New Liner not "clocking" and it's crooked maybe?

[Piteasee]

Hi there,
New member here; thanks for all the info I've read so far.
We have a 20+ year, 15x30, above ground pool.
Purchased new j-line beaded (I think that's what it's called) liner. Correct size for sure as we have the original pool book.

Cleaned up the floor and coved edges, and put down the new liner. Not sure if the liner is centered or not. Already put in 2" water with vacuum to suck the air off the walls, removed the wrinkles and the liner still looked twisted. That was last weekend.

Removed the water and tried again yesterday to center liner. Started with hanging the two long ends (north and south), then hung 2' on the east and west sides, then a little NE, NW, SE, SW.

Will post pics so you can see how it's not all hung yet. You can also see how the liner appears to swoop to one side.

Starting to have the same problem as last weekend. It looks twisted.

Liner tight in one corner, loose in another, and it doesn't look like it is clocked (local pool guy told me the term for centering an oval liner is "clocking" but I've only seen that term used once in about 70 threads I've read on this issue -- but I like the term; it makes sense).

When this happened last weekend, we shifted the j-line, but it didn't solve the problem.

With no points of reference on the liner to the middle of the four sides, how am I going to be sure this is centered before we start again?

Thanks for your help and suggestions,
Piteasee in Ottawa, Canada

 

[Newdude]

Welcome Piteasee !!!

I have no idea. I also really like the term clocking, whether or not it's 'proper'

Have a free bump to the top of the list.

 

[Piteasee]

Welcome Piteasee !!!

I have no idea. I also really like the term clocking, whether or not it's 'proper'

Have a free bump to the top of the list.

View attachment 436124

Thanks NewDude. I'm in the pool now. Shopvac on, garden hose on. I'm walking around trying to push wrinkles up the wall.

There's about 1½" of water in it and 90 minutes of daylight left.

Tomorrow will be a l o n g day

 

[Mdragger88]

You could attempt to measure & find your centers then make some marks. Can u get a pic of the whole thing? Also, let the cove be your guide. The bottom seam that goes around the entire pool should be equal distance from the wall all the way around the pool.

 

[Piteasee]

You could attempt to measure & find your centers then make some marks. Can u get a pic of the whole thing?

Thanks Mdragger88, we did try that this time. It's a lot better than attempt #1 on the weekend, but now I'm starting to think it's just a) us, b) the 20+ year old oval is maybe not so oval any more or c) the liner wasn't perfect. Likely it's us, we really don't know what we are doing. Except for reading maybe 70 threads and watching 100 hours of YouTube videos, this is pretty new to us.

Thanks for checking in

 

[duraleigh]

I am no help at all other than to offer encouragement. Your liner appears to have very few reference marks to guide you to hang it straight so that may be adding to your issue.

 

[Piteasee]

I am no help at all other than to offer encouragement. Your liner appears to have very few reference marks to guide you to hang it straight so that may be adding to your issue.

Thanks Duraleigh for the encouragement

Here is my update from the last 40 minutes...

Vacuum and water are definitely contributing to a smoother liner, but still with some excess on the NE wall and the SW wall.

My new concern is that the SE wall has a fair bit of space between it and the liner. Now, it is the furthest away from the vacuum (NW wall) but should I be concerned?

Video too big . Here's a photo. I can press it in about 2½".

I'm going to try to attach a video. I'm scared of what you experts are going to tell me, but here goes.

 

[Mdragger88]

It looks way better now than the 1st pic.

 

[Piteasee]

It looks way better now than the 1st pic.

Thank you. We shall see what today brings

 

[cj133]

On an oval pool you start at the corners, meaning if the long ends are 6 and 12 oclock, you start at 7 and 1, and then 5 and 11. You then pull the rest onto the pool.
Making sure the seams are straight and the liner is clocked correctly to begin with is extremely important.

The two pools I've done using a "40 gauge" aka 19-20mil liner it was extremely difficult to get the liner to stretch and fit the pool.


Your last pictures look fairly decent.

 

[Piteasee]

On an oval pool you start at the corners, meaning if the long ends are 6 and 12 oclock, you start at 7 and 1, and then 5 and 11. You then pull the rest onto the pool.
Making sure the seams are straight and the liner is clocked correctly to begin with is extremely important.

The two pools I've done using a "40 gauge" aka 19-20mil liner it was extremely difficult to get the liner to stretch and fit the pool.


Your last pictures look fairly decent.

Thank you cj133... Mostly for the comment on how it's looking, because unfortunately, we were told to start at 6 and 12, then 3 and 9, and then where you said to start, 7 and 1, and 5 and 11. The whole clocking term is starting to make more sense to me now.

I wonder is anyone else can comment on this? It would be useful for others in the "clocking" stage of changing a pool liner to know if one should start at the top and bottom of the clock, ie. the long ends, or as ch133 recommends, 7 and 1, etc. I was also told to start on the "cold, long, side" meaning to start hanging on the longest side that is not in the sun, if such a side exists . We chose 6 and 12, then 3 and 9.

so much to learn...
thanks again cj133 for your input.

Update for this morning... Hose is on, vacuum is on. I'm going in every 20 minutes to walk around.

It was suggested to me today to leave the wrinkles on the side of the pool at the bottom rather than push them up the wall as esthetically they will look better and it's unlikely they will all disappear during the filing.

Here are some pictures...
Wrinkles are in two, opposite corners 1 o'clock and 7 o'clock

It's a beautiful day in Ottawa Ontario Canada

 

[cj133]

Thank you cj133... Mostly for the comment on how it's looking, because unfortunately, we were told to start at 6 and 12, then 3 and 9, and then where you said to start, 7 and 1, and 5 and 11. The whole clocking term is starting to make more sense to me now.

I wonder is anyone else can comment on this? It would be useful for others in the "clocking" stage of changing a pool liner to know if one should start at the top and bottom of the clock, ie. the long ends, or as ch133 recommends, 7 and 1, etc. I was also told to start on the "cold, long, side" meaning to start hanging on the longest side that is not in the sun, if such a side exists . We chose 6 and 12, then 3 and 9.

so much to learn...
thanks again cj133 for your input.

Update for this morning... Hose is on, vacuum is on. I'm going in every 20 minutes to walk around.

It was suggested to me today to leave the wrinkles on the side of the pool at the bottom rather than push them up the wall as esthetically they will look better and it's unlikely they will all disappear during the filing.

Here are some pictures...
Wrinkles are in two, opposite corners 1 o'clock and 7 o'clock

It's a beautiful day in Ottawa Ontario Canada

I'm sure it depends on the liner brand, but the two we did which were the same brand and pattern had seams along the bottom sides so you could eye them up vs the sides of the oval. And then the whole diagonal corner to corner thing.

I think liners are a pain in the butt for everyone that does them. I'm sure guys that do them all the time get better at it, but I don't think they have fun doing it.

I would try to get wrinkles out of the floor the best you can as those you'll feel forever, and they collect dirt etc. But it'll be what it'll be. I don't think most people ever get them perfect. Mine came out good, but certainly not perfect.

 

[koffey]

My oval has wrinkles on the floor and in the corners. No matter how hard I tried last year and this year, just cannot get them out. Almost always in the same spot so I think it just the nature of the oval pool....? Still I think you're doing a great job.

 

[Piteasee]

I'm sure it depends on the liner brand, but the two we did which were the same brand and pattern had seams along the bottom sides so you could eye them up vs the sides of the oval. And then the whole diagonal corner to corner thing.

I think liners are a pain in the butt for everyone that does them. I'm sure guys that do them all the time get better at it, but I don't think they have fun doing it.

I would try to get wrinkles out of the floor the best you can as those you'll feel forever, and they collect dirt etc. But it'll be what it'll be. I don't think most people ever get them perfect. Mine came out good, but certainly not perfect.

Thanks cj133. I totally agree - we have no wrinkles in the bottom, just some ripples which I've worked most out with a rolling pin.

The wrinkles at the bottom of the wall, above the cove, will just have to stay. I've determined the bow in our walls is mostly to blame. The small wrinkles line up with them (see pic below).

I'm hoping the bigger wrinkle at 7pm will not be too obvious once covered in water.

 

[Piteasee]

My oval has wrinkles on the floor and in the corners. No matter how hard I tried last year and this year, just cannot get them out. Almost always in the same spot so I think it just the nature of the oval pool....? Still I think you're doing a great job.

Thank you Koffey for the positive feedback. There is no turning back for us now. We are almost 5" of water in.

Please send positive vibes my way!

 

[Mdragger88]

Pushing the wrinkles/ excess up the wall really won’t help unless u have an overlap liner- the excess liner doesn’t have anywhere to go. Getting the air out of them will help them look less noticeable though.
W/ a beaded liner The whole thing is like the world’s worst fitted sheet
All things considered, I think u have it looking great
A soft shop broom may help massage some of the wrinkles. I wish my liner looked 1/2 as great as yours!
As the pool fills with the weight of the water the sand will compress & i bet those wrinkles will be a thing of the past.
That said - only fill when the sun is shining. Turn the water off at dusk. You want the vinyl good & stretchy while filling.

 

[Piteasee]

Pushing the wrinkles/ excess up the wall really won’t help unless u have an overlap liner- the excess liner doesn’t have anywhere to go. Getting the air out of them will help them look less noticeable though.
W/ a beaded liner The whole thing is like the world’s worst fitted sheet
All things considered, I think u have it looking great
A soft shop broom may help massage some of the wrinkles. I wish my liner looked 1/2 as great as yours!
As the pool fills with the weight of the water the sand will compress & i bet those wrinkles will be a thing of the past.
That said - only fill when the sun is shining. Turn the water off at dusk. You want the vinyl good & stretchy while filling.

Thanks Mdragger88. You made me feel better about this whole process. Sun is shining brightly in Ottawa Ontario Canada so we will keep going. My neighbour says she doesn't mind the sound of the shop vac (I don't even hear it anymore )

I hear what you are saying about the liner having no where to go if we push it up, but I'm wondering if the weight of the water will push the liner towards the wall in the area that it isn't touching yet and offer an alternative place for the liner to go?

I'm going to post a pic. See the excess at the bottom? As the water rises, the fold is moving up. There is air between the wall and the liner, should I let it climb with the water level to see if it fills in some of the slack, or should I push it down while I still can?

Thanks for any advice and warm, fuzzy thoughts

 

[Mdragger88]

The water weight will push the liner into any void that exists. If there’s room behind that u can try to guide the liner to that area but the weight of the water may just do it for u.

 

[Piteasee]

The water weight will push the liner into any void that exists. If there’s room behind that u can try to guide the liner to that area but the weight of the water may just do it for u.

That is very encouraging Mdragger88. Thank you. I'll keep you posted. Five hours till sunset. I'm pretty happy, all things considered.

Two pics attached

 

[koffey]

looks great! guess i get more sun in toronto lol