Pentair Easy Touch 4 - Troubleshoot No Power

[german129]

I came home from a 5 day vacation to find my Easy Touch 4 no longer has power. The screen is off and nothing will run and the pool is starting to turn green. Before I left the 40 amp breaker at the house tripped two days in a row so it was probably a sign of something wrong. Now, that breaker (40 amp) is not tripped, and neither is the 15 amp breaker for the easy touch 4 panel located in the pentair panel box.

Here is what I have done so far...I have turned both off and on but no change. I tried using a multimeter to test the voltage at the Easy Touch 4's 15 amp breaker and it was reading 5v. I thought this meant the breaker was bad so I replaced it. The voltage then read 107 (still low but better, a concern?). Then I tested the voltage at the panel and the 12v, 18v, and 24v measured as expected. I then plugged the panel back in and the panel still did not turn on. I re-measured the voltage at the breaker and it was back down to 5v. I unplugged the hot wire from the breaker and it's back to reading 107v. I then unplugged the board but plugged the transformer back into the breaker and it was still reading 5v for some reason. I am not sure how to approach troubleshooting this so if anyone can guide me in a step by step that would be amazing.

I have attached a picture of the wiring in case that helps.

 

[TinFoilHat]

Do you run 220v and 115v to the pool panel? You might have lost a leg of the 220 due to a short in the power run to that panel. That's how I found my shorted 220v. My 115 circuit worked fine but the 220 only measured at 120 and the pump wouldn't run. I ask all of this because you have a 40A breaker. Is that breaker a double pole breaker? You also measured 107v which is 1/2 of 220v which is another clue to an open leg.

 

[Jimrahbe]

129,

The very first thing to do is see if your EasyTouch is getting 240 Volts AC.

Check right where the 240 volts connects to the load center..

Test only between L1 and L2 (Red and Black wires) and you should get 240 VAC.. Do NOT test L1 to ground and then L2 to ground, as that can give you a false reading..

Run that test, and tell us what you get..

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[german129]

Do you run 220v and 115v to the pool panel? You might have lost a leg of the 220 due to a short in the power run to that panel. That's how I found my shorted 220v. My 115 circuit worked fine but the 220 only measured at 120 and the pump wouldn't run. I ask all of this because you have a 40A breaker. Is that breaker a double pole breaker? You also measured 107v which is 1/2 of 220v which is another clue to an open leg.

I should have been more clear. I believe it’s a double 40 amp breaker so 220 v. I’ve attached a picture of what I think the breaker is but I’m not home to take a real picture. How would I test if I lost a leg? One part of the multimeter on the hot wire in and one on the white and test each separately?

 

[german129]

129,

The very first thing to do is see if your EasyTouch is getting 240 Volts AC.

Check right where the 240 volts connects to the load center..

Test only between L1 and L2 (Red and Black wires) and you should get 240 VAC.. Do NOT test L1 to ground and then L2 to ground, as that can give you a false reading..

Run that test, and tell us what you get..

Thanks,

Jim

Just to be clear, I’d place the multimeter probes at the two red circles in the picture? At 220v I don’t want to make any mistakes.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Just to be clear, I’d place the multimeter probes at the two red circles in the picture?

Yes.. Test between the two red circles. It should read 240 Volts AC.. But... If you have lost a leg (either L1 or L2) it will read zero...

The reason you can't test between the red circles and ground is because they will both read 120 volts.. Making you 'think' there is 240 between them, but that would be wrong!!!

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[german129]

Yes.. Test between the two red circles. It should read 240 Volts AC.. But... If you have lost a leg (either L1 or L2) it will read zero...

The reason you can't test between the red circles and ground is because they will both read 120 volts.. Making you 'think' there is 240 between them, but that would be wrong!!!

Thanks,

Jim R.

Measuring between Red and Black it reads 220v. Black and White reads 117v and Red and White reads 107v.

 

[Jimrahbe]

129,

Sounds like the Red wire has some resistance between the EasyTouch and you house electrical panel.

I would suspect that the Breaker feeding the EasyTouch is bad..

You can run the same test at the output side of the breaker.. Between the two outputs of the breaker..

I assume the red and black wires go directly back to the breaker panel and not to some junction box... Unlikely that the wire would be bad, so that leaves the breaker's contacts.

This may not be causing your EasyTouch issue, but needs to be fixed just to eliminate it as a suspect..

Thanks

Jim R.

 

[german129]

129,

Sounds like the Red wire has some resistance between the EasyTouch and you house electrical panel.

I would suspect that the Breaker feeding the EasyTouch is bad..

You can run the same test at the output side of the breaker.. Between the two outputs of the breaker..

I assume the red and black wires go directly back to the breaker panel and not to some junction box... Unlikely that the wire would be bad, so that leaves the breaker's contacts.

This may not be causing your EasyTouch issue, but needs to be fixed just to eliminate it as a suspect..

Thanks

Jim R.

First, thank you for all quick feedback. I really appreciate it.

The red and black wires do go directly to the house breaker panel. I tested the output of that breaker 228v. This is consistent with the Pentair side now as I retested it at 228v. The red wire is testing at 110v on both sides and the black at 118 on both sides. Since this is a double breaker with two 40 amp for the pool and two 30 amp for my dryer I tested the 30 amp portion too. It was reading at 335v. So the breaker probably needs to be replaced? Not sure what's an allowable variance.

Another development. I didnt realize the top breaker in pentair breaker panel (in the previous image provided) was still on. This breaker is a double pole 20 amp and seems to power both the heater and my pump. After turning this breaker off seemed to increase the voltage from 220v to 228v on the input power for the pentair breaker. Additionally, I decided to turn on the breaker to the Easy Touch 4 display and the voltage was at 110v (it must be on the red pole) and the Easy Touch turned on. Is the pump potentially causing this? The breaker that runs the pump seems to be a gfci so I don't know if there is a special way I need to test it?

 

[Jimrahbe]

129,

Well you can't make it any better than what is coming into your house.. On your main panel test the feed from your meter. L1 to ground and L2 to ground.. If they are both the same, and the output of the breaker has one lower than the other, then the breaker is bad.

Voltage does not just 'go away' it has go somewhere.. If the contacts in the breaker are bad, this will cause a voltage drop between the input to the breaker and the output of the breaker... The pump should not have any effect on the output voltage of the breaker.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[BMerrill]

I may be wrong, but in the first post, the photo shows the breakers to the controller are OFF.

 

[german129]

129,

Well you can't make it any better than what is coming into your house.. On your main panel test the feed from your meter. L1 to ground and L2 to ground.. If they are both the same, and the output of the breaker has one lower than the other, then the breaker is bad.

Voltage does not just 'go away' it has go somewhere.. If the contacts in the breaker are bad, this will cause a voltage drop between the input to the breaker and the output of the breaker... The pump should not have any effect on the output voltage of the breaker.

Thanks,

Jim R.

2 updates:

1: After getting the Easy Touch to turn on last night I turned off the pump breaker and turned it back on. Now I have the Easy Touch and the pump working so hopefully it stays that way but somewhat concerned I didnt find the cause.

2: Looking at the breaker in my house panel it didnt seem like it was seated properly. I tried to reseat it and now the voltage is measuring 117v on both lines. It still doesn't look like it's sitting as well as the other breakers though so I wonder if the guy who installed it didnt use a breaker that was fully compatible with my electric panel. I might be replacing it...

I may be wrong, but in the first post, the photo shows the breakers to the controller are OFF.

Yes, I had turned them off but I made sure to turn them on when testing voltage.

 

[TinFoilHat]

Replacement breakers are commonly not the same as what has been in the panel for years so if it sits evenly a bit taller, or maybe even shorter, than the original breakers it's probably okay but it might not have been fully seated as you said.

 

[german129]

Replacement breakers are commonly not the same as what has been in the panel for years so if it sits evenly a bit taller, or maybe even shorter, than the original breakers it's probably okay but it might not have been fully seated as you said.

After working for multiple days, it finally died on me again. This time I remove the entire breaker to inspect it and discovered that it almost caught fire. I was right and the breaker was not compatible with my SQD panel. Now I am probably going to get an electrician out to inspect everything because one of the prongs on my panel seems to be damaged from the heat.

It’s crazy to me that the Pool installer modified this breaker in order to get it to fit and the city inspector didn’t even catch it.