New to testing and Balancing... need a touch of guidance

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Newton4mark

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Sep 11, 2016
76
Chandler, AZ
I wanted to first off give my hats off to those of you out there guiding us all...

I have been on the forum for a while, and asked for some help when I first took over this home with a pool... the valves were very confusing...

that has since been figured out with the help of you guys here.

the Previous owner had a pool service maintaining the pool, so I kept them on the past few months and now have decided to take over the duties after studying up and reading the various info here on the site.

the pool has been maintained up till now by the pool guy using (pucks in the skimmer) he came weekly and managed the water (pool is clear, yet does have some scale build up on the tiles in areas where the water splashes around) mostly where the water overflow is at the spa

I purchased the Taylor 2006 kit and did my first test today

below are the numbers (granted my first attempt at testing) so I am hoping I did them correctly

outside temp is around 60 degrees, water temp is in the upper 50's to low 60's

Free Chlorine - 12ppm (combined chlorine showed 0)
PH - 7.6
CYA - 110
Total alkalinity - 200
Calcium hardness - 800

my question is

are these numbers well in line?
Free Chlorine seems high
we use our Spa about 2-3 times per week

I really just want to make sure I start off the right way and undue any damage that the pool guy did by using pucks vs the BBB method, which I feel would be better long term for water balance

thanks for any input and advice
 
I am going to share a link with you:

Pool School - Recommended Levels

You will see that your CYA and CH are a little high. What is good for you is the solution to both of these are the same-drain and refill some water.

Before you do that please run all of the test EXCEPT CYA (it has to be added so will not be in your fill water) on your fill water. Let us know what you find when you do.

Your TA is a high but that is a very easy fix. We willl work on it when we get done with the others.

Kim:kim:
 
I want to know your fill water results (most important is your fill water's CH levels) before we think on draining it. You can test inside using a bright light for the tests other than CYA. I hold a white plate behind the test tube when I do the PH test. That helps me see the color difference.

I will share this link with you so you can start playing with it:

https://www.troublefreepool.com/calc.html

There is a learning curve for this. Make sure you go all the way down to the bottom to set it to use TFP's levels. Another tip is to NOT put the , in the gallons spot at the top.

Don't do anything until we go over all of your numbers.

Kim:kim:
 
There we go. I have a path for you go down now. As you can see your CH has increased over time and your CYA is high.

First some house work:

-Please put your test kit in your siggy

Once that is done go to Pool Math and plug in your pool water numbers. Make sure to NOT put the , in the gallons of the pool in Pool Math . It does not like it for some reason.

Make sure to go down to the bottom of Pool Math and set the system to TFP levels.

Now let me know what you see when you do this. I have done it but want you to play with it and I will check your numbers. (sorry that is the teacher in me LOL).

Use the link for recommended levels to set your target goals.

I will keep a look out for your "homework".

Kim:kim:
 
I will do this when I get home this afternoon
Thanks Kim

I edited my Siggy to show the Taylor K2006 test kit that I am working with
i prefer the teacher mentality (I won't learn if I don't do)
give a man a fish he eats for a day... Teach him to fish and he eats every day! or something like that :)

have a great day
 
Ok Kim

I plugged in the numbers from Yesterday's test results

Says to do the following

Add - No Bleach (since the chlorine is already 12ppm) and considered High
Add - 8.1oz of Muricatic Acid (31.45% of 20degree Baume)
Add - Baking soda - None
CH - Replace 68% of the water (with water of 0 CH) which my fill water has (300 CH) the water in phx is very hard water
CYA - Replace 64% of the water (clearly this will be done if I done drain 68%)
Suggested FC levels are - Normal - 8 -14 (which is the range I am in) , Shock - 26 and mustard Algae Shock - 59

I guess my biggest concern is the Calcium Hardness... even if I replace the water with fresh Fill water I am still over the target number... at 300 PPM for the municipal fill water

I am going to retest the water now and I will post the new numbers (see if any change)
 
ok here are retest results.. 12/1

I think I made some rookie testing mistakes on the first run

FC - 11.5
PH - 7.6
CH - 180 - (solution turned clear) I kept added drops last time thinking it would turn blue which it never really seemed to
CYA - 200
TA - 225
Saturation Index - (0.20)
 

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Also for the CYA test
I guess 200 since the level was not even high enough on the vile to measure

Pic included

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Here is a link to how I want you to redo the CYA test to get a better idea on just how high it is:

Please explain how to dilute CYA test if over 100

You NAILED the Pool Math!!! SWEET! Don't you just love it?? Makes life so easy.

For right now know you DO need to drain and refill some water. Right now we think 64% BUT depending on how high your CYA is it could be more BUT we do not like to drain the whole pool. We worry about pool popping! Not sure how much of a problem that would be in AZ but.......

I would start looking into renting or buying (Harbor Freight has a good, cheap one) a sump pump.

Once we get your water the TFP way you are going to LOVE IT! Until then you do have a little work ahead to get it purrfect.

Kim:kim:
 
So many people do not really understand the damage the pucks can do. Here is one of the things the Pool $tore or pool services will call it - "chlorine lock" so you have to drain and add new water to "break the lock". Here at TFP we know what causes it and can help you from ever having to do it again.

While you are running around town see if any of the Pool $tore carry liquid chlorine. You might have put a deposit down on the jugs but in some cases it is easier and cheaper than lugging gals of bleach home from Walmart. We will talk about that some more as we move to that part of your pool care.

I am loving teaching you this! I was where you are with my old pool. The Pool $tore did it to me. I am now paying it forward after finding TFP!

:hug:

Kim:kim:
 
Hey there Newton. I'm in the same boat, but just discovered the CYA effect with pucks and dichlor the pool service was using right before I had to close the pool here in the Midwest. They were adding tons of chorine to shock weekly and then scratchin their heads when I told the service guys that FC was at 20ppm for several days after they left and we are tryin to swim. I now know CYA was like yours prob 100 or more and so chlorine was definitely "locked" (now I know what to call it!)

Anyway, looking forward to a healthier pool next year if my CYA tank survives the winter. I obviously couldn't replace water this late in the year so we will see.

I guess there's no such thing as chlorine pucks with no CYA? I guess you can only use chlorinator feeder when CYA is lowish and lots of splashing going on or what?
 
It is a little surprising
I will get this pool right and hopefully through sharing it here, can help you as you start back up this spring

Sometimes we learn our lessons by paying stupid tax, at least thats what Dave Ramsey calls it....



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Pucks either have CYA (stabilizer) or CH (calcium hardness) to help bind the chlorine in to the solid form. The person that finds a way to make pucks without anything "harmful" will make a fortune!

You can do Reverse Osmosis that will remove CYA and CH. It is $$$ but in places with water restrictions it is an option. Not many places have it available.

I don't see it as being stupid. It is more not knowing. The pool industries are just now starting to know about and accept the CYA/FC ratio. There are many (most) that do not understand it OR chose to ignore it because it hits their bottom line $$.

You go to the pool store thinking they know what is best for your pool. You have them test your water and they tell you you need to buy this and that so your pool will be all set. You go back the next week and they test and say oh now you need that and this. Just the opposite of they said last week :shock:

The pool service comes once a week so they have to hit it so hard it is not safe to hope the FC makes it until the next week. Just think about the people who don't have their own test kit and let their kids and family swim with the FC so high :sad:

I am glad both of you found TFP. You will not believe how your water looks when I am done with it!

Sprangdog-I look forward to seeing your own thread when you go to open. If I do not see it right away make sure to PM me so I can help you out.

Newton, you are on the right track. We are close to getting everything where it should be. I can't wait to see just how high your CYA is :rolleyes: No matter how high it ends up you can go ahead and start your 64% drain and refill as we KNOW that needs to be done. The only question is how many times.

:hug:

Kim:kim:
 
Yeah, pool stores push CYA like crazy. I'm starting up a new pebble tec pool, and PT calls for a 30-50ppm level for CYA and of course the pool store is pushing 60-80, right now we're sitting at 30. The only reason why I'm going to the pool store is for a paper trail in-case my surface fails.

Newton4mark said:
Thanks
Good to know that it is fixable

It's a shame pool stores do this just so they can make more sales

The higher the conditioner then more chlorine you need and the cycle continues

As so it would seem


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