Newbie needs SLAMing advice, and how much sodium hypochlorite in Clorox Bleach?

[SunnyOptimism]

Why, thank you SunnyOptimism (love that name!)!! I sure would love to invite all of you folks on the Pool Forum to visit my backyard to help me figure this out, LOL!! I wish that it was that easy! I am so, so thankful that this forum exists so that I am not having to struggle to figure this out all on my own and am grateful for the wonderful support, but it is starting to get frustrating for me because I am following all the rules but the progress has seemed to have hit a plateau.

Yup, TFP is great. I was so fed up with pool store advice and when my first full season hit with my new pool, I knew I needed expert help. TFP has saved me from having to beg for my pool builder's help (he's a great guy just super busy) or going it alone.

I can see your frustration and I know it's a long road but it will be worth it in the end. I only had minor pool water clarity issue which was basically an algae bloom just waiting to explode. Even though I caught it BEFORE I ever saw any green gunk, it still took a solid 3 day SLAM and draining about 6000 gallons of water before my water chemistry got back to correct balance. My pool was out of commission for almost three weeks while I worked on it every day. So I can only imagine what full blown green monster must feel like.

Also, from you pictures and your post with kimkats, it looks like you have some seriously bad plumbing issues. I have to say I am horrified by all those flexible hoses and metal hose clamps. Your battling this problem on multiple fronts and doing it with a great deal more grace, humility, humor and patience than I would think possible for any human being!!

Hang in there.


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[kimkats]

Oh I SO knew what you meant! LOL

Jandy valve----Here is a link I found for your jandy I think:

http://www.poolplaza.com/pool-school/plumbing_valves_jandy_2port_operation.shtml

IF it were me.............I would put in a black flippy valve between the pump and wall so you can close all of them Jandy, black flippy valve already there and the new one) and not lose any water or make a mess when you clean out your basket. You are going to have to put in one some where between the wall and sand filter to stop the flow of water out of the pool while you work on the filter. This will make your pool life easier in the long run.

The union fitting only needs to be one on the black pipe going into the filter if am looking at everything right. I THINK all of the other hoses have clamps on them and they are made of rubber so.......you should be able to unscrew the clamps and pull the hoses off of the filter. THEN you should be able to take the top off of the filter

It takes quite a bit of water/time to clean it good. You will have to make sure that you do not move the "guts" of the filter while you push the hose down into the sand to stir it up good. (Ask me know I know! I had to take all of my sand out to reset the guts when I cleaned last summer

AND if you do not take out the sand and guts you are not going to be able to check to make sure the guts are clean. It is up to you just have far do you want to go with it.

I think I found a pdf for a filter close to yours. It looks like you are on the right track with being able to just undo the two screws on what they call the flange clamp and take the top off once you undo all of the hoses.

http://www.hollyhillpools.com/pdf-sand-manuals/210t1580.pdf

Kim

 

[kimkats]

I have thought of a way you could not make as much a mess..........in some way make a water chute??? Plastic like you would put on the floor to protect a floor from painting. Put 2x4 boards on either side to route the water outside. I am not sure how to make the water coming out of the filter go onto the plastic-maybe make a slit into the plastic and wrap it around the filter???

Just throwing ideas out there. (I do this to my poor husband all of the time. He just rolls his eyes at me and laughs at most of my ideas but some of they work LOL)

Kim

 

[TomBorg]

Before trying a deep clean....

With just a skimmer (is there a floor drain? didn't look like it), plus your return jet being placed right next to the skimmer, it could be that you simply don't have enough circulation to clear gunk out of the pool. Things I would do:

Adjust the eyeball in the return jet, so it is directing water away from the skimmer as much as possible, and slightly downward. So there will be a circular motion to the water in the pool, and the water coming from the return jet has to go all the way around the pool at least once before being pulled into the skimmer.

Do you have a full-size vacuum hose that plugs into your skimmer? If so, hook the hose up, and leave the other end sitting at the bottom of the pool. (Perhaps attached to a vacuum head, but flipped over to maximize water flow.) A skimmer is great at collecting surface debris, not so great at collecting everything else.

Best of luck!

 

[kimkats]

ohhhhhhhhh I like that idea as well!

Kim

 

[Darlene13]

Also, from you pictures and your post with kimkats, it looks like you have some seriously bad plumbing issues. I have to say I am horrified by all those flexible hoses and metal hose clamps.

Is it really that bad? Now THAT'S something that I didn't want to hear!

I claim ignorance. I was not involved with the installation. So what do you suggest? In for a penny, in for a pound. If I'm trying to resolve these issues, I may as well deal with everything at once. I'm all ears, thanks!

 

[SunnyOptimism]

Is it really that bad? Now THAT'S something that I didn't want to hear!

I claim ignorance. I was not involved with the installation. So what do you suggest? In for a penny, in for a pound. If I'm trying to resolve these issues, I may as well deal with everything at once. I'm all ears, thanks!

Wow. I wish had good advice for you on that front. All I know is that most quality pool installations I've seen (and I'm newbie here too) use all straight walled, schedule 40 (SCH40) PVC piping with proper couplings and fittings. It scares me that whoever did that plumbing job ran the PVC straight into the filter joints with no quick release couplings making it impossible to remove the filter without needing to resort to a hacksaw! Likewise, the flexible tubing being held in place by screw clamps is a recipe for both water leaks on the high pressure side and air leaks on the suction side.

It's really a job for a professional plumber to fix but that's going to cost $$$$. What you need is a friend willing to work for pizza and beer and handy with PVC

I'd love the challenge but doing that kind work is not everyone's cup of tea...


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[Darlene13]

Oh I SO knew what you meant! LOL

Jandy valve----Here is a link I found for your jandy I think:

http://www.poolplaza.com/pool-school/plumbing_valves_jandy_2port_operation.shtml

I think I found a pdf for a filter close to yours. It looks like you are on the right track with being able to just undo the two screws on what they call the flange clamp and take the top off once you undo all of the hoses.

http://www.hollyhillpools.com/pdf-sand-manuals/210t1580.pdf

Kim, you are gold! Thank you!! I will print these out and review them.

IF it were me.............I would put in a black flippy valve between the pump and wall so you can close all of them Jandy, black flippy valve already there and the new one) and not lose any water or make a mess when you clean out your basket. You are going to have to put in one some where between the wall and sand filter to stop the flow of water out of the pool while you work on the filter. This will make your pool life easier in the long run.

Wouldn't it be easier to do all this when I drain the pool down in September? I realize that I seem to have a filtration issue now, but my concern is that I'm not sure that I even have a way now to block/stop the flow of water from the pump to the Sand Filter. I definitely don't have a way to block it from the skimmer to the pump, and I don't see that it's possible now to remove that pipe to put another white piece of pipe with the black flippy thingy unless I have the pool drained down.

Kim, you've been wonderful, but can you do me another favour? You said that you had your husband put a union fitting on your system. Would you mind posting a photo of that? I'm a visual kind of gal! Thanks!!

 

[Darlene13]

I have thought of a way you could not make as much a mess..........in some way make a water chute??? Plastic like you would put on the floor to protect a floor from painting. Put 2x4 boards on either side to route the water outside. I am not sure how to make the water coming out of the filter go onto the plastic-maybe make a slit into the plastic and wrap it around the filter???

That sounds like it would work, Kim! I'll have to make a type of channel to run it straight out of the garage instead of seeping into the stuff that's stored in there. Good idea!

 

[Darlene13]

Adjust the eyeball in the return jet, so it is directing water away from the skimmer as much as possible, and slightly downward. So there will be a circular motion to the water in the pool, and the water coming from the return jet has to go all the way around the pool at least once before being pulled into the skimmer.

Hi, TomBorg! There is no eyeball in the return jet. It's not adjustable I know exactly what you mean, though. Unfortunately, that is not the type of jet that came with the pool!

Do you have a full-size vacuum hose that plugs into your skimmer? If so, hook the hose up, and leave the other end sitting at the bottom of the pool. (Perhaps attached to a vacuum head, but flipped over to maximize water flow.) A skimmer is great at collecting surface debris, not so great at collecting everything else.

I do, but I've always been unimpressed with the suction of the vacuum through the skimmer. So, is that another sign of a filtration issue? I have a Manual Catfish Pool Blaster that picks up more than the one through the skimmer!

Thanks for your ideas, TomBorg!

 

[Darlene13]

It scares me that whoever did that plumbing job ran the PVC straight into the filter joints with no quick release couplings making it impossible to remove the filter without needing to resort to a hacksaw!

I agree that it was likely done incorrectly! But how do I fix it? Maybe you can send me pics of what it should look like!

Likewise, the flexible tubing being held in place by screw clamps is a recipe for both water leaks on the high pressure side and air leaks on the suction side.

Are you referring to the white flexible hoses at the pool running from the skimmer and the return jet? Yeah, we've sprung a couple of leaks there already on the hose for the return jet. My dad came out and cut off the split part of the white hose and reattached it with caulking. He fixed it as best as he could, but he's no plumber! He just stopped it from leaking, but he doesn't have the knowledge to start replacing stuff.

It's really a job for a professional plumber to fix but that's going to cost $$$$. What you need is a friend willing to work for pizza and beer and handy with PVC

And $$$ I don't have. Unfortunately, I don't know any plumbers who will work for free!

I'd love the challenge but doing that kind work is not everyone's cup of tea...

I've love to be able to fix these issues. If someone on this forum knows how to do it and would be willing to provide detailed instructions for every step of the way, I would be willing to tackle it and might be able to get a handy person (but he's not a plumber!) to help me. But I need to know how and where to start!

 

[SunnyOptimism]

The black tubing that runs underground from your pump house to the pool, is it flexible tubing also??

As well, looking over your pictures, the clear tubing that has mesh embedded in it, that's all the stuff I'm talking about. It's all gotta go. Anywhere you see that stuff, it ought to be replaced with SCH40 PVC tubing. You should have rigid PVC all the way up to the skimmer and returns. No flexible junk. PThat means cutting out all that flexible stuff and measuring and cutting PVC that replaces it. Unions, elbows, joints, tees etc are all sealed using PVC "glue" (blue epoxy in a metal can).

It's a job best left for the spring time or fall when no one uses the pool. Considering you live in Canada, that means a really short window of opportunity to get stuff done before cold weather makes working outside impossible.


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[kimkats]

I will post a pic of my pool filter set up when I get home and it is sunny.

I think it would be okay to wait to work on your set up. Your stuff has worked this long so............what is a couple of months?

That will give us time to work out what you are going to do in the long run.

Just how far is the pool from the equipment?

I am really beginning to wonder if that is part of the problem. Lots to think about.

How is your water looking?

Kim

 

[JFB]

Darlene... As I sit here at 5:45 with my 1.5 yr old playing in the background... this is what I make of your plumbing. Please tell me if this sounds correct...

 

[SunnyOptimism]

I will post a pic of my pool filter set up when I get home and it is sunny.

I think it would be okay to wait to work on your set up. Your stuff has worked this long so............what is a couple of months?

That will give us time to work out what you are going to do in the long run.

Just how far is the pool from the equipment?

I am really beginning to wonder if that is part of the problem. Lots to think about.

How is your water looking?

Kim

Agreed!

Redoing plumbing is a job best left for a later time when the pool is not in use and you can focus on doing the job right.

Job #1 right now is to get that pool sparkling crystal clear !


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[Darlene13]

The black tubing that runs underground from your pump house to the pool, is it flexible tubing also??

Hi, SunnyOptimism! That black tubing from the white flexible hose at the pool that goes into the ground is rigid. It's not flexible. To be honest, I haven't a clue whether it's the same black tubing or actual PVC pipes that run underground because I didn't supervise the job

As well, looking over your pictures, the clear tubing that has mesh embedded in it, that's all the stuff I'm talking about. It's all gotta go. Anywhere you see that stuff, it ought to be replaced with SCH40 PVC tubing. You should have rigid PVC all the way up to the skimmer and returns. No flexible junk. PThat means cutting out all that flexible stuff and measuring and cutting PVC that replaces it. Unions, elbows, joints, tees etc are all sealed using PVC "glue" (blue epoxy in a metal can).

That clear tubing with the mesh embedded into it has HAYWARD stamped on it, so it came with the pool! That's the tubing that was meant to be used with this set-up.

That long black pipe from the Pump to the Sand Filter is black PVC. Same with the Return pipe from the Sand Filter - that is black PVC as well.

It's a job best left for the spring time or fall when no one uses the pool. Considering you live in Canada, that means a really short window of opportunity to get stuff done before cold weather makes working outside impossible.

Yes, I agree. Ideally, this should all be done in the Fall before I close the pool. Well, I guess then I will have a project to work on!

 

[Darlene13]

Just how far is the pool from the equipment?

Hi, Kim! 57 feet from the garage to the skimmer. Here's a shot to give you an idea (the back of the garage is where that white downspout is, there is a little white shed behind the garage):

How is your water looking?

Pretty much the same. We're behind a cloud at the moment:

Test #37 (from last night):

SLAM: 16 ppm FC
FC: 15.5 ppm FC
CC: 1.0 ppm FC

That's the first time that my CC has budged from 0.5 since the start of the SLAM, and this is the first time that my FC fell below SLAM level since Test #17 on June 30th. Coincidence? No idea!

I SLAMed to hit Mustard Algae level (24 ppm FC).


Test #38 (from this morning):

SLAM: 16 ppm FC
FC: 23.5 ppm
CC: 0.5 ppm

So, only a 0.5 ppm FC loss overnight. But water is not clear!

I think more and more that this is a filtration issue now. I've been SLAMing now since June 21st, that's 20 days. Shoudn't it be done???

 

[Darlene13]

Darlene... As I sit here at 5:45 with my 1.5 yr old playing in the background... this is what I make of your plumbing. Please tell me if this sounds correct...

How did you attach all the labels to the photo, Kim? What program did you use? Very handy!! If I knew how to do it, I'd use it myself, LOL!

I believe that it is all correct, aside from the two SOLAR ones. To be honest, I have no idea which one is IN and which one is OUT. How can I tell?

- - - Updated - - -

Job #1 right now is to get that pool sparkling crystal clear !

But my fear is that what started as an algae problem is now a filtration issue! The water just won't go clear!!!

I haven't forgotten about DE, by the way, which I think could definitely help. I have been hunting across Canada for a source, and I think I found one. It's manufactured by ClearTech, and I'm just waiting to hear back on pricing.

 

[Butterfly]

What is the status of the deep cleaning of the sand filter?

 

[Darlene13]

What is the status of the deep cleaning of the sand filter?

Hi, Butterfly!

If you scroll up and read all the posts over the last few days, we're still trying to figure out how to get at the darn thing!! Right now, I'm not even sure that I have a way to block/stop the flow of water to the Sand Filter. If I have that, then I need to dismantle plumbing because apparently I don't have the proper connectors!!