OrangeAndBlue
Silver Supporter
- Aug 19, 2017
- 128
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Hayward Aqua Rite (T-15)
Please review my build before I sign
- Thread starter mikew2069
- Start date
Mike, I feel for you. It's hard to figure all of this stuff out, and a pool is a big expensive project. My guess is that for many people it's the biggest, most expensive home improvement project they've ever undertaken.
I've owned a number of pools, one with a SWCG and others without. One had a built in cleaner system, actually built into the walls rather than the floor, this was some old school stuff.
Like you, I'm planning out a pool build right now. In certain areas/markets, pool builders can be very resistant to salt pools. Where I live, some builders won't install them, others refuse to warranty the pool and make you sign a release-- one even told my wife that salt water pools cause cancer, I can only wonder what he thinks of the ocean. The builders where I am strongly push the ozone/uv/chlorine puck feeder system. When you read opinions from this site, you may find a lot of folks strongly supporting the use of a SWCG and offering advice that contradicts your pool builder, and it can be hard to know what to choose.
Having done both, I found the pool with the SWCG was far easier to manage, and I'm going to use a builder who will work reasonably with me on this. I didn't have problems with my pool pump burning out, and as others have suggested that isn't an expected downside of a salt system.
As for the in floor cleaner system, if you look into it on this site, there are certainly people who have them and love them. Reading those opinions is probably time well spent.
The old school cleaner system I had leaked terribly and it was really hard to get someone to fix it. The fix ultimately was to render the system useless and seal over all of the ports, and the cost was way more than the system initially cost. I looked into the modern systems with this upcoming build. For me, it seemed too permanent and too many holes and pipes in the bottom of the pool. I have a decent knowledge of boats, and one principle in making a boat easier to manage is to limit the number of things that go through the hull beneath the water line-- to a certain extent I want the same in a pool. It's going to have to a circulation system with suction and returns, enough to work well, but the closer I can get to having an solid concrete bowl the better, IMO.
Also, I had a robot cleaner recently and it did a great job and was easy to use. Way cheaper than an infloor system and I could replace the whole thing with 2 minutes and a few clicks on the internet.
As for corrosiveness of salt water, I can't say I understand the argument that you can increase the amount of salt in water and not have it make a difference on how that solution interacts with metals and other materials, but still it wasn't enough of a problem to make me not use it. Many people manage the pros and cons of putting a $50k to $100k boat directly into the ocean, so why should people who own $50k-$100k pools not be able to manage the pros and cons of a far less concentrated salt solution being in their pool?
As for the decking, we too are going with Sundek or Cool deck for this upcoming build. Travertine and flagstone installed where we are is about $30/sf, whereas the other materials may be less than half of that. Imagine 1000sf of decking and you can figure the costs out pretty easy.
I had KoolDeck before with my SWCG pool and no major problems there. We re-stained it after about 10 years, cost about $800, and it looked good as new.
Best wishes.
I've owned a number of pools, one with a SWCG and others without. One had a built in cleaner system, actually built into the walls rather than the floor, this was some old school stuff.
Like you, I'm planning out a pool build right now. In certain areas/markets, pool builders can be very resistant to salt pools. Where I live, some builders won't install them, others refuse to warranty the pool and make you sign a release-- one even told my wife that salt water pools cause cancer, I can only wonder what he thinks of the ocean. The builders where I am strongly push the ozone/uv/chlorine puck feeder system. When you read opinions from this site, you may find a lot of folks strongly supporting the use of a SWCG and offering advice that contradicts your pool builder, and it can be hard to know what to choose.
Having done both, I found the pool with the SWCG was far easier to manage, and I'm going to use a builder who will work reasonably with me on this. I didn't have problems with my pool pump burning out, and as others have suggested that isn't an expected downside of a salt system.
As for the in floor cleaner system, if you look into it on this site, there are certainly people who have them and love them. Reading those opinions is probably time well spent.
The old school cleaner system I had leaked terribly and it was really hard to get someone to fix it. The fix ultimately was to render the system useless and seal over all of the ports, and the cost was way more than the system initially cost. I looked into the modern systems with this upcoming build. For me, it seemed too permanent and too many holes and pipes in the bottom of the pool. I have a decent knowledge of boats, and one principle in making a boat easier to manage is to limit the number of things that go through the hull beneath the water line-- to a certain extent I want the same in a pool. It's going to have to a circulation system with suction and returns, enough to work well, but the closer I can get to having an solid concrete bowl the better, IMO.
Also, I had a robot cleaner recently and it did a great job and was easy to use. Way cheaper than an infloor system and I could replace the whole thing with 2 minutes and a few clicks on the internet.
As for corrosiveness of salt water, I can't say I understand the argument that you can increase the amount of salt in water and not have it make a difference on how that solution interacts with metals and other materials, but still it wasn't enough of a problem to make me not use it. Many people manage the pros and cons of putting a $50k to $100k boat directly into the ocean, so why should people who own $50k-$100k pools not be able to manage the pros and cons of a far less concentrated salt solution being in their pool?
As for the decking, we too are going with Sundek or Cool deck for this upcoming build. Travertine and flagstone installed where we are is about $30/sf, whereas the other materials may be less than half of that. Imagine 1000sf of decking and you can figure the costs out pretty easy.
I had KoolDeck before with my SWCG pool and no major problems there. We re-stained it after about 10 years, cost about $800, and it looked good as new.
Best wishes.
My Youngest is 9 and both kids are strong swimmers. I think I'm going to go for 3.5 - 5.5 - 4.
Thanks for that very insightful post. You're correct, pool builders that I've met with seem to be pretty anti-SWCG for some reason. So it's hard to balance what they're all selling me vs the opinions of the folks on this board. Why are the builders so against them? Do they make less margin on them? Either way, I'm really leaning towards the SWCG now and I'm thinking about letting the in-floor system go. That one is tough though because the thought of having zero hoses/cables in the pool and an infloor system even just cleaning 70-80% of the pool sounds wonderful. I wouldn't mind brushing the spots it missed. But I think I'm getting scared away from it based on the possibility of a maintenance nightmare like you experienced.
As far as the Sundeck/Kooldeck goes, I spoke with a couple over the holiday weekend that swore against it. They were telling me the salt from their pool cause the coating to chip and peal and it would end up in their pool and look nasty. They were recommending just doing some sort of a tinted stamped concrete... Another example of having to listen to someones experience/opinion and try and make a decision based on that.
- Oct 18, 2009
- 3,637
- Pool Size
- 6000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Hayward Aqua Rite (T-15)
[emoji106]with swg you will not be sorry. IMHO I would go with pavers. They are the most durable. 
At least read the opinions from the folks who like their in floor cleaners. My horror story is from about 3 decades ago-- a lot has changed in pools. One of the better builders here mandates the in-floor system for every install.
One more honest thought on why I didn't want the in-floor system: I was worried I wouldn't understand the system as well as I think I understand a more simple series of return lines. I didn't want a pretty permanently installed system that I didn't understand all that well. Simplicity is important for me.
Your post on Kool Deck really opened my eyes. I didn't know that cool deck could chip or peel. I was amazed how many stories of this I could find with a google search. Some people do suggest that salt water was to blame, but the Kool Deck folks claim the surface is good for salt water when done properly. Here are some pics of my last pool-- the deck is about 10 years old in these pics, and as I said we re-stained it. We re-stained it with something we bought at a paint store, I think it was Sherwin Williams. It was just a concrete stain. We re-stained it because it just generally looked like it had faded with time (not unusual after 7 years in the sun).
A story from one person doesn't prove anything, but I put the pics here because we bought the house from a guy who didn't understand the salt system. He thought it consumed salt and he didn't test the salt level, and when things went wrong, he just added more salt. When we got the pool, the salt level was well over 10,000 (actually was so high that we don't know how exactly how high it was). There was some deterioration of the aluminum cage in areas where water would splash out (not enough for me to replace it) but the decking was fine.
I wonder now if we just had some form of stained textured concrete rather than really "Kool Deck"
One more honest thought on why I didn't want the in-floor system: I was worried I wouldn't understand the system as well as I think I understand a more simple series of return lines. I didn't want a pretty permanently installed system that I didn't understand all that well. Simplicity is important for me.
Your post on Kool Deck really opened my eyes. I didn't know that cool deck could chip or peel. I was amazed how many stories of this I could find with a google search. Some people do suggest that salt water was to blame, but the Kool Deck folks claim the surface is good for salt water when done properly. Here are some pics of my last pool-- the deck is about 10 years old in these pics, and as I said we re-stained it. We re-stained it with something we bought at a paint store, I think it was Sherwin Williams. It was just a concrete stain. We re-stained it because it just generally looked like it had faded with time (not unusual after 7 years in the sun).
A story from one person doesn't prove anything, but I put the pics here because we bought the house from a guy who didn't understand the salt system. He thought it consumed salt and he didn't test the salt level, and when things went wrong, he just added more salt. When we got the pool, the salt level was well over 10,000 (actually was so high that we don't know how exactly how high it was). There was some deterioration of the aluminum cage in areas where water would splash out (not enough for me to replace it) but the decking was fine.
I wonder now if we just had some form of stained textured concrete rather than really "Kool Deck"
Mike, your pool structure is actually quite strong for Houston standards. 1/2" rebar at 8" oc is more than I saw in any of my quotes (maybe except one out of 10). Floors and walls at 9" is also thicker, most quotes we got speced 6" or 8" (you won't be able to check on easily - so you have to trust them on that). All this might cost a bit extra, but at least it shows that this pool builder is not doing things the cheapest way which is nice.
I second the recommendation to go with the SWG, my parents in law have it for 15 years and they have not had any equipment issues nor any issues with the pool coping.
- - - Updated - - -
PS: on sundek vs cool deck. When I did my research I found out that cool deck is a different product and did not hold up well, but that Sundek and other newer Spraydecks are a better material that will last (and with some touch up paint can easily be fixed). We just didn't have the extra $6,000 to upgrade to all travertine decking and figured with little kids it's probably a good option to get the most slip resistance anyway, so we will see how our spray deck will hold up.
I second the recommendation to go with the SWG, my parents in law have it for 15 years and they have not had any equipment issues nor any issues with the pool coping.
- - - Updated - - -
PS: on sundek vs cool deck. When I did my research I found out that cool deck is a different product and did not hold up well, but that Sundek and other newer Spraydecks are a better material that will last (and with some touch up paint can easily be fixed). We just didn't have the extra $6,000 to upgrade to all travertine decking and figured with little kids it's probably a good option to get the most slip resistance anyway, so we will see how our spray deck will hold up.
Cool, I’m really considering doing a stamped concrete that’s dyed. Waiting to hear back from your guy. I emailed him Saturday and he replied first thing this morning and said he would have something ready for me mid-week. I wish hr was a little faster bc I’m ready to get a hole dug!.. but I also realize I’m not the only person on earth
I have a forum etiquette question. I am leaning towards signing with a different PB (thanks to rhawke's recommendation) than the original build list that I posted. I'd like for some of the experts on the forum to review the new/different equipment that this new PB will use. Should I just post that here or start a new thread and label it a build?
Please let me me know what you think about this equipment and what questions I should ask.
Pentair Spa Intellibrite 5G LED Color Light - 640122
Pentair Pool Intellibrite 5G LED Color Light - 601002
Pentair Globrite Light (light for the tanning ledge) - 602055
Pentair Easytouch 8 Pool/Spa Control - 520540
ScreenLogic 2 - 522104
Pentiar Intelliflo Variable Speed Pump – 011056
Pentair 520 Cartridge Filter - 160332
Pentair MasterTemp Heater 400BTU – 460736
Pentair Spa Intellibrite 5G LED Color Light - 640122
Pentair Pool Intellibrite 5G LED Color Light - 601002
Pentair Globrite Light (light for the tanning ledge) - 602055
Pentair Easytouch 8 Pool/Spa Control - 520540
ScreenLogic 2 - 522104
Pentiar Intelliflo Variable Speed Pump – 011056
Pentair 520 Cartridge Filter - 160332
Pentair MasterTemp Heater 400BTU – 460736
Mike,
I see nothing that looks out of place to me...
I like the ET 8 with ScreenLogic, the IntelliFlo pump, and the 520 filter...
Raypak heaters seem to be the most favorite here... But plenty of people have Pentair heaters..
"If" you decide to go with Saltwater, make sure the ET comes with the internal power supply and the SWCG and valves.. It is a package deal and works better. That P/N is 520545...
Thanks,
Jim R.
I see nothing that looks out of place to me...
I like the ET 8 with ScreenLogic, the IntelliFlo pump, and the 520 filter...
Raypak heaters seem to be the most favorite here... But plenty of people have Pentair heaters..
"If" you decide to go with Saltwater, make sure the ET comes with the internal power supply and the SWCG and valves.. It is a package deal and works better. That P/N is 520545...
Thanks,
Jim R.
That's identical to the equipment we are getting. I remember your pool being quite large so if you want a lot of light at night you might want a second pool light. That will end up costing you quite a bit though, probably around 600 for the light plus a couple hundred for the electrician.
My pool and spa are pretty close in size to the one you're planning and I went with the IC60 instead of the IC40 Jim is giving you the part number for. My part number (same kit with a larger swg) was 521150. I bought it for $1799 from sunplay and the screenlogic w/ wireless kit for $369 and free shipping for a grand total of $2144 (not sure why my receipt's grand total is lower than the subtotal maybe there was a discount offered on the order page). I bought this end of last October when I was closing on my home and it was the least expensive place I could find...and cheaper than buying multiple things separately.
Thanks for that. I'm asking him about it.
Yea mine ended up coming out to 44' x 18' but the spa takes up some of that length. They are quoting two of the pool lights - probably should have put the quantity in there.
Thanks, I'll check into that one too!
Ok, just heard back. They are using the 520545 that Jim recommended. The pool is 16-17k gallons. Should the IC40 be fine?
- Oct 18, 2009
- 3,637
- Pool Size
- 6000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Hayward Aqua Rite (T-15)
IMHO if you can swing the few extra dollars I would get the IC60 however the IC 40 would be fine. The IC40 would just have to work a little harder. Hope this helps
I think the ic40 is rated up to 40000 gallons and I read here on the forum that people recommend getting a swg at least double the size of your pool. So based on that "rule" you should still be fine with the ic40. Going with the ic60 means that it will have to run even less hours compared to the ic40.
Nectarologist
Well-known member
- Apr 3, 2015
- 642
- Pool Size
- 21000
- Surface
- Vinyl
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- CircuPool RJ-45 Plus
Mike, also keep in mind with the larger swcg cell you have future costs in that the replacement cell IC60 is about $130 more than the IC40. It's 50% larger but does it last 50% longer? I have no idea. If so, probably something to consider since the replacement cells are a lot of money.
IMHO if you can swing the few extra dollars I would get the IC60 however the IC 40 would be fine. The IC40 would just have to work a little harder. Hope this helps
All good points. I'll discuss it with my PB and make a decision but I think I'll just go with the IC40. Worst case, I can just buy the IC60 if/when it's replacement time?