Pump died, what’s my fastest route to get water filtering again?

[bbutters]

My pump is clearly toast - it spins up but no pressure is made, and it takes several seconds to coast to a stop. Some sort of internal failure. I posted not long ago that it ran after the output hose burst, so that surely accelerated the failure and I should have assumed I had less time to act.

I’m pretty handy and could probably do this myself but in the interest of time I might have to rely on a pro. Is this a job for a pool builder?

Do I just get the same spec again?

Is there something I could get to plumb in temporarily?

 

[Texas Splash]

First thing is be sure to add some liquid chlorine now (and each day) and brush it around good to help try to avoid an algae mess. As for the pump/motor, you can either buy a totally new pump, or purchase a replacement motor to change out that old single speed. In some cases, a total replacement is your best option. Variable speed pumps are preferred nowadays and are made by several manufactures now, so there are some better deals than a few years ago. In some cases a VSP is about the same cost as just a motor. If you decide to only replace the motor, no more single speeds. You should be able to find a 2-speed or perhaps even a variable speed motor that will mate to your wet end. You can call any of the pool supply places online to confirm.

 

[bbutters]

Thanks, I will do that.

I think in the interest of time and keeping cost low I’m leaning towards doing the work myself, and to keep it simple you’re right I should just get a new pump/motor assembly.

I’ll have to take some liberties with the calculations, I don’t know exactly how the plumbing runs. I do have a pretty big sand filter so that must be part of the reason the motor is 1.5 hp despite the pool being so small.

Is variable speed worth 2x? Dohenys has max-flo XL 1 hp at $580, and max-flo VS 1.6 hp at $1200. Dang.

 

[Texas Splash]

The big names can get pricey. Sometimes it's hard to justify the old say, "You get what you pay for." But Doheny and Calimar both have several models at a cheaper cost. You might do a quick search here on the forum for those brand names and you'll see quire a few members who have them.

 

[ccbill]

Variable or two speed is worth the extra cost if you run it at a lower rpm (lower watts, lower cost). Depending on your electric rates you'll make that extra cost back.

 

[1Sammy]

OR, take the wet end off and install a new impeller for around $35.

 

[bbutters]

OR, take the wet end off and install a new impeller for around $35.

Any decent writeups out there for doing this job? Think it's surely repairable? My fear is that I don't order the pump and then disassemble the pump only to have a couple day outage turn into a week+ outage.

 

[Elle Oh]

Any decent writeups out there for doing this job? Think it's surely repairable? My fear is that I don't order the pump and then disassemble the pump only to have a couple day outage turn into a week+ outage.

Any decent writeups out there for doing this job? Think it's surely repairable? My fear is that I don't order the pump and then disassemble the pump only to have a couple day outage turn into a week+ outage.

I can't offer repair advice, but I can hopefully lift the pressure off your shoulders from a time perspective.
I've been without a working pump for 2 weeks and following the advice I found on this site (daily liquid chlorine additions via pool math app calculations and brushing after addition) mine is still clean and algae free. This pic is from the 12th day without a pump or any filtration.

 

[bbutters]

Thanks @Elle Oh that does put me at some ease. The next few days through the weekend, as you know, are looking to be prime pool weather here in PA! So I can only hope that the water remains clear/safe for use despite not having filtration. I will continue to follow the same regimen and put my wireless vacuum through its paces.

After rebate from my electric company, the Hayward Max-Flo VS is $450 more than the comparable Harris VS unit. I'm thinking it might be worth it for an extra year of warranty, plus the ability to remote-mount the control pad is a big plus given that my equipment resides in a fairly tight pump house.

I'll pull the motor and report back.

 

[bbutters]

I do get a little confused on the pump sizing calculation and output data from the pumps themselves... if I'm reading it right, if my system has 30 ft of head then I won't get any flow at speeds 1 and 2, only at 3 and 4. Maybe that's fine, but is that right? And at speed 4 the GPM is higher than what my filter is rated for? Seems like I must be misunderstanding.

 

[Texas Splash]

I do get a little confused on the pump sizing calculation and output data from the pumps themselves... if I'm reading it right, if my system has 30 ft of head then I won't get any flow at speeds 1 and 2, only at 3 and 4. Maybe that's fine, but is that right? And at speed 4 the GPM is higher than what my filter is rated for? Seems like I must be misunderstanding.

We can ask @mas985 for some hydraulics feedback to your question.

 

[mas985]

Anymore, you really don't have a choice when it comes to pumps. Manufactures are no longer allowed to make single/dual speed pumps above a certain size so there is little to no availability for anything other than a VS pump.

I do get a little confused on the pump sizing calculation and output data from the pumps themselves... if I'm reading it right, if my system has 30 ft of head then I won't get any flow at speeds 1 and 2, only at 3 and 4. Maybe that's fine, but is that right? And at speed 4 the GPM is higher than what my filter is rated for? Seems like I must be misunderstanding.

Head is not a constant. It depends on flow rate and flow rate depends on head loss. It is a system two equations (pump head curve vs plumbing head curve) and two unknowns (head vs flow) and it is not a trivial exercise to find the operating point (curve cross over) of a pump. But if you go with a VS pump, then it doesn't really matter anyway. Flow rate will just be proportional to RPM. 1/2 speed is 1/2 flow rate. You can always set the VS pump maximum RPM for your filters maximum flow rate recommendation.

Availability is going to be the biggest barrier. Find out what you can get for what cost and go from there. Don't assume that anything you see on the internet is available. It may not be.

But it sounds like the impeller may have come loose from the motor shaft. Have you taken apart the pump to inspect it? It might be possible to repair if you want to go that route.

 

[bbutters]

Anymore, you really don't have a choice when it comes to pumps. Manufactures are no longer allowed to make single/dual speed pumps above a certain size so there is little to no availability for anything other than a VS pump.


Head is not a constant. It depends on flow rate and flow rate depends on head loss. It is a system two equations (pump head curve vs plumbing head curve) and two unknowns (head vs flow) and it is not a trivial exercise to find the operating point (curve cross over) of a pump. But if you go with a VS pump, then it doesn't really matter anyway. Flow rate will just be proportional to RPM. 1/2 speed is 1/2 flow rate. You can always set the VS pump maximum RPM for your filters maximum flow rate recommendation.

Availability is going to be the biggest barrier. Find out what you can get for what cost and go from there. Don't assume that anything you see on the internet is available. It may not be.

But it sounds like the impeller may have come loose from the motor shaft. Have you taken apart the pump to inspect it? It might be possible to repair if you want to go that route.

Thanks.

Looks like availability from the online stores gives me a few options, and I also just discovered that I could consider a Hayward MaxFlo VS motor upgrade from INYO for a little more than a Harris complete pump, but less than a complete Hayward VS pump assembly.

I'm going to remove the pump this evening and unbolt the motor from the wet end to take a look and report back.

Attached is a better photo of the plumbing. I hope the suction side shut off valve holds, as the pump is below skimmer level and replacing that valve would be a little messy/wet. I’ll put a union on the output side in the process.

 

[amymeme]

You said the pump "spins up?" Does that mean your motor is working but your not getting any suction? If so, you can get a seals kit, maybe add impeller for a lot less money and rebuild your pump. While you do that, maybe look around for a used one on Craig's list or FB marketplace. I rebuilt an old Hayward super pump to keep as a backup for one slightly newer I picked up used locally. It is now my pump in use while I rebuild the other one. Rebuilding is not hard. At least the seals and stuff. I haven't had to replace the motor yet.

 

[mas985]

The valve right before the pump looks to be in the off position.

 

[bbutters]

You said the pump "spins up?" Does that mean your motor is working but your not getting any suction? If so, you can get a seals kit, maybe add impeller for a lot less money and rebuild your pump. While you do that, maybe look around for a used one on Craig's list or FB marketplace. I rebuilt an old Hayward super pump to keep as a backup for one slightly newer I picked up used locally. It is now my pump in use while I rebuild the other one. Rebuilding is not hard. At least the steaks and stuff. I haven't had to replace the motor yet.

Yes. I'm going to disassemble and look at that option depending on what I find.

The valve right before the pump looks to be in the off position.

I closed it in preparation for servicing / removing the pump, don't worry it was open prior to this.

 

[wireform]

Thanks.

Looks like availability from the online stores gives me a few options, and I also just discovered that I could consider a Hayward MaxFlo VS motor upgrade from INYO for a little more than a Harris complete pump, but less than a complete Hayward VS pump assembly.

I'm going to remove the pump this evening and unbolt the motor from the wet end to take a look and report back.

Attached is a better photo of the plumbing. I hope the suction side shut off valve holds, as the pump is below skimmer level and replacing that valve would be a little messy/wet. I’ll put a union on the output side in the process.

I don't see why you need the tan valve right before the pump if you have a jandy diverter valve right behind it.

 

[bbutters]

I don't see why you need the tan valve right before the pump if you have a jandy diverter valve right behind it.

I had the same thought, but checked it and I can only close/throttle one side (skimmer) or the other (drain) - I can’t move the valve handle to where “closed” is on the pump side.

 

[wireform]

I had the same thought, but checked it and I can only close/throttle one side (skimmer) or the other (drain) - I can’t move the valve handle to where “closed” is on the pump side.

If you remove the plastic screw from the center of the handle you can then lift it partially above the stops to close the pump side. This is only for while your working on the pump but not while the pump is running as a precaution not to starve the pump.

 

[bbutters]

I’m interpreting the condition of the pump shaft as “need a new motor” at minimum. Maybe the threads could be cleaned up? But the shaft squeaks, it’s bearing is shot for sure. I should probably take this “opportunity” to upgrade… to the century / Vgreen VS retrofit: Hayward MaxFlo VS Motor Upgrade Kit - 1.65HP - MKIT1VS16 - INYOPools.com