the location I poured the bleach. How long will it take for the entire 15000 gallons to mix. Cause I want the FC level to be even throughout the pool.

P.S. I'm messaging the socks. Its dissolving faster.

I would take the tabs out. You added the CYA that you need, they'll only raise it more.

An hour after you added the chlorine, go check your FC again and then massage that sock some to help the CYA dissolve.

 

[lightmaster]

Tabs are out now..

My FC is 4

Now.... I tested the pool water that was near the location I poured the bleach. How long will it take for the entire 15000 gallons to mix. Cause I want the FC level to be even throughout the pool.

P.S. I'm messaging the socks. Its dissolving faster.

With good circulation, it should be mixed within 30 mins.

Are you sure your pool is 15k gallons? A 16'x32' pool that's 6.5' deep should be 24.9k gallons, almost twice that size.

 

[Mendy48]

Yeah... I'm pretty sure... I just pulled up the dimensions of the pool and the contract I signed. I also verified with the supplier via text and he indicated it was 15000 gallons. 16x32 IG Pool. The deep end is only 6.5ft...the shallow is 3.5ft if not more shallow. Thus, I used PoolMath to figure and your suggestions to figure out the calculation for a 15000 gallon pool.


P.S. So now that I've done this Bleach and Stabilizer, how often do I do this task...every month? or when needed....just keep testing I guess.

With good circulation, it should be mixed within 30 mins.

Are you sure your pool is 15k gallons? A 16'x32' pool that's 6.5' deep should be 24.9k gallons, almost twice that size.