Polaris PB4-60 Problem?

[MrBill3]

My Polaris 380 with booster pump has lost power. Normally the wheels turn at 30-32 RPM which has always worked great. Now the wheels are at 24 RPM which is not enough power to move the cleaner from the deep end of the pool to the shallow end. I've done the following:

- Checked the filter screen, it's spotless.
- The pool skimmer is clean.
- I've swapped out the backup valve for a simple swivel, no difference.
- I've taken the Polaris apart to its individual components, there are no problems that I could see.
- When the Polaris was apart, I checked the Water Management System (WMS) carefully, it's fine.
- The fan belts were slightly loose, I tightened them, no difference.
- I installed new tires, no difference.

Now all I can think is that the PB4-60 pump is losing power. But my experience is that a pump either works fine or is dead.

The pump is more than 5 years old which the longest any PB4-60 pump has lasted for me. Considering its age, it's definitely suspect. But I'd hate to spend the $400(+) for a new pump only to find out that the old pump is fine!

So my only questions is: could the pump be the problem?

Thanks for any advice,
Bill

 

[1poolman1]

My Polaris 380 with booster pump has lost power. Normally the wheels turn at 30-32 RPM which has always worked great. Now the wheels are at 24 RPM which is not enough power to move the cleaner from the deep end of the pool to the shallow end. I've done the following:

- Checked the filter screen, it's spotless.
- The pool skimmer is clean.
- I've swapped out the backup valve for a simple swivel, no difference.
- I've taken the Polaris apart to its individual components, there are no problems that I could see.
- When the Polaris was apart, I checked the Water Management System (WMS) carefully, it's fine.
- The fan belts were slightly loose, I tightened them, no difference.
- I installed new tires, no difference.

Now all I can think is that the PB4-60 pump is losing power. But my experience is that a pump either works fine or is dead.

The pump is more than 5 years old which the longest any PB4-60 pump has lasted for me. Considering its age, it's definitely suspect. But I'd hate to spend the $400(+) for a new pump only to find out that the old pump is fine!

So my only questions is: could the pump be the problem?

Thanks for any advice,
Bill

Booster pumps either work or they don't. Mine is about 12 years old with no problems. Unless the impeller is broken (I've not ever seen that) or you have a severe leak at the seal there should be no reduction in flow from the pump.
Is your filter clean? If very dirty, flow to the booster can be severely reduced.
Is the booster running at a time when the Intelliflo is at a high enough speed to keep it full? This can be an issue depending on your pluming configuration.
Have you added a blue or red restrictor washer to the wall fitting? Try running the Polaris without one.
Is the pressure relief at the wall fitting completely tightened down? If not try it that way.
Have you increased the flow to the sweep tail? This will reduce the water going to the drive system internally to the Polaris. The adjustment screw will get very hard to move most of the time, but a little encouragement from a pliers can loosen it. You may want to turn it down.

 

[MrBill3]

I have a very large D.E. filter in a very small pool. After cleaning it out last March, the PSI on the filter was 8.0. Today it is 10.0 which means that it is not the problem.

BUT - I just discovered that the reverse valve is stuck! I've ordered another and will replace it soon at which time I'll backwash the filter. I'm wondering if the problem might be the malfunctioning reverse valve?

While at it, southern AZ sun is very hard on everything. Although the hoses are not leaking, I'm going to also replace them and they are included with my valve order. I'm looking forward to the new style connectors, the old ones were a bear to install.

- The filter runs at 3,000 RPM when the booster pump is running.
- There has never been a restrictor at the wall fitting.
- I've tried to tighten the pressure relief valve at the wall but cannot move it by hand. Should I give it a try with a big wrench or will that break it?
- The flow to the tail was set by turning the adjustment screw all the way in, then turning it out 2 full turns. It's been like this for many years.

I'll post again after I get the new valve and hoses installed.

Thanks for the help!
Bill

 

[MrBill3]

FLASH - I found the problem. I put my hand under the pressure relief valve and felt a HUGE amount of water being expelled. So I tried to tighten the large nut on the valve but found that it turned freely and would not lock down. But I did find a point where the water being diverted was minimal and the cleaner now runs at 30 RPM rather than 24 RPM, yea! I will be ordering a replacement valve, but was wondering if there was any way I could set the valve to divert no water?

Later . . . I found I had a spare pressure relief valve. I installed it and now the cleaner is running at 32 RPM, my favorite setting. When I put my hand in front of the new valve, I detected only a trickle of water coming through. The old valve had a large crack in the threaded part of the valve, parallel to the threads.

Consider the problem solved.

- Bill

 

[MrBill3]

There's good news and bad news. The good news is that I went to Lowe's and found a 1" M threaded PVC plug that can completely eliminate the pressure relief valve. The bad news is that I have no idea what problems I might create by replacing the valve with this plug. Anyone?

 

[JoyfulNoise]

The pressure relief valve, like all pressure relieving valves, is, in part, a safety feature. Booster pumps are designed to create a higher pressure water supply than what a standard pool pump can create. Without a way of regulating the water pressure to the Polaris cleaner you run the risk of damaging the cleaner or, worse, the PVC plumbing.

My guess is if you cap off the pressure relieving port, you’re likely going to see the quick connect wall fitting pop off if the pressure gets too high.

 

[ajw22]

I would not cap off the PRV .

You say you replaced the PRV and the cleaner is running at 32 RPM.

Why do you want to do anything more?

 

[1poolman1]

There's good news and bad news. The good news is that I went to Lowe's and found a 1" M threaded PVC plug that can completely eliminate the pressure relief valve. The bad news is that I have no idea what problems I might create by replacing the valve with this plug. Anyone?

You will, most likely, destroy the back-up valve and cleaner itself. The hoses will start to bulge, even the ones at the pump if yours is installed with them, the swivels will leak. There is a reason the engineers design those things. Most booster pumps, including Polaris' own boosters, output more than enough water and pressure, the relief valve makes sure the right amount gets to the cleaner itself.

Polaris designed that wall fitting because years ago the most common thing to see was a Polaris in a pool with a Pool Sweep booster pump. They were a specific pump, although the same 3/4hp, that was used to power a Pool Sweep. That combination ruined the Polaris quickly because it put out too much pressure and water and then customers wanted the Polaris covered under warranty. You very seldom see those pumps anymore. A Polaris PB4-60, like all brands of booster, has to be designed with extra capacity to be able to work under a variety of installation parameters, poor plumbing, long runs, etc. They're still not as powerful as the old Arneson A-60 pump.

 

[MrBill3]

In answer to one person, I would like to use the PVC cap vs. the valve itself so that I don't need to go through all this hassle again. But, you have all made good sense! I'll discard the PVC part and check the valve discharge every few months to ensure it is working correctly.

Thanks, Bill