pool resurface attempt 2024

[sdtfp]

I've been trying to have my pool resurfaced the last couple of years with no luck. Still haven't found a pro I feel comfortable with. I spoke with a new one recently and have some questions.

My plan is to have the pool resurfaced and coping replaced this year (maybe) and then a few years from now have the concrete deck and patio replaced. IMG_20220831_131725[1].jpg

1. Chip out is still recommended right? None of the contractors I spoke to mentioned chip out. This last one did mention that if I keep the tile line then the pool surface would stick out (1/2? in ch) and it looks better if I replace the tiles as well. All the other contractors just assumed i would replace the tile line, so maybe they assumed a chip out but didn't mention it? I haven't gotten the quote yet but maybe it will be lower then others and that should give me indication that others did include chip out. He showed me sample surface, I think they are like quartz pool plaster sgm cool blue.

2. Coping height. I think my coping is 1.5 inch. I think all the contractors except this last one assumed I would just stick with that and get the white limestone coping that is like 2 ft long. This guy gave suggestion that I could also go with pavers height. I think it's like 2.5" or something. He mentioned Cambridge but im not sure if that was for the coping or the deck/patio pavers. If I go with the 2.5" it would be a tripping hazard, but he said maybe he can add like a ramp of cement to lessen the hazard. Although, he seemed to have backed off that idea and then mentioned wood. I'm guessing I shouldn't be pouring concrete over the joint between the coping and the deck right? So I think i go with the white limestone

3. Planning for Patio/deck. Currently I have a cement deck and its fine, I don't know any better. This contractor suggested Cambridge pavers, seems like that is his product of choice. I wanted to know what do most people get? It maybe regional and I suspect my area is pavers (expensive neighborhood). I thinks pavers make sense in the patio, but I'm not too familiar with that on pools. I guess it makes sense to match them up. But how do pavers feel under your feet when your using the pool? The contractor also mentioned its hard to do concrete because they can't pull the truck up close enough. I don't know if that is true or he is just pushing pavers. Secondly, the contractor mentioned he could move up the coping a bit so that I could put pavers on top of my concrete patio. But since I am doing this in two phases, it would produce a tripping hazard. So for my case, the best thing is for me to rip out my patio in the future correct? It sounds like it would be more expensive but probably better job.

4. Maintaining the pool after resurfacing. Some contractors said they would do it and charge me while this latest guy said I could do it and it would save me money. I just have to brush lightly daily and keep the chemicals balanced. Seems simple enough, should I do it myself or have the company do it so that its easier to have them fix any issues that come up? He mentioned the warranty will still be covered as long as I log stuff. But i feel that if i had problems, they will be quick to blame me and not want to fix things.

5. Tile line. This latest guy wanted to do just 1 6" tile. I asked for 2 3" tiles so the water line is visible. What do you guys recommend?

6. Niche light. I have 110 Volt niche light. I wanted him to replace with new LED light. He seemed to be stuck on the wiring aspects of it and wouldn't commit to doing it. I have a box that is like 10 feet from the niche that has the wiring, so i don't see any issue for him just to pull new wires and replace the niche fixture and bulb. HE did speak a lot of grounding, stakes and rebar. Mentioned the pool needs to be grounded. Other guys just said they would replace the niche and didn't mention anything about grounding or it being something complicated. What needs to be done exactly? Can I do it myself? I do electrical stuff around the house and I can fish the wires. But I don't know how to ground a pool. Maybe its just connecting the ground wire to the rebar? HE did mention something about leaving it exposed so I can ground it myself. I am not sure if he meant leaving exposed rebar in the niche?

7. Coping length. The white limestone coping I was shown was like 24 inches long. Whereas the other options seems to be smaller, like pavers. The one I was shown was like this:
If I go with pavers for deck and patio, this one makes sense. But if I go with a concrete deck, would those be a bad choice? I like the length of the limestone ones but it seems like it only comes in white and I am not sure i like that or maybe im not used to it. I think it only comes in white because I want the one with the bull nose. I think its this one from npt :

Anything else that is 24" long would be greater than 1.5" in heigh, which would be to tall to replace my existing one.

Anything else I should be considering? Seems like I learn something new every year. But I want to get this done this year, so need to finish learning.

 

[Bperry]

I've been trying to have my pool resurfaced the last couple of years with no luck. Still haven't found a pro I feel comfortable with. I spoke with a new one recently and have some questions.

My plan is to have the pool resurfaced and coping replaced this year (maybe) and then a few years from now have the concrete deck and patio replaced. IMG_20220831_131725[1].jpg

1. Chip out is still recommended right? None of the contractors I spoke to mentioned chip out. This last one did mention that if I keep the tile line then the pool surface would stick out (1/2? in ch) and it looks better if I replace the tiles as well. All the other contractors just assumed i would replace the tile line, so maybe they assumed a chip out but didn't mention it? I haven't gotten the quote yet but maybe it will be lower then others and that should give me indication that others did include chip out. He showed me sample surface, I think they are like quartz pool plaster sgm cool blue.

2. Coping height. I think my coping is 1.5 inch. I think all the contractors except this last one assumed I would just stick with that and get the white limestone coping that is like 2 ft long. This guy gave suggestion that I could also go with pavers height. I think it's like 2.5" or something. He mentioned Cambridge but im not sure if that was for the coping or the deck/patio pavers. If I go with the 2.5" it would be a tripping hazard, but he said maybe he can add like a ramp of cement to lessen the hazard. Although, he seemed to have backed off that idea and then mentioned wood. I'm guessing I shouldn't be pouring concrete over the joint between the coping and the deck right? So I think i go with the white limestone

3. Planning for Patio/deck. Currently I have a cement deck and its fine, I don't know any better. This contractor suggested Cambridge pavers, seems like that is his product of choice. I wanted to know what do most people get? It maybe regional and I suspect my area is pavers (expensive neighborhood). I thinks pavers make sense in the patio, but I'm not too familiar with that on pools. I guess it makes sense to match them up. But how do pavers feel under your feet when your using the pool? The contractor also mentioned its hard to do concrete because they can't pull the truck up close enough. I don't know if that is true or he is just pushing pavers. Secondly, the contractor mentioned he could move up the coping a bit so that I could put pavers on top of my concrete patio. But since I am doing this in two phases, it would produce a tripping hazard. So for my case, the best thing is for me to rip out my patio in the future correct? It sounds like it would be more expensive but probably better job.

4. Maintaining the pool after resurfacing. Some contractors said they would do it and charge me while this latest guy said I could do it and it would save me money. I just have to brush lightly daily and keep the chemicals balanced. Seems simple enough, should I do it myself or have the company do it so that its easier to have them fix any issues that come up? He mentioned the warranty will still be covered as long as I log stuff. But i feel that if i had problems, they will be quick to blame me and not want to fix things.

5. Tile line. This latest guy wanted to do just 1 6" tile. I asked for 2 3" tiles so the water line is visible. What do you guys recommend?

6. Niche light. I have 110 Volt niche light. I wanted him to replace with new LED light. He seemed to be stuck on the wiring aspects of it and wouldn't commit to doing it. I have a box that is like 10 feet from the niche that has the wiring, so i don't see any issue for him just to pull new wires and replace the niche fixture and bulb. HE did speak a lot of grounding, stakes and rebar. Mentioned the pool needs to be grounded. Other guys just said they would replace the niche and didn't mention anything about grounding or it being something complicated. What needs to be done exactly? Can I do it myself? I do electrical stuff around the house and I can fish the wires. But I don't know how to ground a pool. Maybe its just connecting the ground wire to the rebar? HE did mention something about leaving it exposed so I can ground it myself. I am not sure if he meant leaving exposed rebar in the niche?

7. Coping length. The white limestone coping I was shown was like 24 inches long. Whereas the other options seems to be smaller, like pavers. The one I was shown was like this:View attachment 551646
If I go with pavers for deck and patio, this one makes sense. But if I go with a concrete deck, would those be a bad choice? I like the length of the limestone ones but it seems like it only comes in white and I am not sure i like that or maybe im not used to it.

Anything else I should be considering? Seems like I learn something new every year. But I want to get this done this year, so need to finish learning.

You need to tell the contractors what you want. If you want chip out, make it a requirement. They won’t do it otherwise. Even replacing the tile, they’ll just add an extra layer of mortar to make it match the new pool surface.

 

[sdtfp]

I went to a pool distributor near me and found they do offer pre cast coping in other colors. I don't know why any of the contractors ive met with mentioned it. Perhaps that is special order and never worth the cost. They always just recommend white. I will need to ask them. But I like that style and prefer it over paver sized ones.

Regarding the concrete deck, I will need to find a contractor who does that. I will talk to them and be more assertive that I don't want pavers or premium stones. I think the default for high end pools might be pavers around here so that is the recommendations I am getting.

Regarding chip out, I have reached out to one contractor and they said they don't do chip out unless the plaster is delaminated. I will reach out to others but again, this seems not to be the norm and I am going to have to be aggressive about asking for it and hopefully I find a contractor that is willing to do it.

 

[Bperry]

I went to a pool distributor near me and found they do offer pre cast coping in other colors. I don't know why any of the contractors ive met with mentioned it. Perhaps that is special order and never worth the cost. They always just recommend white. I will need to ask them. But I like that style and prefer it over paver sized ones.

Regarding the concrete deck, I will need to find a contractor who does that. I will talk to them and be more assertive that I don't want pavers or premium stones. I think the default for high end pools might be pavers around here so that is the recommendations I am getting.

Regarding chip out, I have reached out to one contractor and they said they don't do chip out unless the plaster is delaminated. I will reach out to others but again, this seems not to be the norm and I am going to have to be aggressive about asking for it and hopefully I find a contractor that is willing to do it.

No one will chip out the plaster unless you specifically ask them for the cost to do so. It’s no fun and expensive so it’s not gonna be included in a generic estimate.

 

[ajw22]

Regarding chip out, I have reached out to one contractor and they said they don't do chip out unless the plaster is delaminated.

So he told you they do chipouts!

Tell him that is great and he should assume your plaster is delaminated do you want it chipped out. Include it in the contract and pricing.

Ask how the chipout is done? If chisels are used you want it done with flat chisels and not pointed chisels. Pointed chisels dig in too deep and damage the gunite shell. Other methods of doing chipouts are sand blasting or high pressure water blasting.

 

[sdtfp]

So he told you they do chipouts!

Tell him that is great and he should assume your plaster is delaminated do you want it chipped out. Include it in the contract and pricing.

Ask how the chipout is done? If chisels are used you want it done with flat chisels and not pointed chisels. Pointed chisels dig in too deep and damage the gunite shell. Other methods of doing chipouts are sand blasting or high pressure water blasting.

How do I know if my pool has been replastered before without a chip out? Like how many layers deep is it? Or it doesn't matter and 1 layer is enough to warrant a chip out?

 

[ajw22]

How do I know if my pool has been replastered before without a chip out? Like how many layers deep is it? Or it doesn't matter and 1 layer is enough to warrant a chip out?

How old is your pool?

You don’t know and that is a reason to do a chipout to put new plaster on a solid base.

 

[sktn77a]

It's much easier to chip out plaster that's delaminated than plaster that's firmly adhered to the gunite. They just want an easy life!

 

[sdtfp]

So he told you they do chipouts!

Tell him that is great and he should assume your plaster is delaminated do you want it chipped out. Include it in the contract and pricing.

Ask how the chipout is done? If chisels are used you want it done with flat chisels and not pointed chisels. Pointed chisels dig in too deep and damage the gunite shell. Other methods of doing chipouts are sand blasting or high pressure water blasting.

I asked and he said he would need to get a quote for chip out and if he had to guess the price would be 20-30k for a chip out. So I assume that means he is contracting it out. I asked about sandblasting and he said its likely my town doesn't allow it and I would need to do water blasting. I'm guessing this is a crazy price right? Everything is adding up close 100k. Can't i just get a brand new pool at this point lol. They also have a 3 year warranty, which seems really short to me. What do you guys think? Since they don't normally do chip out, maybe 3 years is just short enough so they dont get on the hook for not doing the chip out.

I will be asking more contractors soon, but I'm dreading it. Doubt anyone wants to do chip out around here.

One more thing, how long can I go without replastering? At the rate I am going I dont think I'll get it done anytime soon. There is only a few spots on the pool floor where I can tell that replastering is needed as it feels rough under my foot. These spots are like an 1" squared in size. Is it possible I can have 5 more years before I need this done? The benefit of waiting would be that I can do the pool deck (pavers) and the resurfacing + coping in one shot. Instead of my current plan of doing the deck 4 or 5 years from now.

 

[Bperry]

I asked and he said he would need to get a quote for chip out and if he had to guess the price would be 20-30k for a chip out. So I assume that means he is contracting it out. I asked about sandblasting and he said its likely my town doesn't allow it and I would need to do water blasting. I'm guessing this is a crazy price right? Everything is adding up close 100k. Can't i just get a brand new pool at this point lol. They also have a 3 year warranty, which seems really short to me. What do you guys think? Since they don't normally do chip out, maybe 3 years is just short enough so they dont get on the hook for not doing the chip out.

I will be asking more contractors soon, but I'm dreading it. Doubt anyone wants to do chip out around here.

One more thing, how long can I go without replastering? At the rate I am going I dont think I'll get it done anytime soon. There is only a few spots on the pool floor where I can tell that replastering is needed as it feels rough under my foot. These spots are like an 1" squared in size. Is it possible I can have 5 more years before I need this done? The benefit of waiting would be that I can do the pool deck (pavers) and the resurfacing + coping in one shot. Instead of my current plan of doing the deck 4 or 5 years from now.

I Dunno. If the plaster that’s on there is 20 years old, then it’s super worth chipping it out and starting over. If it’s 5 years old or less and has been taken care of it’s probably much easier to get a replaster that bonds over it ok if they prep it right. A good plaster job should last 20 years.

A rough spot of plaster doesn’t necessarily mean it needs to be redone. If chunks are missing, that’s what you need to watch out for. Even chunks can be patched.

 

[MAPR-Austin]

We use 40k hydro-blasting instead of chipping. For our standard prep we blast the entire surface and that removes about 1/4-3/8" of material. We also do 100% removal to the pool shell.

What I have noticed is that the plaster gets exponentially harder to remove after that initial layer comes off. I feel like as long as the plaster is not delaminating we are getting most of the benefits of full removal - the surface is incredibly rough and clean. A local hydro-blasting company would probably be 7-10k to blast and clean up the entire surface, but not full removal. It gives a great mechanical bond for the new plaster, it hangs nicely for troweling and dries evenly.

The answer to your 'how long can I go without replastering' can only come from you. Rough plaster is not going to cause your pool to collapse, stained plaster is not going to cause any cracks or leaks. As long as you can stand to look at and swim in it, it is probably good to go.

We go to the NY/NJ area occasionally for big projects, if you don't find anyone local let me know and maybe we can tee your project up if the schedule works.

 

[sdtfp]

We use 40k hydro-blasting instead of chipping. For our standard prep we blast the entire surface and that removes about 1/4-3/8" of material. We also do 100% removal to the pool shell.

What I have noticed is that the plaster gets exponentially harder to remove after that initial layer comes off. I feel like as long as the plaster is not delaminating we are getting most of the benefits of full removal - the surface is incredibly rough and clean. A local hydro-blasting company would probably be 7-10k to blast and clean up the entire surface, but not full removal. It gives a great mechanical bond for the new plaster, it hangs nicely for troweling and dries evenly.

The answer to your 'how long can I go without replastering' can only come from you. Rough plaster is not going to cause your pool to collapse, stained plaster is not going to cause any cracks or leaks. As long as you can stand to look at and swim in it, it is probably good to go.

We go to the NY/NJ area occasionally for big projects, if you don't find anyone local let me know and maybe we can tee your project up if the schedule works.

great info thanks! And thanks for the offer, I'm going to try going local a little longer since it's always nice to find someone local you can call on for future work. Things are looking a little less hopeless now that you confirmed there are companies that do this.

And I actually spoke to another contractor today and they said they do chip out with a chip gun. So I guess manual chip out? I believe he mentioned chip out is only below the tile line. Is that right or should I be pushing for that to be chipped out as well? I am replacing the tile line, so not sure why they wouldn't chip that out. Maybe that area doesn't get too wet and no traffic so chip out is not needed? He did not recommend chip out though and said once he removes some plaster under the tile line he could see the shape of the plaster and how many layers it has. And at that point I could ask for the chip out. Seems like a big item to ask for at the beginning of a project.

One interesting this is that I'm starting to hear on this forum and from contractors is that plastering is not that important and I can wait. But then I am not sure if the coping still needs to be done now. Half of them sound hollow when you tap on them and I'm worried about the condition of the bond beam. Although, there is nothing apparently wrong yet. I thing I do know is that the expansion join caulk was never maintained and water must be getting under the coping.

Finally if I want to split the project into A) coping, tile line and plaster and B) pool deck .... which one ideally goes first?

 

[MAPR-Austin]

great info thanks! And thanks for the offer, I'm going to try going local a little longer since it's always nice to find someone local you can call on for future work. Things are looking a little less hopeless now that you confirmed there are companies that do this.

And I actually spoke to another contractor today and they said they do chip out with a chip gun. So I guess manual chip out? I believe he mentioned chip out is only below the tile line. Is that right or should I be pushing for that to be chipped out as well? I am replacing the tile line, so not sure why they wouldn't chip that out. Maybe that area doesn't get too wet and no traffic so chip out is not needed? He did not recommend chip out though and said once he removes some plaster under the tile line he could see the shape of the plaster and how many layers it has. And at that point I could ask for the chip out. Seems like a big item to ask for at the beginning of a project.

One interesting this is that I'm starting to hear on this forum and from contractors is that plastering is not that important and I can wait. But then I am not sure if the coping still needs to be done now. Half of them sound hollow when you tap on them and I'm worried about the condition of the bond beam. Although, there is nothing apparently wrong yet. I thing I do know is that the expansion join caulk was never maintained and water must be getting under the coping.

Finally if I want to split the project into A) coping, tile line and plaster and B) pool deck .... which one ideally goes first?

It is standard prep to chip out below the tile line and around fittings/lights. He isn't saying he will chip up the tile bed, he is saying he will chip out the plaster that sits below the tile so that the new plaster finishes flush with the tile instead of sitting proud of it. Removing the surface that has been exposed to and deteriorated by pool water will make for a much better finished product, longevity wise.

If the coping just sounds hollow but isn't loose to the touch, I would just re-caulk the joint between coping and deck and the joint between tile and coping.

Not knowing the specifics of your layout, I would typically say to do the pool interior/tile/coping first - only so that the tile and coping can be set perfectly water-level and the deck can be built off of that. I have seen cases of the deck being built and the elevation being off when the new tile and coping go on. The downside is you would have to really protect the new coping and pool interior from damage when doing the deck work.

Nothing you are describing sounds like you are staring down eminent failure, you have time.

 

[AquaPNC]

You can tell how many layers are on your pool even with the basic prep around inlets/lights/returns in most cases. Standard chip is 2" around these things so go down around 3" and its quite easy to tell.

Or even breaking out a delaminated section will be able to tell you.

We chip out 13K sq ft pools nationwide for a large fitness chain and removing the plaster thats not delaminated isn't easy but not exactly moving mountains either.

Post plaster care is more about balancing the chemicals than anything. Expect your PH to be high as the plaster is bleeding off minerals during the curing stage. Brushing is simple and easy. Getting your PH low and brushing will help expedite exposure but it always will naturally.

The brick coping stones are common and if you have a contractor who knows how to cut straight you can modify at any length. As far as waterline tile I would stick with the 6x6 tile. The more grout joints the more areas with potential to fail and let water penetrate the tile down the road and in our region with months of freeze-thaw cycles things can fail quickly. Make sure your contractor uses polymer mortified thinnest in the applications. One of the most common issues I see is contractors using the cheapest thinnest material to save on costs but essentially decrease the life of the bond.

When the coping goes in it is imperative to have an elastomeric expansion joint installed where the coping meets the concrete deck. Again, water intrusion in our regions creates long-term issues with the shell and sub-base not to only a detriment to the finishes.

Good luck!

 

[sdtfp]

I haven't gotten much further one this.

I wanted to ask is there a difference between marbelite, spects plaster and marcite? Those are the main options i've seen for resurfacing.

Other than that the big thing holding us back is what material for the pool deck. Either a stone like marvel, travertine, sandstone? or a concrete paver or just plain old concrete. We don't know what to choose. We don't really like the look of stone and worried it will be hard to maintain. We found a paver we liked but not sure if it will go with the house. It looks too fancy. Other pavers look terrible to us. We don't like brick. And for plain old concrete we don't like the color. But I have to look into staining it or getting colored concrete. The current deck is concrete and the coping is pre cast concrete. It's not pretty but I guess I am used to it.

We weren't really even planning to do the deck, but I want the coping to match the deck and I feel like it won't if I pick out a coping now and then pick the deck later.

In any case, the prices are crazy and I don't want to pay it unless everything is perfect. An expectation that I think will make it very hard for this project to progress.