SOMEBODY TALK ME OFF THE LEDGE(TA and FC)

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DASTEELERS

DASTEELERS

Member
May 23, 2021
22
Annapolis
Pool Size
7600
Surface
Fiberglass
Chlorine
Liquid Chlorine
7600 GAL FIBERGLASS POOL....2nd year for pool....Went away for 5 days on an auto covered pool that was FC of 8.5 and everything balanced except TA was 150. CYA was 120 at that time because pool company who opened did not listen to what I wanted. Came back water slightly cloudy and can see half way down. d CYA was near 0. TA went up to 170. FC was 0. PH 7.5 so I Added 2 jugs of 128oz of 10% Sodium Hypo and next MORNING FC was 4.5. Took water sample to store 12hrs later to verify my results. Basically the same results except FC dropped to .5. So I added 2 more jugs of chlorine. Also added total 1 1/4 gal of Muriatic acid over 3 separate 6 hour time frames. Following day I added Half of what I needed to raise CYA slightly 1 lb. Waited and on 3rd day added 2 jugs in morning and FC was 2.5 two hours later and then 8 hours later added 2 more jugs and rechecked an hour later and still 2.5. QUESTIONS
1. DO I JUST KEEP ADDING CHLORINE(APPROX 7 NOW AND IT SEEMS LIKE A LOT)
2. CAN I TEST TA AND CYA ACCURATELY WHILE ADDING MURIATIC ACID AND SMALL AMOUNT OF STABILIZER. BEEN 3 DAYS SINCE ADDING BOTH
3. I ALSO THRU A PUCK IN SKIMMER SINCE AT THAT TIME CYA WAS 0. 1ST TIME EVER. THEY SHAMED ME IN TO BUYING A DOZEN FOR $40 AT STORE AND SAID 10% BLEACH JUG IS A VERY LOW DOSE.
REASON I AM ASKING ABOUT FC IS OLD POOL MATH PAGE SHOWS ME PUTTING IN DOUBLE THE AMOUNT I NEED AT 256 OZ(SO ITS NOT A LOW DOSE AS OLD POOL MATH PAGE INDICATES ...ITS DOUBLE THE DOSE) AND I HAVE 896 OZ IN NOW. 2ND REASON IS AND I KNOW IT SOUND CRAZY BUT I DID NOT THINK YOU LOST CYA UNLESS RAIN OR ADDITION OF NEW WATER AND THIS IS THE 2ND TIME I HAD CYA IN RANGE AND WENT TO ZERO OVER A 2 YR PERIOD. THANKS ... I APPRECIATE YOUR TIME
TROUBLED MAN
 
DASTEELERS said:
7600 GAL FIBERGLASS POOL....2nd year for pool....Went away for 5 days on an auto covered pool that was FC of 8.5 and everything balanced except TA was 150. CYA was 120 at that time because pool company who opened did not listen to what I wanted. Came back water slightly cloudy and can see half way down. d CYA was near 0. TA went up to 170. FC was 0. PH 7.5 so I Added 2 jugs of 128oz of 10% Sodium Hypo and next MORNING FC was 4.5. Took water sample to store 12hrs later to verify my results. Basically the same results except FC dropped to .5. So I added 2 more jugs of chlorine. Also added total 1 1/4 gal of Muriatic acid over 3 separate 6 hour time frames. Following day I added Half of what I needed to raise CYA slightly 1 lb. Waited and on 3rd day added 2 jugs in morning and FC was 2.5 two hours later and then 8 hours later added 2 more jugs and rechecked an hour later and still 2.5. QUESTIONS
1. DO I JUST KEEP ADDING CHLORINE(APPROX 7 NOW AND IT SEEMS LIKE A LOT)
2. CAN I TEST TA AND CYA ACCURATELY WHILE ADDING MURIATIC ACID AND SMALL AMOUNT OF STABILIZER. BEEN 3 DAYS SINCE ADDING BOTH
3. I ALSO THRU A PUCK IN SKIMMER SINCE AT THAT TIME CYA WAS 0. 1ST TIME EVER. THEY SHAMED ME IN TO BUYING A DOZEN FOR $40 AT STORE AND SAID 10% BLEACH JUG IS A VERY LOW DOSE.
REASON I AM ASKING ABOUT FC IS OLD POOL MATH PAGE SHOWS ME PUTTING IN DOUBLE THE AMOUNT I NEED AT 256 OZ(SO ITS NOT A LOW DOSE AS OLD POOL MATH PAGE INDICATES ...ITS DOUBLE THE DOSE) AND I HAVE 896 OZ IN NOW. 2ND REASON IS AND I KNOW IT SOUND CRAZY BUT I DID NOT THINK YOU LOST CYA UNLESS RAIN OR ADDITION OF NEW WATER AND THIS IS THE 2ND TIME I HAD CYA IN RANGE AND WENT TO ZERO OVER A 2 YR PERIOD. THANKS ... I APPRECIATE YOUR TIME
TROUBLED MAN
Click to expand...
I have Taylor kit
 
It really is crazy situation. Pool is covered fiberglass. So no debris or sunlight and FC was 8.5 before I left. I know the ALK had to come down a 1/3 but was going to get to it when I got back from a short vacation. NOW I have 10 128oz jugs in pool and water is clear half way down and will have to wait until I wake up in morning.
 
DASTEELERS said:
It really is crazy situation. Pool is covered fiberglass. So no debris or sunlight and FC was 8.5 before I left. I know the ALK had to come down a 1/3 but was going to get to it when I got back from a short vacation. NOW I have 10 128oz jugs in pool and water is clear half way down and will have to wait until I wake up in morning.
Click to expand...
Good morning. Pool half cloudy. Todays results FC1... TA60...PH under 7 24 gets me to 7.2 25drops to 7.4...CYA almost disappears at 30.
 
You need to follow the SLAM Process step by step without shortcuts.

With CYA of 30 and pH of 7.2 you a e ready to raise your FC to 12 using liquid chlrone and MAINTAIN it there, The more often you test and top your FC back to 16 the faster it will go.

MAINTAIN your FC at 12 until you meet all three exit criteria.

Keep your cover open and run your pump 24/7.

Stay out of the pool store and don't put pucks in your skimmer.
 
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Been 3 days of adding 13 Jugs of 10%CL and muriatic acid. Water haziness is 50% better. Getting ready to SLAM. Added at noon almost half of Borax 50oz of 123needed) to raise PH back up from 6.5 after muriatic acid to get ALK to currently 75. PH was 7.5 before acid. Waiting 4 hrs to test and add more Borax . Hopefully will be able to Slam this evening.
 
Part of the issue is that TA is the last thing to worry about. A TA of 50 or above is perfectly fine. High TA doesn’t harm anything.
Fc is paramount & the ta can be dealt with AFTER the SLAM Process. Trying to do so concurrently just adds complication.
You should never lower ph below 7.0 just to target a specific ta. You risk damage to surfaces and equipment & put yourself on the ph/ta merry go round 🔁 with chems.
In the future this is how u safely lower TA if u feel it’s needed to moderate ph rise.
👇
www.google.com

Lower Total Alkalinity

A lower Total Alkalinity level can help a pool owner stabalize their pH increase. We'll explain how to lower TA with a little help from muriatic acid.
www.google.com www.google.com


Pool Care Basics
 
TO LATE NOW....It was TA175 with PH 7.5. NOW it is TA75 and PH is 6.5 being adjusted with Borax. 1st dose 50oz and 2nd dose 560z since it did not reach bottom color scale reading yet. Will retest PH at 5 pm. I have 15 jugs in 7600 gal pool. With LOW CH of 150 and CYA of 30 can I use the only 2 bags(1lb each) I ever bought of 73%CAL HYPO to help with the slam this evening or just stay with the 10% liquid chlorine to get it to register higher ? If I can add the Cal Hypo can I add the liquid 10% an hour later if FC doesn't go up to range in an hour ?? I appreciate all the help . Happy fathers day
 

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Why Does pH drop When Treating Ammonia With Liquid Chlorine?

Oxidizing ammonia creates acid by releasing hydrogen.

More than 95% of ammonia is in the form of the ammonium ion (NH4+)

2NH4+ + 3OCl- --> N2 + 3H2O + 2H+ +3Cl-

When adding 12.5% sodium hypochlorite (liquid chlorine) to a pool to oxidize ammonia, every gallon of liquid chlorine will create the equivalent of 15 ounces of 31.45% hydrochloric acid.

10 gallons of 12.5% liquid chlorine added to 25,000 gallons of pool water with ammonia will lower the TA by about 23 ppm or the equivalent of adding 150 ounces of full strength 31.45% muriatic acid.

Every 8.53 gallons of 12.5% liquid chlorine is equivalent to about 1 gallon of 31.45% acid.

Ammonia - Further Reading

www.troublefreepool.com www.troublefreepool.com
 
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I would hold off on the cal hypo for now - you don’t wanna cause an issue with clouding/precipitating etc. due to your yo-yo-ing ph. Stick with the liquid chlorine. One won’t “register” higher than the other if you use what PoolMath tells u to get to your slam target. One form is no more potent than the other if used in the prescribed amount based on your pool volume. Once your ph is 7.2 begin SLAM Process with liquid chlorine.
 
Mdragger88 said:
Once your ph is 7.2 begin SLAM Process with liquid chlorine
Click to expand...

@JamesW Since adding chlorine is making the ph go down, what is the best way to counter this and continue a slam? Is the solution to increase PH and then add liquid chlorine each time? Or is the solution to move forward with a low ph? The latter seems problematic for the equipment, especially if the water is running through a heater. What is the guidance when low ph is involved?
 
@kul
The op added lots of acid trying to unnecessarily adjust his ta thereby tanking his ph- before that his ph was mid 7’s. & his cya was holding as well as some fc. I think he may be out of the ammonia woods & in to SLAM Process territory now as soon as he corrects his ph.
 
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DASTEELERS said:
TO LATE NOW....It was TA175 with PH 7.5. NOW it is TA75 and PH is 6.5 being adjusted with Borax. 1st dose 50oz and 2nd dose 560z since it did not reach bottom color scale reading yet. Will retest PH at 5 pm. I have 15 jugs in 7600 gal pool. With LOW CH of 150 and CYA of 30 can I use the only 2 bags(1lb each) I ever bought of 73%CAL HYPO to help with the slam this evening or just stay with the 10% liquid chlorine to get it to register higher ? If I can add the Cal Hypo can I add the liquid 10% an hour later if FC doesn't go up to range in an hour ?? I appreciate all the help . Happy fathers day
Click to expand...
So is the best way to get to a good PH with Borax added to wait the 2 hours to test PH or wait for 2 days ??? Trying to SLAM THANKS
 
Great. I think this thing is finally starting to go my way. Water 80 % clear and PH up to 7. FC up to 12 for 6 hours so far. Was wondering why there is no calculation for 25% Liquid sodium hydroxide in a jug on Math page since it so widely used in well water treatment and much cheaper and easier to deal with than powder products ?
 
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