One bad Pentair VS pump spoiling the whole bunch

[FortWorthFlow]

Greetings, all! First time poster. This forum has been a wealth of information. Thank you all for contributing. We recently purchased a house with an 18,000 gallon pool with a Pentair IC40 SWG and Intellichem system - though the Intellichem controls were already bypassed on the Easy Touch! Made our lives easier. I feel confident in deciding to take on pool care ourselves and are very happy with our water chemistry. We're even respecting the FC/CYA relationship and aren't too alarmed with relatively high CH (650PPM) as our current CSI is .15 or so.



Our issue:



There are three Pentair VS pumps. One is of course the main filter pump. One drives an IFC. The last drives some waterfalls. In service mode, the waterfall pump's control pad is dark and blank so I gather from this forum that it is connected to the load side of the relay on the load center (even though it is a VS pump) as the main pump and IFC pump are monopolizing the Intelliflo com capability. When the waterfall pump is switched on from Screen Logic, it'll run fine for a minute or so. Water flows from the waterfalls. Then, all of the pumps stop running (if they were running concurrently) and after a 30 second pause or so, the pumps fire back up and this cycle repeats. Sometimes the pumps will run for longer intervals before stopping but no more than a couple of minutes. When the water fall pump is toggled off, the other pumps start to behave normally again with no power cycles. If the waterfall pump is switched on without the other pumps active, it'll run longer but still shuts off after five minutes or so. Interestingly though, it doesn't power cycle with the other pumps de-energized. It'll stay off until its control is togged off and on. No breakers ever throw.





My first instinct is to swap the Siemens double pole breaker that the IFC pump is connected to and see if the water fall pump runs steadily fed from it. Are there any other troubleshooting ideas? Thanks, all!

 

[Jimrahbe]

Flo,

The EasyTouch can only control two VS pumps using the RS-485 com port.. The other pump will have to be controlled by just turning it on and off with an Aux relay and having any programming (Speeds) inside the pump's control head.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[FortWorthFlow]

Jim,

I see you’re in Bedford and fly/ have flown airplanes. I do that for the little hometown airline here in Dee Effin’ Dubya.

Anyhow, I am able to control the third pump. It’s connected to one of the auxiliary relays. It cycles on and off, however, and will take the other pumps out of commission when it shuts off unexpectedly. After a pause, all the pumps come back on, only to repeat the cycle. Without that pump toggled on, the other two pumps behave themselves.

Relay? Breaker? Motor going bad?

 

[Jimrahbe]

Flo,

I was an Radar Tech in the AF. See "Meet Jim Rahbe" in my signature..

On the surface, the 3rd IntelliFlo being turned on and off by an Aux relay should have no effect on the other two IntelliFlo pumps. I assume the 3rd pump is NOT connected to the RS-485 com port.

I would suspect a programming issue..

Do you have ScreenLogic?

Show me your schedules..

Makes sure that none of your IntelliFlo pumps have the SVRS option. This is not something that can be turned on or off.. The pump comes with SVRS or not. Look at the labels on the wet end of the pump.

You can also show us several pics of your equipment pad and maybe one of us can spot something..

Edit.. Do you know where the pumps are getting their input water? You never want two pumps sucking from the same source..

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[FortWorthFlow]

Jim,

Thank you for your service.

All three of these pumps (filter, waterfall, IFC) are Pentair Intelliflo VS + SVRS pumps.

On the side of the pump there is a small cable and connector running to the Smart Touch panel on all of these. I assume that is the RS-485 connection. That is in addition to the liquidtite conduit with the 240V supply toward the back of the pumps. Please see photos of pad, as well as screen grabs of schedule from ScreenLogic. This waterfall pump is toggled on in SL with the "Water Feature" item under Features, or alternatively with the membrane button on the panel itself. I just tried again and I am getting the same behavior. The main pump runs nominally according to the schedule. I toggle the "Water Feature" on via SL. That pump starts. Water flows from the laminar falls. Then, both pumps stop. I get a "communication error" under system alerts. in SL. After 30 seconds or so, both pumps come back to life, only for the cycle to repeat. The on/off cycle ceases when I deselect the water feature. This occurs even if the main filter pump is off.

 

[Rocket J Squirrel]

Sorry to hear your pumps are SVRS. Are they new enough that you could exchange them for non SVRS pumps? Those pumps shut off when they "think" they sense an obstruction like a little girl's hair sucking into the plumbing. But they're not well tuned and tend to shut off unnecessarily. Replace them if you can.

 

[reggiehammond]

All three of these pumps (filter, waterfall, IFC) are Pentair Intelliflo VS + SVRS pumps.

@Jimrahbe heart just sank.

 

[FortWorthFlow]

Uh oh...

So, all three appear to be spliced into the com port. If one pump shuts off due to a sensed obstruction on the suction side, would that trigger the other pumps to shut off as well? They appear to be of 2015 vintage so I think we're stuck with what we have...

 

[FortWorthFlow]

As an experiment I disconnected the RS-485 connector from the pump enabling the keypad. I dialed up the speed to 1,500 from 1,100 RPM… and now it isn’t shutting off! I can toggle the pump via SL still so that begs the question… can I just leave this particular com port disconnected? I suspect that if SVRS is triggered it won’t bring my filter pump down with it….

 

[Jimrahbe]

Flo,

Let's start with unplugging the 3rd IntelliFlo (waterfall) and see of that helps. (I see you just did that..)

One IntelliFlo going into surge protection mode should not shut off the other pumps... But, if all three get there water from the same source, then a surge might make them all shut off.

The IntelliFlo is the Gold standard of pool pumps.. Except when they has the SVRS option, which makes them the Brown standard if you catch my drift.. Sigh!! I have one and that is why I know...

I'd cover the open connectors and run it with the 3rd pump disconnected from the RS-485 com port and then tell us how things are going..

The problem most likely happens when the 3rd pump shuts off.. This causes a large surge of water, that triggers the SVRS,,

Please let us know if the problem comes back and we'll see what else we can do.

Thank you for your service.

Flo,

When someone says that to me I always reply... "It was much more fun than service.." And that is the truth!!

Thanks,

Jim R.