The Neptune NPTQ270 pump motor claims to work "with a variety of external controllers" over RS485/modbus. Does anyone have success controlling them with Aqualink? I have the relay input controls (for manual override) working to select 4 different speeds, but I'd really like Aqualink to control the pump as well.
Neptune NPTQ270 controlled via Jandy Aqualink RS485/modbus
- Thread starter mattorola7
- Start date
- Jun 7, 2017
- 9,967
- Pool Size
- 29000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Jandy Aquapure 1400
Plug it in and find out. There are only 3 different pumps you can select. Only 1 if it mimics Jandy.
@PoolGate I did just try to connect it and it doesn't seem to matter whether I configure it as "ePump" or "Intelliflo" with Aqualink - it doesn't respond yet. I just tried setting the NodeID to 96 (0x60 in Hex format) which is exactly the same as what I believe Jandy pumps are by default. No dice. I also reached out to Neptune support and am quite disappointed thus far with their knowledge of their own products. They sent me the attached instructions which basically don't reveal much more than the installation manual did. If they market this pump as "compatible with external systems", that certainly doesn't seem to be the case yet. I'm pushing back on the sales engineer to see if he will send me the AT command reference for commands over modbus. Btw, I have had success in another post with mating a Century EVQ225 to Aqualink (configuring it as ePump in Aqualink). I'm kind of running a comparison since my pool requires a total of 3 pumps. Initially, Neptune's ECM motor appeared to be stout and certainly looked good on paper, so I had high hopes for them over Century's slightly more economical looking AC induction motor. But it may be Century for the win based on documentation and overall ease of implementation. The Century motor also seems far quieter than the Neptune pump motor. I'm not impressed with the Neptune pumps yet, even though I had high hopes for them.
MSchutzer
Silver Supporter
Modbus is a specific protocol and this is also used as the native command protocol on the Century Vgreen motors. While Modbus is the protocol there are certain commands such as "set demand (speed)" "go", "stop",etc. that pass information from the control system to the motor. That document you attached doesn't define what those commands are.
In any case the Aqualink system uses a Jandy proprietary protocol with their own set of commands that correspond to the same "set demand", "go" and "stop" commands and those commands are NOT compatible with Modbus protocol.
I found out about this when messing with my Vgreen165 motor as it also doesn't work with the Aqualink system. On that particular motor it is possible to execute some Modbus commands to change the motor's configuration so that it will also support the Jandy protocol and commands.
But RS485 native Modbus control will not work with the Jandy Aqualink system.
In any case the Aqualink system uses a Jandy proprietary protocol with their own set of commands that correspond to the same "set demand", "go" and "stop" commands and those commands are NOT compatible with Modbus protocol.
I found out about this when messing with my Vgreen165 motor as it also doesn't work with the Aqualink system. On that particular motor it is possible to execute some Modbus commands to change the motor's configuration so that it will also support the Jandy protocol and commands.
But RS485 native Modbus control will not work with the Jandy Aqualink system.
@MSchutzer I did finally get the support engineer to send a Modbus command register reference document. I've attached it. I am not as schooled as you on modbus but your assessment sounds accurate in that there is no way this motor will be controlled by Aqualink. I've been in the sofware business for 25 years, and it is such a shame that the pool industry has yet to be disrupted yet. It is definitely ripe, especially with the IOT revolution well underway. I'm a big fan of open source software, and the pool industry is still very proprietary. If only there was a dongle with middleware that could bridge communications between all of these devices and allow more interoperability.
MSchutzer
Silver Supporter
Interestingly enough the latest Century EVO motors have firmware that is equipped with what they are marketing as "Century Connect", the ability to automatically talk to Hayward, Pentair, and Jandy automation systems via the RS485 link. I don't know about the Hayward, or Pentair systems, but in a post a couple of weeks ago the poster was able to get the EVO to work with an Aqualink system. The poster stated the motor showed up as a Jandy Epump and worked out of the box when he select the Epump choice in the Aqualink configuration setup.
So it sounds like Century is trying to address the automation market with their replacement motors now. But I should point out that for the first two or three years of marketing the Vgreen and EVO motors they didn't officially support anything but their native Modbus protocol which only worked with their own proprietary Vlink controller.
So it sounds like Century is trying to address the automation market with their replacement motors now. But I should point out that for the first two or three years of marketing the Vgreen and EVO motors they didn't officially support anything but their native Modbus protocol which only worked with their own proprietary Vlink controller.
@MSchutzer that was my post actually that you are referring to. I've been running both brands of motors head to head in a trial. I also think I will likely abandon Aqualink in the near future and roll the NodeJS-PoolController project from Github. I can envision an open source/open hardware solution for pool control in the near future, one that will actually integrate with all the popular home automation software. Maybe it doesn't go beyond the DIY community for a while, or maybe it does. I know the pool service industry sticks with the big brands now, but a disruption is on the horizon.
Did you ever get the Nidec Neptune to work with your Jandy Aqualink system? I have a Jandy 2.7 hp variable speed pump and the motor is making some horrible noises and is on it's last leg. A replacement pump is anywhere between $1500 - $2000 so I'm looking for replacement motors. It looks like the one that would definitely work is the Century ECM27SQU but that's is no longer being produced and the few people that still have stock are selling it for close to $1500. The only only option I see is the Nidec Neptune NPTQ270 which may or may not work with my Jandy Automation. Any suggestions on other motors that would interface with the Jandy Aqualink? Any help is appreciated. Thanks!
I ended up returning the Nideq Neptune motor. In fact, it was shipped with damage and that didn't help my situation either. Having purchased both Century and Nideq, I ran side by side comparisons. I never did get the Nideq to be controlled by the Jandy Aqualink either. I really liked the quality of the Century motors much better, especially the ECM design. Do you really need the full 2.7HP? I dropped from the 3HP motor and pump I had previously, down to a 2.25HP Century (EVQ225) motor and purchased a replacement wet end with a 2.25HP impeller. I have had no issues with flow through my Jandy DEL60 filter.
Never really thought about downsizing. If anything I was thinking of going up to the 3.45 hp. Although, this is my second pool pump. My first was a Jandy E-Pump that was 2 HP and worked fine. Then it was replaced with the 2.7 hp about 5-6 years ago after a lightening strike so it's possible a 2.25 hp unit might work. Is there a reason I can't use the impeller I already have?
When you look at an impeller from the edge, you can see the size of the "paddles". The wider the paddle, the more force it takes to move the water. So you do need to have the impeller properly sized with the HP capability of the motor. If your impeller is rated for 3HP, and you mate it with a 2HP motor, the motor could overheat. And if you mate a 2HP impeller with a 3HP motor, I believe it will waste energy or at least not be as efficient and you won't achieve the "sweet spot" for flow and energy efficiency. Btw, I built my pumps (my pool requires 3 pumps) from scratch using 3 wet end replacements for $250 each on Amazon (various HP options for the impeller are available in the kit), and then mated them with 3 Century EVQ225 motors ($539 each). The wet end replacements are the same footprint of the Pentair pumps. I saved $2400 vs buying new 3 Pentair pumps.
I appreciate all your information. I'll have to look into that! Thankfully my pump isn't dead yet so I still have a bit of time to research. 
Just to be clear, RS485 is the physical (hardware) serial communication link. MODBUS is the (software) communication format of commands. These are simply memory locations (addresses) in Hexadecimal. All can be read. Some can be written. ANYTHING that uses modbus will work in this very same way. However, different products will not necessarily use the same organization of memory addresses for the similar function.
So, although it may not be so readily apparent, you should be able to connect a modbus compatible device to a modbus controller. If your controller’s embedded processor is configurable (Hex address for the given command) then you should be able to make it work. But you would need the programming manual (not the high-level owner’s manual). And, without a programming interface, this becomes impossible. A PC might be able to interface to the controller, but the companies keep these close to the chest. You would simply hope for a built-in low-level interface, which likely needs a bypass to access…
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