Pentair Automation Install - DIY vs PRO - Quality/Warranty Concerns?

[DesertSloth]

Hey guys-
I want to put in Pentair automation. I'm pretty handy and feel I can easily do the install (SWCG, Intellitouch, etc). However- I'm seeing quite a few reviews on the components going bad after a few months, a year, etc. If I purchased from a pool store/pool builder, that warranty period is extended and could possibly cover those issues... but dang- that is EXPENSIVE for them to do it! Basically, I'm 'buying' a longer warranty by having them do the install.

My question is- Is that worth it?

Honestly, it's not in my budget to have someone else do the work- so the entire thing would have to wait. However, when I see lots of reviews of a SW Cell going out within a few months and people not being able to return it- that's VERY concerning to me.

I'd love to hear your thoughts on this...

 

[ajw22]

I have not seen many, if any, posts about Pentair ICXX SWGs failing after a few months. If properly installed they are pretty robust. The weak spot in them is the flow switch/temperature sensor which is a $50 simple fix.

When the cell does need to be replaced it is more expensive then others due to the integrated electronics. That can be viewed as a pro or con.

 

[Jimrahbe]

DS,

Warranties are only good if you need them.. Most of the time, you don't, but it is up to you to decide how much risk you are willing to take.. My take is somewhat clouded by the fact that I ran several non-pool related repair centers.. The failure rate at these different companies were all about the same 1 or 2%. In general, the company does not provide a warranty because they think that their products are going to fail, the warranty is more of a sales device. Companies provide longer warranties to entice you to buy from them..

My experience has been that once the product has passed the infantile failure period, about 60 days or so, they are unlikely to fail until long after any warranty period has expired..

From the pool equipment point of view, it costs about double to buy the equipment from a pool builder and have them install it. To me that makes a self install a pretty sure bet.

I installed two complete EasyTouch systems, including the IntelliFlo pumps and the IC40 SWCGs.. I did this about 6 or 7 years ago.. In that time, I have had one flow switch fail.. The Systems run 24/7 and have worked flawlessly... These systems are at rent house and while we were refurbishing the houses, my wife decides she wanted a pool at our house.

It made sense on a new build, to just let the pool builder install everything. At my house I have been through three flow switches, two of which were replaced under warranty. The biggie is that my neighbor took a direct lightning strike and I got what was left over.. It took out a bunch of stuff in the house as well as the main board in my EasyTouch and my ScreenLogic Protocol Adapter.. Pentair came out and replaced the main board and the adapter under warranty.. That would have cost me about $1,000.. About what it cost me for warranty through the pool builder on just those two items.

(I forgot.. about a month later they came back and replaced the IC40, with I assume had also been hurt by the lightning, but did not fail right away.. )

I guess the point is.. you rolls the dice and takes your chances..

If I ever need to buy another Pentair product, the warranty period will not play into my buying decision.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[DesertSloth]

This is really good info. Have you guys went on amazon/other large retailers and read the reviews? Kinda scary... of course- those are usually the worst cases, but it DOES happen. Kinda worries me a little- but you guys bring up good points. Thank you

 

[Jimrahbe]

DS,

Keep in mind, especially with SWCGs, that 80% of the buyers have no clue how a SWCG works.. My guess is that 75% of reported failures are nothing but misunderstanding of what a SWCG does and how it does it..

Jim R.

 

[ajw22]

This is really good info. Have you guys went on amazon/other large retailers and read the reviews? Kinda scary... of course- those are usually the worst cases, but it DOES happen. Kinda worries me a little- but you guys bring up good points. Thank you

So I was curious and looked at the Amazon revews for the IC60. 20% of 960 reviews are 1 star. I would not focus on the 20% number as most happy users don’t bother to write a review.

Reading the 1 star reviews many of them complain of cells lasting 2 to 4 years. No one says what their pool volume is or what % runtime they used. Run the cell at close to 100% output and that is about how long it will last. That is why we recommend to oversize the cell by 2X or more. If folks don’t know how to set the % runtime, pump runtime, and manage CYA level, they can use up the cell rapidly.

Many of the 1 star reviews came about because of Pentairs poor customer support. That is an issue and if you feel you want better manufacturer support maybe you should look elsewhere.

With the right product expectations and TFP methods Pentair products seem to wotk well for this community.

 

[DesertSloth]

Amazon Reviews

I was looking at this listing for one (there's many others out there on other sites too). The TOP listings are pretty horrible, IMO. Check out the images, too. Yes, those might be the minority, but- it DOES happen, and without recourse from the manufacturer to back it up/correct it. That's pretty concerning. I'd be ok if the warranty/factory stood behind it and made it right- but that's not the case repeated over and over by multiple customers now.

Generally, anything less than 4.5 stars on amazon with a high amount of reviews just isn't good. This has 3.6 stars.

A quick glance at most of Pentair's other products yields similar results (less than 4.5 stars, similary product issues, lack of support/fix from the factory, etc).

Again- I'm all for Pentair, I've intentionally replaced my working system with their brand of pump/de filter as I believe GENERALLY they do put out a good product. I'm just seeing some large concerns as I'm about to expand out to a full automation system...

 

[Jimrahbe]

DS,

No manufacturer makes a cell that will turn a green pool clear. Nor will a cell produce more chlorine than is being eaten by the algae in the pool. Just because the water is clear does not mean some algae is not present.

You actually have to run the pump long enough to generate the amount of chlorine you need.

If you live where it is sunny and hot in the summer, and have your CYA at near zero, no cell will be able to generate the amount of chlorine you will need.

Unlike a can opener that you just plug in, a salt cell takes some intelligence to operate... I am sorry to say that the vast amount of pool owners have no idea how their pools work in general and how salt cells work in particular..

I just took a quick look at the bad reviews and still stick to my opinion that most failures have nothing to do with the product, and all to do with how it was used.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[DesertSloth]

I'm not talking about people claiming it doesn't work... I'm talking about the cell itself leaking/flooding water out, burning up to a crisp, etc. I'm with you and agree that you need to know how to use it properly- but- I'm talking about the manufacturer's defects that are serious problems... Did you look at the pictures?

 

[Jimrahbe]

DS,

I did not look at any pictures..

You still only see one side of the story.. If a manufacturer ships 10 units and 5 are bad that is pretty serious issue... If they ship 10,000 units and one or two fail, no one likes it but stuff happens..

I am not trying to talk you into buying a Pentair system... if you have concerns, don't buy one, or buy through a pool builder, or have it installed so that you can get the warranty... Whatever works for you works just fine for me..

Jim R.

 

[ajw22]

Amazon Reviews

I was looking at this listing for one (there's many others out there on other sites too). The TOP listings are pretty horrible, IMO. Check out the images, too. Yes, those might be the minority, but- it DOES happen, and without recourse from the manufacturer to back it up/correct it. That's pretty concerning. I'd be ok if the warranty/factory stood behind it and made it right- but that's not the case repeated over and over by multiple customers now.

Generally, anything less than 4.5 stars on amazon with a high amount of reviews just isn't good. This has 3.6 stars.

A quick glance at most of Pentair's other products yields similar results (less than 4.5 stars, similary product issues, lack of support/fix from the factory, etc).

Again- I'm all for Pentair, I've intentionally replaced my working system with their brand of pump/de filter as I believe GENERALLY they do put out a good product. I'm just seeing some large concerns as I'm about to expand out to a full automation system...

I think most of these pics if investigated would turn out to be improper installation or water chemistry. Ths one is obvious. Failure to winterize the pool and cell.

As I said before, we don’t see those types of pics and problems here. And we would if there are systemic quality issues.

 

[MyAZPool]

So I was curious and looked at the Amazon revews for the IC60. 20% of 960 reviews are 1 star. I would not focus on the 20% number as most happy users don’t bother to write a review.

Reading the 1 star reviews many of them complain of cells lasting 2 to 4 years. No one says what their pool volume is or what % runtime they used. Run the cell at close to 100% output and that is about how long it will last. That is why we recommend to oversize the cell by 2X or more. If folks don’t know how to set the % runtime, pump runtime, and manage CYA level, they can use up the cell rapidly.

Many of the 1 star reviews came about because of Pentairs poor customer support. That is an issue and if you feel you want better manufacturer support maybe you should look elsewhere.

With the right product expectations and TFP methods Pentair products seem to wotk well for this community.

Allen,
Did you or someone you know, have a bad experience with Pentair's Technical Support team lately? Just curious, as I have not experienced that as of yet.
r.

 

[ajw22]

Allen,
Did you or someone you know, have a bad experience with Pentair's Technical Support team lately? Just curious, as I have not experienced that as of yet.
r.

Happy to say all my Pentair equipment has not had problems. I also have a good relationship with a good pool company who is a Pentair dealer.

I get the sense that retail customers experiences with Pentair warranty support nay be different then with their Technical Support.

 

[jeffnhispool]

I had warranty concerns when I recently bought my superflow VS, not t being sure at that time about the install. I stepped up for a 3yr square trade warranty for $30 then found out my credit card also provided a 2 yr warranty. If Pentair gives me a hard time at least I have a plan B AND a plan C.

 

[MyAZPool]

Happy to say all my Pentair equipment has not had problems. I also have a good relationship with a good pool company who is a Pentair dealer.
I get the sense that retail customers experiences with Pentair warranty support nay be different then with their Technical Support.

Allen, I got ya and agree. I had two IntelliValves that started acting up shortly after installation. I notified Tech Support and they created a warranty ticket. It went like " clockwork" and within a couple of days, a company came out and promptly replaced them. No problems since. I was very happy with the way it went.

I'm sure there are a few folks who have experienced less than satisfactory results from their dealings with Pentair Technical support or Warranty Support. But in my experiences with them (tech support) up to this point, they have been nothing short of phenomenal. Very helpful, professional and responsive regarding some of the minor "bugs" that I have experienced with the new IntelliCenter.

Also, just from my perspective, it has been my experience that, how one deals with any type of representative over the phone, tends to determine the level of assistance that one might receive. Right or wrong, I do believe that is true. Maybe not always the case, but for the most part, yes.
Hey, thanks a lot Allen and take care.
r.

 

[Jimrahbe]

r,

As I have said, I used to run several warranty repair centers... As you suggested you can always get more with a little honey...

When the caller said something like "What can you do for me?" I always bent over backwards to get the job done. When they said something like "I demand that you do this or that", I always went strictly by the letter of the rules. I have given away many thousands of dollars in repairs at no charge, just because of the attitude of the person on the other end of the phone or e-mail..

Jim R.

 

[MyAZPool]

r,

As I have said, I used to run several warranty repair centers... As you suggested you can always get more with a little honey...

When the caller said something like "What can you do for me?" I always bent over backwards to get the job done. When they said something like "I demand that you do this or that", I always went strictly by the letter of the rules. I have given away many thousands of dollars in repairs at no charge, just because of the attitude of the person on the other end of the phone or e-mail..

Jim R.

Jim,
Exactly! Being on the "user" side of the phone, that's certainly how I approach it. I just place myself in the representatives shoes and "treat them accordingly". I rarely have a problem with them and have made a few friends in the process.
Your point is very well said!
Take care...
r.